Car Forum / Honda Cars / January 2007
Honda FIT Sport with paddle shifters
|
|
Thread rating:  |
alfred - 08 Jan 2007 04:06 GMT Hello,
Does anyone have any experience with the Honda FIT Paddle shifters on the Sport? I was just wondering if they really shift like a semi automatic and let you bring the car up to a high rpm in each gear before shifting or is it more a gimick?
Also what is the basic driveability and performance with that car compared to a Civic? The dealers in my area never seem to have one in stock so I can't seem to find any here. I've seen them on the road and they look narrower and smaller than the Civic. I'm just wondering about comfort and driveability and handling etc?
If I was going to get one it would be the FIT Sport with auto, which I think would be about $16,400.00. Or for $3,000.00 more I could get a Civic EX with auto. I am also wondering if the FIT Sport is worth it for $3,000.00 less in terms of value for what you get in a FIT Sport Auto vs. what you get in the Civic EX Auto.
I know that mileage is almost identical...
Thanks,
Al
jim beam - 08 Jan 2007 04:10 GMT > Hello, > > Does anyone have any experience with the Honda FIT Paddle shifters on the > Sport? I was just wondering if they really shift like a semi automatic and > let you bring the car up to a high rpm in each gear before shifting or is it > more a gimick? in this instance, since the transmission is really a cvt, it's a gimmick. but it does give you convenient two-hands-on-the-wheel control if you want it.
> Also what is the basic driveability and performance with that car compared > to a Civic? The dealers in my area never seem to have one in stock so I > can't seem to find any here. I've seen them on the road and they look > narrower and smaller than the Civic. I'm just wondering about comfort and > driveability and handling etc? if you want real handling, you need a wishbone accord or a pre-2001 wishbone civic. or integra.
> If I was going to get one it would be the FIT Sport with auto, which I think > would be about $16,400.00. Or for $3,000.00 more I could get a Civic EX with [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Al jim beam - 08 Jan 2007 04:31 GMT >> Hello, >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > gimmick. but it does give you convenient two-hands-on-the-wheel control > if you want it. i take that back - it's a 5-speed conventional honda transmission! the fit was sold with a "7-speed" cvt transmission in other markets, but it seems that for the u.s. market, traditional transmission is the way...
>> Also what is the basic driveability and performance with that car >> compared to a Civic? The dealers in my area never seem to have one in [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >> >> Al TomP - 13 Jan 2007 15:22 GMT > >> Hello, > >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > fit was sold with a "7-speed" cvt transmission in other markets, but it > seems that for the u.s. market, traditional transmission is the way... Just so you know, there are no "speeds" in a Continuously Variable Transmission.
-- Tp,
-------- __o ----- -\<. -------- __o --- ( )/ ( ) ---- -\<. -------------------- ( )/ ( ) -----------------------------------------
No Lawsuit Ever Fixed A Moron...
jim beam - 13 Jan 2007 18:21 GMT >>>> Hello, >>>> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Just so you know, there are no "speeds" in a Continuously Variable > Transmission. i know - that's why it's in quotes. the transmission control system is however programmed to give the impression of seven discrete ratios - somewhat stupid imo.
TomP - 14 Jan 2007 15:47 GMT > the transmission control system is > however programmed to give the impression of seven discrete ratios -
> somewhat stupid imo. I agree IMO Honda spent way too much time trying to mask the characteristics of the CVT trans. Rather they should have touted goodness of the design (such as it is) and made it known that "this" is how they work and it's normal.
