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Car Forum / Honda Cars / October 2007Where to buy jet fuel?
where? > where? Let's narrow it down a bit: What continent are you on? > > where? > > Let's narrow it down a bit: > > What continent are you on? I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. >> > where? >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. Jet fuel is essentially kerosene. On Feb 18, 10:45 am, Gordon McGrew <gRmEcMgOrV...@mindspring.com> wrote: > >> > where? > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Jet fuel is essentially kerosene. Jet A works great in a kerosene heater, not that I would ever drain the fuel truck sumps into my kerosene can. ;) > > >I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. > > > Jet fuel is essentially kerosene. > > Jet A works great in a kerosene heater, not that I would ever drain > the fuel truck sumps into my kerosene can. ;) I knew it's kerosene, just don't know what the original poster's intentions are. Isn't Jet A up to $4 a gallon or so? You'd have to be getting it "free" to justify using it for heat. On Feb 18, 1:49 pm, jmat...@attglobal.net wrote: > > > >I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Isn't Jet A up to $4 a gallon or so? You'd have to be getting it > "free" to justify using it for heat. $3.75 where I'm at. I have to drain the sumps daily, back in the old days we just drained it onto the gravel lot, now we have to capture it so I take it home every night and heat my garage (as well as my 20000 btu heater will do). it is not jet fuel (kerosene) it is aviation fuel high octaine unleaded gas i usto use it in my pulling truck 110-120 octaine truck ran great now you cant get it any more you hafto have pilot license and they only pump it into planes no more empty cans they said too much liability > it is not jet fuel (kerosene) it is aviation fuel high octaine > unleaded gas i usto use it in my pulling truck 110-120 octaine truck > ran great now you cant get it any more you hafto have pilot license > and they only pump it into planes no more empty cans they said too > much liability 110-120? Airport I worked at only had 103. >>it is not jet fuel (kerosene) it is aviation fuel high octaine >>unleaded gas i usto use it in my pulling truck 110-120 octaine truck [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Airport I worked at only had 103. "Green" avgas is 100-130, fairly common. "Purple" avgas is 115-145, in very limited distribution for decades, usually only found on MIL fields. > "Green" avgas is 100-130, fairly common. > > "Purple" avgas is 115-145, in very limited distribution for decades, > usually only found on MIL fields. Pretty much the *only* piston aviation fuel available in the last decade in the United States has been blue 100LL. The LL is for 'low lead' and is only considered low lead in relation to the earlier aviation fuels. When I started flying in the early '90s, 80 octane aviation fuel was available but it is long since gone (and 80 octane was green). The U.S. Air Force hasn't had a piston powered plane in decades (True for the Army and Navy, AFAIK), so I doubt you would find 115-145 on any military field.  SignatureFrank Stutzman Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl" Boise, ID >>"Green" avgas is 100-130, fairly common. >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > the Army and Navy, AFAIK), so I doubt you would find 115-145 on any > military field. You'll find "purple" 115-145 where you find warbirds. 80/87 octane is "red". See: http://www.aviationfuel.org/avgas/avgas_specs.asp and: http://cawg.cap.gov/html/operations/other/FLMHomeStudyCourseVer1.pdf > You'll find "purple" 115-145 where you find warbirds. Show me *any* active military base that has piston warbirds operating on a regular enough basis to warrent storing 115-145. BTW, the museums I have worked with (mostly Evergreen Aviation in McMinnville, OR and the Warhawk Museum in Nampa, ID), fly their warbirds on 100LL with a much reduced manifold pressure. 115-145 in sufficient quanities to fuel four Wright R-1820s (B-17) for any significant time is cost prohibitive. > 80/87 octane is "red". Oops, my mistake. I stand corrected. SignatureFrank Stutzman Bonanza N494B "Hula Girl" Boise, ID >>You'll find "purple" 115-145 where you find warbirds. > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > sufficient quanities to fuel four Wright R-1820s (B-17) for any > significant time is cost prohibitive. Numerous military and civil airports in North America, Caribbean, Central America and Europe carry NATO F-22 and EEFC "BA" spec gasolines (same as MIL-L-5572F "purple"). Reno/Stead, for testing and for the air races, among others. If it is 115/145 "racing gasoline" you want, Chevron, Valero, Sunoco, Union and VP produce it (or similar, as well as oxygenated fuels) and retail it by the jug and barrel. >>80/87 octane is "red". > > Oops, my mistake. I stand corrected. No problem. I should have also noted that the modern day "purple" is the 82 octane ultra low lead avgas. >>> > where? >>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Jet