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Car Forum / Honda Cars / December 2006"Honda planned its truck well"
Honda planned its truck well Honda Motor Co.'s modus operandi has been to analyze trends and situations, and then to come up with a better idea followed by an exemplary execution of that idea, or collection of ideas, prior to instituting production of a new vehicle. at http://www.washtimes.com/autoweekend/20061123-121522-2136r.htm > Honda planned its truck well > Honda Motor Co.'s modus operandi has been to analyze trends and > situations, and then to come up with a better idea followed by an > exemplary execution of that idea, or collection of ideas, prior to > instituting production of a new vehicle. > at http://www.washtimes.com/autoweekend/20061123-121522-2136r.htm Yes, agreed, Honda planned it well. EXCEPT, they overlooked one major detail: Design. The Ridgeline is ugly! Even the article nailed it -- "Japanese Avalanche" -- and, IMO, that's not a compliment! (IMO, the Chevy Avalanche is only slightly less ugly [couldn't use "slightly _prettier_ than"] than the Pontiac Aztec. And this critique is coming from someone who recently purchased a you-either-love-it-or-hate Honda Element. Patrick '06 Element EX-P > Yes, agreed, Honda planned it well. EXCEPT, they overlooked one major > detail: Design. The Ridgeline is ugly! Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I personally think it looks better than any Dodge or Ford truck. > Yes, agreed, Honda planned it well. EXCEPT, they overlooked one major > detail: Design. The Ridgeline is ugly! Even the article nailed it -- > "Japanese Avalanche" -- and, IMO, that's not a compliment! (IMO, the > Chevy Avalanche is only slightly less ugly [couldn't use "slightly > _prettier_ than"] than the Pontiac Aztec. Agreed. I can probably name a dozen folks around here who swear they would've bought the Ridgeline if it weren't so darn, uh, unusual-looking. A few subtle design changes and Honda could've sold a helluva lot more of these Ridgelines, methinks. an 03 Element owner probably going to be an 07 Ridgline or lesser chance an 07 FJ >> Honda planned its truck well >> Honda Motor Co.'s modus operandi has been to analyze trends and [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Patrick > '06 Element EX-P I think the thing looks terrible. I love my honda but that dosn't mean I have to be a die hard brand loyalist. Not only that but its based on a mini van platform. I would certainly not go to honda for a pickup. Maybe it drives better on a road than many of the other trucks but I highly doubt that it will command the respect in 10 years that a Ford/Dodge/Chevy/Toyota(maybe even in 15 years) will. I totally agree with the ugly japanese avalanche comment.  SignatureBlackGT2000 http://www.automotiveforums.com > I think the thing looks terrible. I love my honda but that dosn't mean > I have to be a die hard brand loyalist. Not only that but its based on [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Ford/Dodge/Chevy/Toyota(maybe even in 15 years) will. I totally agree > with the ugly japanese avalanche comment. Mini-van platform....I don't think so. "Contrary to other pickup trucks, the Ridgeline has a "closed box unit body frame" that combines unit-body construction (for better quietness, handling and ride) with a separate "ladder" frame that allows the truck to tow up to 5,000 pounds. Total vehicle payload capacity is 1,550 pounds. Tough enough? The bending rigidity of the Ridgeline's structure claims to be more than 2.5 times greater than the best body-on-frame competitor, and 20 times stiffer in rear torsion. Stiff unit-body construction also allows for narrow body panel gaps of only 3 to 4 millimeters, for better wind noise control, among other virtues. The Ridgeline shares some if its basic DNA with Honda's other large utility vehicles, the Pilot, Odyssey and Acura MDX, all built on its "Global Light Truck" platform. That said, the engineers modified 93 percent of the basic components, and gave the Ridgeline a 95 percent exclusive interior and its very own body panels." > Mini-van platform....I don't think so. Yep. Based on the same global platform that gives us the Accord, the Pilot/MDX, and the Odyssey minivan. When it starts out life like that, there's not much you can do to overcome the necessary compromises that leave it NOT a truck in the same mold as a Ford F150, for example. Too many things that make that platform suitable for an Accord can't be overcome to make a real truck. > > Mini-van platform....I don't think so. > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Too many things that make that platform suitable for an Accord can't be > overcome to make a real truck. The chassis is 90% exclusive, how does that equate to it being suitable for an Accord? I wasn't aware that an Accord had a fully boxed ladder frame under it. Well you said it yourself. I am not saying it isn't a quality truck, Honda is pretty synonymous with quality. What I am saying is that it looks terrible. Its got a transversely mounted V6. The tow ratings are only very impressive when it is factored in that its a V6. Maybe there aren't any other V6 trucks that have tow ratings like that, but people who tow rarely look to a V6 (let alone a V6 powered truck with a price tag like the Ridgeline). SignatureBlackGT2000 http://www.automotiveforums.com > Honda planned its truck well snip well, see http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=629098 Ridgeline, Pilot and Element sales for October 2006 were over 20% lower than Oct. 2005. A few months more of that and I suspect we'll see some re-thinking of the whole trucklet thing. Not sure I read the same chart the same way! Sales of the Ridgeline October 2006 (42,038)-October 2005 (30,761) an increase of 36.7%. >> Honda planned its truck well > snip [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > than Oct. 2005. A few months more of that and I suspect we'll see some > re-thinking of the whole trucklet thing. > Not sure I read the same chart the same way! > > Sales of the Ridgeline October 2006 (42,038)-October 2005 (30,761) an > increase of 36.7%. I was comparing Oct 2006 vs Oct 2005 sales. You are looking at year to