-- Tp,
-------- __o ----- -\<. -------- __o --- ( )/ ( ) ---- -\<. -------------------- ( )/ ( ) -----------------------------------------
No Lawsuit Ever Fixed A Moron...
jim beam - 14 Jan 2007 16:10 GMT >> the transmission control system is >> however programmed to give the impression of seven discrete ratios - [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > the CVT trans. Rather they should have touted goodness of the design (such as > it is) and made it known that "this" is how they work and it's normal. couldn't agree more. trouble is, honda usa is infected with "detroit marketing syndrome", hence red rear turn signals, ridgeline, no prelude, no updated crx, rsx [integra successor] which is UTTER junk, no wagon accord [or civic for that matter], mcpherson strut suspension, anti-hatchback culture, etc. time was, honda used to lead, not follow. now, not only do they follow, they're following the worst possible examples.
need more? there was never any real plan to import the fit, but it kinda-sorta turned into a necessity given that gas prices were high. now, they find themselves completely unable to satisfy demand it's such a success. honda usa marketing is /mind-blowingly/ out of touch.
</endrant>
Elmo P. Shagnasty - 14 Jan 2007 16:44 GMT > couldn't agree more. trouble is, honda usa is infected with "detroit > marketing syndrome", hence red rear turn signals, ridgeline, no prelude, [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > now, they find themselves completely unable to satisfy demand it's such > a success. honda usa marketing is /mind-blowingly/ out of touch. What a great quote: "American Honda Motor Manufacturing's marketing is MIND-BLOWINGLY out of touch." I will steal that, no question. It needs to be said early and often.
Remember the CRV? It first showed up at the Detroit show in January 1997. The story goes that Honda corporate came up with this car, and offered it to everyone. Japan was happy to take it, but American Honda declined.
Then the permance of the SUV craze became very apparent, and American Honda came back and said, "uh, guys, we'd like that car." But by then the corporate design was fairly well fixed and there was no accommodation for the American market and its regulations, let alone customer preferences and feature sets.
Therefore, there was a big delay while Honda sorted it all out. When it finally came to market, some big items were still awkward--the window switches on the dash, the rear door swinging open the wrong way for those of us who drive on the right side of the road, etc.
Now let's talk about American Honda and their beancounter engineering, where they stuck the actual engineers on the bench and let the beancounters make engineering decisions. V6 transmissions, anyone? In one fell swoop Honda managed to turn itself into Chrysler, and the only thing that saved them at the last minute was someone's decision to buy their way out of it. Unlike Chrysler (who denies any problems and tells the customer to go screw himself), Honda decided to commit what some shareholders would call coroporate hara-kiri and own up to the situation and issue the largest recall ever for these things.
They're still paying out goodwill money for transmission replacements, and will until the last of the early 04 Odysseys get turned into beaters and get put into the hands of people who would never know to ask a Honda dealer for assistance for the junk transmission.
American Honda spent at least 10 years dinging their reputation for all the reasons you outline, and more--all based on the fact that they let the beancounters run the system.
I did notice that the corporate CEO now is the brilliant engineer who, back in the very early 70s, invented CVCC which allowed Honda not to spend the money on catalytic converters while still achieving federal emissions regulations. This gives me great hope that engineering will reign again at Honda.
Also giving me great hope is what they did with the 06 Civic. It looks like it's an engineer's car, MUCH more so than any Civic in the previous 10 years.
And look what happened with the Accord. The 03 model comes out, and it LOOKS like a Buick. Blech. Then a couple years later the same people who let real engineers and designers loose on the Civic redesign, let similar designers loose on the mid-cycle re-do of the Accord. And in one fell swoop, by fixing the rear end, the Accord became a nice looking car.
And now the next gen Accord is going to look like what we've come to expect from Acura, and nothing like what we've come to expect for America's mainstream family car.
In fact, the fact that they showed the new Accord before it hit showrooms in the fall--which is unprecedented for Honda--tells me it's a new era at Honda.
Only Honda could slide to the Chrysler level, recognize their mistake, and manage to come back. That great feat alone should give one confidence.
But my fear is that these changes are DESPITE the American Honda marketing machine, not because of it. I think the marketing team still holds out for the Detroit syndrome, and could yet sabotage further Honda efforts to be what we all know they can be--makers of the greatest cars on the planet.
