adjusting parking brake, 03 accord coupe 4-cyl

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Theo - 22 Aug 2007 16:34 GMT

Dear all,
After 90000 km, the parking brake lever must be pulled up 9-10 clicks to
hold the car on a moderate slope. The dealer says the parking brake is self
adjusting, and self-adjusts when the car is braked in reverse. My Haynes
manual (yeah, I need to spring for a better one if there are any out there)
says that you adjust by popping off the centre console and tweaking the
adjustment nut. Who's right?

How much of a nightmare is it to take off that console, or otherwise access
the adjustment nut? I've had problems with that little "overhead door"
storage compartment ahead of the shift lever, and I don't want to mess that
up or break off any mounting tabs.

Anyone ever have this done at a dealer, and if so, what was the labour time?

Thanks
Theo

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Woody - 22 Aug 2007 21:47 GMT

Get the Honda manual from www.helminc.com and use the procedure in it.
Driving habits are hell on rear brake adjustments. Learn how they get
adjusted. You may also need the rear brakes rebuilt...

> Dear all,
> After 90000 km, the parking brake lever must be pulled up 9-10 clicks to
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> Thanks
> Theo

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jim beam - 23 Aug 2007 04:14 GMT

> Dear all,
> After 90000 km, the parking brake lever must be pulled up 9-10 clicks to
> hold the car on a moderate slope. The dealer says the parking brake is self
> adjusting,

correct.

> and self-adjusts when the car is braked in reverse.

that's incorrect. in fact, i'd be very uninclined to let this place
anywhere near my vehicle because of that statement - either they don't
know hondas or they don't know cars!

> My Haynes
> manual (yeah, I need to spring for a better one if there are any out there)
> says that you adjust by popping off the centre console and tweaking the
> adjustment nut. Who's right?

that's correct. there's a little panel at the back of the console.
just open it and you can access the cable adjuster. but the chances of
you needing to touch it if the rear mechanism is working properly, and
you have honda brake shoes fitted, is slim to zero.

> How much of a nightmare is it to take off that console, or otherwise access
> the adjustment nut? I've had problems with that little "overhead door"
> storage compartment ahead of the shift lever, and I don't want to mess that
> up or break off any mounting tabs.
>
> Anyone ever have this done at a dealer, and if so, what was the labour time?

find a dealer that knows what they're doing before you worry about that.

Reply to this Message

Tegger - 23 Aug 2007 13:34 GMT

> Dear all,
> After 90000 km, the parking brake lever must be pulled up 9-10 clicks
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> there are any out there) says that you adjust by popping off the
> centre console and tweaking the adjustment nut. Who's right?

Do you have the "drum in hat" parking brake, or do you have a link on the
rear calipers?

> How much of a nightmare is it to take off that console, or otherwise
> access the adjustment nut? I've had problems with that little
> "overhead door" storage compartment ahead of the shift lever, and I
> don't want to mess that up or break off any mounting tabs.

Don't touch anything yet.

Signature

Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

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Theo - 27 Aug 2007 13:01 GMT

Thanks for all the feedback. Some more info:

They're the only dealer within hundreds of miles. There's a good
independent place in town that I'll try next, for stuff I don't want to do
myself.

The rear rotors and pads are four months old. The dealer replaced a rear
caliper last week, after which the pedal was mushier, grr. There is a link
on the caliper for actuating the parking brake.

The number of clicks through which you must pull the lever has steadily
increased since the car was new - now it's at 9-10 clicks for our
modestly-sloped driveway. Cables stretch after a while, etc., so I wasn't
shocked at that until I heard about the supposed self-adjustment. After the
pads and rotors were replaced, there was very little difference in the
parking brake. The dealer says that it can take another look, and consider
tweaking the adjustment nut. I wasn't feeling warm and fuzzy about the
dealer even before I posted my original message.