fuel is essentially kerosene. Correct..."aviation kerosene"... > I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. So my car can rans like that car in Datonya. >> I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. > > So my car can rans like that car in Datonya. try it and see what happens - i don't think you'll be impressed with the results. and make sure you know where the drain plug on the tank is - just a hint. >>> I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > results. and make sure you know where the drain plug on the tank is - > just a hint. I wonder if our daring OP is confusing Avgas with JP... SignatureTegger The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ >>>> I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. >>> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I wonder if our daring OP is confusing Avgas with JP... if he is, it's not necessarily his fault. the radio pundits were all using the words "jet fuel", even the alleged transgressor, when interviewed, called it "jet fuel". that's why i think it's media hype. no professional driver that knows a wheel from a wrench would call avgas "jet fuel". "jet fuel" is great for sound bites though. >>>>> I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. >>>> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > no professional driver that knows a wheel from a wrench would call >avgas "jet fuel". "jet fuel" is great for sound bites though. I wouldn't think Avgas would be better than what they are running in NASCAR. >>>>>> I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. >>>>> So my car can rans like that car in Datonya. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > I wouldn't think Avgas would be better than what they are running in > NASCAR. it is. >>>>>>> I just wanna know WHAT you want it for. >>>>>> So my car can rans like that car in Datonya. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >> > it is. and it's still not "jet fuel". > where? Try your nearest airport which services jet aircraft. If you don't mind my asking, what's the jet fuel for? On Feb 18, 2:36 am, Sparky Spartacus <Spa...@universalexports.org> wrote: > > where? > > Try your nearest airport which services jet aircraft. If you don't mind > my asking, what's the jet fuel for? He/she doean't want it for anything, their posting history explains it. Why is everyone thinking that he/she wants it for something. Look at the name that he/she used to post his question "a.s". Wajahat > On Feb 18, 2:36 am, Sparky Spartacus <Spa...@universalexports.org> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > He/she doean't want it for anything, their posting history explains it. >> where? > > Try your nearest airport which services jet aircraft. If you don't mind > my asking, what's the jet fuel for? it's just a "sheep herd" question. allegedly there's some nascar kerfuffle going on at the moment due to "illegal" use of "jet fuel" by one of the competitors. i personally think it much more likely to be a "made for media" story designed to stir general public attention [read: ANY EXPOSURE IS GOOD EXPOSURE] since "jet fuel" is kerosene, and not very friendly to piston engines. > >> where? > [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > ANY EXPOSURE IS GOOD EXPOSURE] since "jet fuel" is kerosene, and not > very friendly to piston engines. Just out of curiousity...why would it be illegal to use jet fuel in nascar? >>>>where? >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Just out of curiousity...why would it be illegal to use jet fuel in > nascar? Not "illegal", just against the rules. >> Just out of curiousity...why would it be illegal to use jet fuel in >> nascar? > > Not "illegal", just against the rules. Same thing. "Illegal" means "against the rules". SignatureTegger The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ >>>Just out of curiousity...why would it be illegal to use jet fuel in >>>nascar? >> >>Not "illegal", just against the rules. > > Same thing. "Illegal" means "against the rules". Well, literally, it means "against the law"... > iwhtcimtlfmwmaom...@yahoo.com wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Not "illegal", just against the rules.- Hide quoted text - I know...but why not just let people use whatever kind of fuel they want to? > - Show quoted text - On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: > I know...but why not just let people use whatever kind of fuel they > want to? NASCAR's goal is to make every car as equal as possible, and have the outcome of the races be based on the talent of the driver and crew... Not that it is always the case, but it is the intention... > On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Not that it is always the case, but it is the intention... I don't see what the big deal is...unless the jet fuel is dangerous. Everyone would just start using jet fuel. >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > I don't see what the big deal is...unless the jet fuel is dangerous. > Everyone would just start using jet fuel. Another motivation behind these kinds of rules is to keep the technology from running wild, to maximize the importance of driver skill and keep things interesting. Given then massive popularity of NASCAR here in the States, they may be on to something. (IIRC they don't even allow overhead-cam engines!) -- Mike Smith > iwhtcimtlfmwmaom...