Honda, send out a press release that you've fired the entire marketing team and all your ad agencies who have produced the last 10 years of disasters, and have replaced them with people who know how to market your engineering prowess (instead of telling the engineers what to build) and turn that into 5% sales increases every month. That'll tell the world you're serious.
Kevin McMurtrie - 15 Jan 2007 07:21 GMT > > couldn't agree more. trouble is, honda usa is infected with "detroit > > marketing syndrome", hence red rear turn signals, ridgeline, no prelude, [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > MIND-BLOWINGLY out of touch." I will steal that, no question. It needs > to be said early and often. - snip -
The 05 Accord Hybrid in an example too. No colors outside, no colors inside, no manual transmission, insane understeer, 25 MPG, and the worst engineering I've seen outside of American cars. I was shocked when I bought the repair manual and read just how h4x0r this car is. Dealerships must work with Honda tech support over the phone while they fix HAHs.
My HAH is in the pre-arbitration negotiation phase of being lemon lawed. Several problems have been fixed with the engine but none solved its rough idle or blinking engine light at full throttle. I can't sell the car as it is and I'm really scared about repair costs when the warranty ends. I bought a Honda to avoid disasters like this.
I miss my 97 Civic HX. It was a pleasure to drive and the engineering was superb. Technology was used to make the car simpler and more reliable, not burdened in complexity.
Gordon McGrew - 08 Jan 2007 05:14 GMT >> Hello, >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >gimmick. but it does give you convenient two-hands-on-the-wheel control >if you want it. Actually it is a 5-speed AT. They wouldn't have much purpose if they didn't let you take it up to redline before shifting.
http://automobiles.honda.com/models/engineering_overview.asp?ModelName=Fit
Consumer reports tested the base Fit with the same AT but no paddles. It was 2.5 sec slower to 60 (12.4 vs. 9.9) and got 2 less mpg than the manual. I doubt it is any faster with the paddles but it might be more fun to drive than the regular AT.
>> Also what is the basic driveability and performance with that car compared >> to a Civic? The dealers in my area never seem to have one in stock so I [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >if you want real handling, you need a wishbone accord or a pre-2001 >wishbone civic. or integra. The Civic Si might not be bad. The Fit Sport does handle well also but the Civic will be faster and more civilized. The Fit is the best of all the new small cars.
>> If I was going to get one it would be the FIT Sport with auto, which I think >> would be about $16,400.00. Or for $3,000.00 more I could get a Civic EX with [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> >> I know that mileage is almost identical... Is the $3K the difference in street price or MSRP. The Fit is apparently in such short supply that you won't be able to deal on them like you could on a Civic. It the MSRP is $3K higher, I bet you could get the Civic for about $1000 more than you would pay for the FIT. If that is the case I would say it is a no-brainer to get the Civic.
Kevin McMurtrie - 08 Jan 2007 04:41 GMT > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Al The paddles will let you shift manually as long as you stay within an RPM range. You still have all of the inefficiencies of an automatic transmission. Honda's more complex transmissions seem to get totally confused by changes in throttle. At least you can skip one or two seconds of the transmission being stupefied when you step on the gas.
German cars are starting to come out with a "DSG" transmission. It's a hybrid of automatic and manual transmission design with stunning performance. There's no mushiness from a torque converter and power efficiency beats a manual.
alfred - 12 Jan 2007 23:44 GMT Okay thanks everyone. I guess at this point getting a Civic is a better choice. I just wanted something more fun to drive without actually getting a manual transmission. I wish the accord or civic would come out with a sequential sport shifter. Even hyundai's have that!
Has anyone tried the Accord 4 cyl Manual and compared it to a Civic Manual? I was wondering what the differences are in 0-60 and control?
Thanks, Al
>> Hello, >> [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > performance. There's no mushiness from a torque converter and power > efficiency beats a manual.
|
|
|