Thanks
Theo

>> Dear all,
>> After 90000 km, the parking brake lever must be pulled up 9-10 clicks
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> Don't touch anything yet.

Reply to this Message

Tegger - 27 Aug 2007 16:16 GMT

> Thanks for all the feedback. Some more info:
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> The rear rotors and pads are four months old. The dealer replaced a
> rear caliper last week, after which the pedal was mushier, grr.

Then there's air in the (fairly complex) caliper; it wasn't bled
properly. This is a common error.

> There
> is a link on the caliper for actuating the parking brake.

Same as mine, then.

> The number of clicks through which you must pull the lever has
> steadily increased since the car was new - now it's at 9-10 clicks for
> our modestly-sloped driveway. Cables stretch after a while, etc.,

Unless the cable were replaced at the same time as the calipers, stretch
is NOT the issue. here. Somebody has set things up improperly.

> so
> I wasn't shocked at that until I heard about the supposed
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> wasn't feeling warm and fuzzy about the dealer even before I posted my
> original message.

Before installing the calipers, did the dealer make sure BOTH caliper's
links were free?

Did the dealer make sure neither cable was seized on its clevis? If a
cable end cannot pivot on its clevis, that caliper will not fully
engage, requiring more force to be applied to the other caliper.
http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/rustybrakes/brakes3.html
See roughly 3/4 of the way down that page.

Did the dealer back off the cable adjustment so that the parking brake
links JUST sat on their pins, then adjusted upwards from there? If the
installing tech backed the cable off too far and forgot to take up the
slack, then this would also cause your problem.

I don't have a manual for your car, so I'll have to guess at removing
the cover. Sometimes you can just remove the rear ashtray to gain access
to the 12mmm cable adjusting nuts. If you have a little access cover at
the back of the console, a slim screwdriver should be able to fit in a
little slot molded into the cover. You use the screwdriver to carefull
lever the tab back (which is beneath the slot), at the same time lifting
the cover upwards by pushing down on the screwdriver. A bit of cloth
under the screwdriver willl help in preventing marring of the plastic.

Signature

Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

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Theo - 28 Aug 2007 15:11 GMT

>> The rear rotors and pads are four months old. The dealer replaced a
>> rear caliper last week, after which the pedal was mushier, grr.
>
> Then there's air in the (fairly complex) caliper; it wasn't bled
> properly. This is a common error.

Disappointing, considering that I changed the fluid myself about 3 months
ago, bled things with a manual MityVac, and firmed up the pedal nicely. I
was charged for brake fluid, so I assume they did some sort of bleed. If
there's an air bubble in the caliper, should bleeding the new caliper help,
or must I bleed all four corners?

>> The number of clicks through which you must pull the lever has
>> steadily increased since the car was new - now it's at 9-10 clicks for
>> our modestly-sloped driveway. Cables stretch after a while, etc.,
>
> Unless the cable were replaced at the same time as the calipers, stretch
> is NOT the issue. here. Somebody has set things up improperly.

This increase in the number of required parking brake lever clicks has been
slow and ongoing since the car was new, so it doesn't seem like sudden human
error - the dealer simply did not rectify an existing condition.

> Before installing the calipers, did the dealer make sure BOTH caliper's
> links were free?
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/rustybrakes/brakes3.html
> See roughly 3/4 of the way down that page.

I'll check that. When I did the rear brakes, I had no problem removing the
cables from the calipers. The FAQ is impressive, by the way.

> Did the dealer back off the cable adjustment so that the parking brake
> links JUST sat on their pins, then adjusted upwards from there? If the
> installing tech backed the cable off too far and forgot to take up the
> slack, then this would also cause your problem.

The dealer did no adjustment - the dealer claimed that no adjustment was
needed due to the parking brake being self-adjusting, so no, the cable
adjustment hasn't been frigged with since the car got on the boat.