@yahoo.com wrote: > >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > States, they may be on to something. (IIRC they don't even allow > overhead-cam engines!) "Professional" wrestling is popular in the US too, what does that say? >> iwhtcimtlfmwmaom...@yahoo.com wrote: >>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > "Professional" wrestling is popular in the US too, what does that say? That they know how to make money, too? Are you from some other country? Do you mean to tell me you don't have some ridiculous sport or pastime where you're from, that someone from another country would find positively silly? -- Mike Smith On Feb 21, 3:34 pm, Mike Smith <mike_UNDERSCORE_sm...@acm.DOT.org> wrote: > >> iwhtcimtlfmwmaom...@yahoo.com wrote: > >>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > some ridiculous sport or pastime where you're from, that someone from > another country would find positively silly? Let me put it this way, I don't see any Jenson Button stickers plastered on vehicles that are in trailer-parks or public housing. > On Feb 21, 3:34 pm, Mike Smith <mike_UNDERSCORE_sm...@acm.DOT.org> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > Let me put it this way, I don't see any Jenson Button stickers > plastered on vehicles that are in trailer-parks or public housing. Way to step around the point, there. Always easier to point out the silly things in someone *else's* culture, ain't it? -- Mike Smith On Feb 21, 11:27 pm, Mike Smith <mike_UNDERSCORE_sm...@acm.DOT.org> wrote: > > On Feb 21, 3:34 pm, Mike Smith <mike_UNDERSCORE_sm...@acm.DOT.org> > > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > -- > Mike Smith- And what other culture would that be? > Are you from some other country? Do you mean to tell me you don't have > some ridiculous sport or pastime where you're from, that someone from > another country would find positively silly? Does ferret-legging count? http://www.wesjones.com/ferret.htm > On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: > >> I know...but why not just let people use whatever kind of fuel they >> want to? > > NASCAR's goal is to make every car as equal as possible, that's dumb. name a single vehicle innovation or invention that's benefited normal cars that's come from nascar. f1 otoh, where cars are /not/ equal, is the #1 breeding ground for vehicle technology in the world today. it's ancient now, but the fuel injection technology honda sold with its mainstream vehicles in the late 80's was straight off the f1 race track. nascar's a joke. > and have the > outcome of the races be based on the talent of the driver and crew... > > Not that it is always the case, but it is the intention... >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > sold with its mainstream vehicles in the late 80's was straight off the > f1 race track. nascar's a joke. Who says NASCAR has to run its races to suit *you*? NASCAR is a business, whose interest is putting butts in seats, not developing tomorrow's technology. And they're pretty damn good at it. -- Mike Smith >> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > sold with its mainstream vehicles in the late 80's was straight off the > f1 race track. nascar's a joke. Where did I say that NASCAR innovated anything? They simply want to have the cars be as equal as possible on the track. Their goal is not (nor should it be) to do a damn thing for your car. Their job is to pack the track with fans, and get TV ratings. They accomplish both tasks. As for F1, they can innovate all they like. Their races are boring follow the leader festivals. The only interesting part is qualifying. Once that is set, there is almost never a serious race... For all of it's flaws, NASCAR is competitive on the track... >>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: >>> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Their goal is not (nor should it be) to do a damn thing for your car. if you drive a honda, you'd be amazed how much of it is based on competition-derived technologies. if there's no scope for innovation and testing in competition, you get to drive crap. driven a chevy lately? they dominate nascar. > Their job is to pack the track with fans, and get TV ratings. They > accomplish both tasks. yeah, with b.s. hype about "jet fuel". and have you checked f1 ratings? no one knows f1 here, but when i was in europe, it was /huge/. > As for F1, they can innovate all they like. Their races are boring follow > the leader festivals. The only interesting part is qualifying. Once that > is set, there is almost never a serious race... > > For all of it's flaws, NASCAR is competitive on the track... like a circle jerk? >>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: >>>> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > and testing in competition, you get to drive crap. driven a chevy > lately? they dominate nascar. Again who gives a rat's a.s? Nascar has no responsibility to create innovation for grocery-getters. Their job is to put a.ses in the seats. They do it. >> Their job is to pack the track with fans, and get TV ratings. They >> accomplish both tasks. > > yeah, with b.s. hype about "jet fuel". and have you checked f1 ratings? > no one knows f1 here, but when i was in europe, it was /huge/. There was no "B.S. hype about jet fuel". A team was found to be using an illegal additive in the fuel. NASCAR never mentioned "jet fuel", nor would they. And I also don't care about Europe's TV ratings. You may have missed this, but F1's ratings suck in the US whenever they are on. >> As for F1, they can innovate all they like. Their races are boring follow >> the leader festivals. The only interesting part is qualifying. Once that [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > like a circle jerk? You don't like it, that's fine. Some find a circle-track to be boring, and I am fine with that. But in NASCAR, there is passing, drafting, and the occasional wreck (more in a plate race). In F1, the finishes are almost always dependent on the qualifying position. There is hardly ever a photo-finish, and passing in a turn is almost unheard of. Not to mention that, for a spectator, it is dull as hell. You see a blur of cars pass, then wait a while before you see anything else. You watch what you like, and I'll watch what I like, but to dismiss NASCAR's popularity simply because they don't make your car better is just plain silly... >>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > NASCAR's popularity simply because they don't make your car better is just > plain silly... this is all about preferences. you're right, nascar has no obligation to do anything. it's a circus. and so is f1. but /my/ preference is to see an event that has multiple levels of interest. /i/ like to know about the vehicles and who has what. /i/ like to see technical advantage. dual overhead cams, electronic ignition, fuel injection, ventilated disk brakes, abs, shock absorbers, aerodynamics, synchromesh technology, lubricants, composites, safety systems, etc., etc., are /all/ beneficiaries of f1 competition over the years. what the europeans call rally driving is another major source. as for entertainment value, i don't think you've watched much of it. nascar is solid rear axles going "up aways and turn left". there's nothing entertaining in that. >>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 23:50:30 -0800, iwhtcimtlfmwmaomopw wrote: >>>>>> [quoted text clipped - 68 lines] > solid rear axles going "up aways and turn left". there's nothing > entertaining in that. forgot to mention - the "jet fuel" thing was per commentary on sports radio. i was in the car out of my local f.m. radio region for a good deal of that day, so had sports radio on a.m. on the dial. and all the pre-race talk and interviews were about "cheating" and the use of "jet fuel". they even had a phone interview with the driver concerned and he used the words "jet fuel" when discussing the alleged infraction. so, you and i know it's b.s. to use those words, but that was the way it was presented to the public. and because it was clearly incorrect, and was a term used by a professional driver who i think /most/ unlikely to be so ignorant, /that/ is why i say it was media stir-em-up, not reality. nothing like a little controversy to get a few more eyeballs on the screen. snip > this is all about preferences. you're right, nascar has no obligation > to do anything. it's a circus. and so is f1. but /my/ preference is [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > /all/ beneficiaries of f1 competition over the years. what the > europeans call rally driving is another major source. http://www.imsaracing.net/ ?? as for > entertainment value, i don't think you've watched much of it. nascar is > solid rear axles going "up aways and turn left". there's nothing > entertaining in that. Sometimes they don't "turn left" when they should. Some consider the aftermath entertainment. >You don't like it, that's fine. Some find a circle-track to be boring, >and I am fine with that. But in NASCAR, there is passing, drafting, and [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >mention that, for a spectator, it is dull as hell. You see a blur of cars >pass, then wait a while before you see anything else. I guess F1 makes greater demands on the car, the driver and the spectators. It isn't dull if you understand what is going on. The only way to pass in a turn (as opposed the going into a turn) is if the turn is so wide and forgiving that multiple lines can be driven with equal speed. I got free tickets to an oval track race a couple years ago and was amazed to see two cars drive side-by-side for three laps. It may be exciting as a horse race, but obviously it isn't very demanding of the participants. |
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