date totals (Jan - Oct). Ridgeline wasn't available early in 2005. > > snip > > > > well, see http://www.vtec.net/news/news-item?news_item_id=629098 > > Ridgeline, Pilot and Element sales for October 2006 were over 20% lower > > than Oct. 2005. A few months more of that and I suspect we'll see some > > re-thinking of the whole trucklet thing. I do believe the Ridgeline did appear right after the Super Bowl in 2005 (great commercials by the way). Also, notice on the chart, Honda import truck sales October 2005-10,850 - October 2006 20,413, an increase of 95.7% (again, according the Honda sales chart. >> Not sure I read the same chart the same way! >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >> > than Oct. 2005. A few months more of that and I suspect we'll see some >> > re-thinking of the whole trucklet thing. >I do believe the Ridgeline did appear right after the Super Bowl in 2005 >(great commercials by the way). > >Also, notice on the chart, Honda import truck sales October 2005-10,850 - >October 2006 20,413, an increase of 95.7% (again, according the Honda sales >chart. The only import truck is the CRV. The newly redesigned model is selling very well indeed. >>> Not sure I read the same chart the same way! >>> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >>> > than Oct. 2005. A few months more of that and I suspect we'll see some >>> > re-thinking of the whole trucklet thing. > I do believe the Ridgeline did appear right after the Super Bowl in 2005 > (great commercials by the way). Not in substantial numbers. > Also, notice on the chart, ... blah, blah blah... November 2006 results show Ridgeline sales off 33% compared with last November. Both Element and Pilot are off by 20%. The newly redesigned to-be-more-like-a-car CRV is doing very well, sales up 50% compared with last November. Honda's truck plans and fantasy re. competing with Toyota nearly sunk the company. The quicker they get out from under the Ridgeline and on top of the next Prelude the better. >> I do believe the Ridgeline did appear right after the Super Bowl in 2005 >> (great commercials by the way). [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > the company. The quicker they get out from under the Ridgeline and on > top of the next Prelude the better. and crx... 90 percent exclusive is hard to prove. All you have to do is change a couple of things and than it qualifies as a different part. The ladder frame is the only thing that even remotely makes it qualify as a truck. SignatureBlackGT2000 http://www.automotiveforums.com > 90 percent exclusive is hard to prove. Then maybe they should be sued for false advertising. > All you have to do is change a > couple of things and than it qualifies as a different part. The ladder > frame is the only thing that even remotely makes it qualify as a truck. In a world where the majority of trucks sold never even come close to being used as intended, does it really matter? Hmmm but doesn't changing something make it a "different" part........................thus exclusive.... But that isn't what can be said for a good thing down the road. CRV and Element owners can swap a lot of parts making most parts very available. > 90 percent exclusive is hard to prove. All you have to do is change a > couple of things and than it qualifies as a different part. The ladder > frame is the only thing that even remotely makes it qualify as a truck. All I am saying is that under all the sheet metal and interior, it has a hell of a lot in common with an oddysey. I am sure what ever loose estimation of percentage of different parts was calculated, a lot can be chalked up to the grill, body panels, seats, radio, steering wheel.... the list would go on and on. SignatureBlackGT2000 http://www.automotiveforums.com It certainly keeps costs down to have commonality of parts. However, the frame for the Ridgeline did not come from an existing vehicle...it was engineered specifically for this truck. The 2005 Odyssey also received a newly designed and engineered frame on a similar platform That being said, this truck was never designed to be a heavy duty pickup, rather it was designed to have a nice comfortable ride and handle the toys and tools most homeowners need a pickup for. > All I am saying is that under all the sheet metal and interior, it has a > hell of a lot in common with an oddysey. I am sure what ever loose > estimation of percentage of different parts was calculated, a lot can > be chalked up to the grill, body panels, seats, radio, steering > wheel.... the list would go on and on. > It certainly keeps costs down to have commonality of parts. However, the > frame for the Ridgeline did not come from an existing vehicle...it was > engineered specifically for this truck. The Ridgeline is based on Honda's global large car platform, which was created for the Accord and which also spawned the Pilot/MDX and the Odyssey (not to mention the Acura TL). There are by necessity compromises required when one chooses to engineer like that. By definition, one cannot get the same results as compared to sitting down with a clean sheet of paper to design a pure truck. I won't disagree with your comments about the origin of the Pilot/Odyssey, but that has changed and the Odyssey and Ridgeline are now based on the Honda Global Light Truck Platform, designed in 2005, not the large car platform. Taken from http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0KJI/is_4_117/ai_n13651500 : "In fact, Honda had to re-design so much of its global light truck platform to accommodate the requirements of a pickup that the Ridgeline's body ended up with the mixed blessing of 93% exclusive parts. Likewise, the chassis is 69% exclusive and features independent suspension all around (a first for a pickup), and front and rear subframes isolated by rubber mounts." >> It certainly keeps costs down to have commonality of parts. However, the >> frame for the Ridgeline did not come from an existing vehicle...it was [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > like that. By definition, one cannot get the same results as compared > to sitting down with a clean sheet of paper to design a pure truck. |
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