Thanks
Theo

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Tegger - 28 Aug 2007 21:54 GMT

>>> The rear rotors and pads are four months old. The dealer replaced a
>>> rear caliper last week, after which the pedal was mushier, grr.
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> of bleed. If there's an air bubble in the caliper, should bleeding
> the new caliper help, or must I bleed all four corners?

You shouldn't have to. Just bleed the corner that has the new caliper.

It's best when bleeding a new rear caliper to have it OFF the mount
bracket, in your hand. You turn and tap with a nylon mallet between
bleeds in order to shock stubborn bubbles free. Put a block of wood to
make certain the piston doesn't try to move out.

>>> The number of clicks through which you must pull the lever has
>>> steadily increased since the car was new - now it's at 9-10 clicks
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> sudden human error - the dealer simply did not rectify an existing
> condition.

Then maybe it is the cables. In my last message I described how to
adjust them.

>> Before installing the calipers, did the dealer make sure BOTH
>> caliper's links were free?
[quoted text clipped - 18 lines]
> cable adjustment hasn't been frigged with since the car got on the
> boat.

In your case, somebody should have checked cable adjustment.

The dealer is right in that adjustement is automatic...PROVIDED the
cables are properly adjusted in the first place!

Signature

Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

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Tegger - 28 Aug 2007 22:02 GMT

Tegger <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote in news:Xns999AABD41ABDDtegger@
207.14.116.130:

.

> The dealer is right in that adjustement is automatic...PROVIDED the
> cables are properly adjusted in the first place!

Let me rephrase that...

/Piston/ adjustment IS automatic. /Parking brake handle/ movement depends
on cable adjustment at the equalizer, assuming no problems at the caliper.

Signature

Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

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jim beam - 29 Aug 2007 03:48 GMT

> Tegger <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote in news:Xns999AABD41ABDDtegger@
> 207.14.116.130:
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> /Piston/ adjustment IS automatic. /Parking brake handle/ movement depends
> on cable adjustment at the equalizer, assuming no problems at the caliper.

yes, and if everything is as it should be, the cable should not need
adjusting and the balancer should be pretty much dead even both sides!

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Theo - 29 Aug 2007 14:09 GMT

Devil's advocate question - why does Honda build in the cable adjustment
capability if it should not be needed over time? If I was Honda's legal
team, I'd say don't put in any adjustment because that would tempt shadetree
mechanics to not fix caliper problems.

The dealer put on an aftermarket caliper, with my blessing, and the pads are
aftermarket. However, there was a large amount of parking brake handle
motion required even before the caliper was replaced. If the pads are thick
and the linkage is free, then I can't figure out what could be amiss besides
cable stretch, which the group finds very unlikely. If the piston is
self-adjusting, then the slightly thinner rotors, after machining, should
not affect things, right?

Thats a good tip about bleeding the caliper with the caliper off its mount,
so you can tap it and get rid of stubborn air bubbles.

Theo

>> Tegger <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote in news:Xns999AABD41ABDDtegger@
>> 207.14.116.130:
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> yes, and if everything is as it should be, the cable should not need
> adjusting and the balancer should be pretty much dead even both sides!

Reply to this Message

Tegger - 29 Aug 2007 17:38 GMT

> Devil's advocate question - why does Honda build in the cable
> adjustment capability if it should not be needed over time? If I was
> Honda's legal team, I'd say don't put in any adjustment because that
> would tempt shadetree mechanics to not fix caliper problems.

You have to account for manufacturing tolerances, so you need an adjustment
no matter what.

> The dealer put on an aftermarket caliper, with my blessing, and the
> pads are aftermarket. However, there was a large amount of parking
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> unlikely. If the piston is self-adjusting, then the slightly thinner
> rotors, after machining, should not affect things, right?

Aftermarket pads tend to be too hard ("lifetime", of course). If your are
too hard, a lot more upwards motion of the lever is going to be needed
before the parking brake takes effect and holds the car.

Signature

Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

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