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Car Forum / Honda Cars / May 2008Shifting the 2008 Accord EXL auto like a manual
Hello, I have a 2008 Accord EX-L and its an Auto. Everyone now and then I like to put the car in 1 at a red light and shift up to 2 at about 4500 rpms and then to D3 at about 4500 rpms etc. I am wondering if this upshifting and downshifting practice is bad to do? I make sure that I don't put the gas on until the transmission has caught the next gear. I wouldn't think so, but wanted other opinions. I know what everyone is going to say "Why didn't you get a manual transmission??" Well the fact is I only like to shift every now and then, so I would fall into the weekend shifting enthusiast category, and unfortunately I cannot afford to have two cars, so I have an automatic transmission car. Thanks, Al > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Thanks, > Al leave it in auto and floor it. then you'll see it shift /at/ the red line. like it's programmed to do. as for manual selection, quit worrying. the computer has full over-ride and stops you doing anything that'll cause any harm. >> Hello, >> [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > as for manual selection, quit worrying. the computer has full over-ride > and stops you doing anything that'll cause any harm. ah, i forgot to look, it's alfred the worrier. alfred, stop driving. you might be hit by another vehicle. > Hello, > > I have a 2008 Accord EX-L and its an Auto. Everyone now and then I like to > put the car in 1 at a red light and shift up to 2 at about 4500 rpms and > then to D3 at about 4500 rpms etc. I am wondering if this upshifting and > downshifting practice is bad to do? AAAAAAAAAAAGH! STOP IT! STOP IT RIGHT NOW! You are causing 20 times the amount of wear in your transmission each time you drive like this. At this rate, you will be looking at a complete rebuild in about two years. On the bright side, won't it be nice to drive a car with a new transmission when everyone else is still dealing with their two year old transmissions? Of course, this doesn't EVEN take into account the unnatural strain on the engine. Buddy, why are you even buying a car in the FIRST PLACE? I bet you leased it, right? This is why I don't buy lease returns. And since you leased it, you got screwed during the sale to begin with. Man, to kill your bank account AND your car all at once. Unbelieveable. > AAAAAAAAAAAGH! STOP IT! STOP IT RIGHT NOW! > > You are causing 20 times the amount of wear in your transmission each > time you drive like this. At this rate, you will be looking at a > complete rebuild in about two years. I seem to remember in the car manual that it said that the car can be driven like a manual if you want, by using the gears. Why would this put strain on the tranny? Its just like driving it the reular way except you are shifting it. > I bet you leased it, right? This is why I don't buy lease returns. Yes I leased it. Actually I got a good lease deal. > > AAAAAAAAAAAGH! STOP IT! STOP IT RIGHT NOW! > > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the tranny? Its just like driving it the reular way except you are shifting > it. You'll find out! >> AAAAAAAAAAAGH! STOP IT! STOP IT RIGHT NOW! >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > put strain on the tranny? Its just like driving it the reular way > except you are shifting it. Shifting manually will do no harm at all; the tranny is designed for this. According to the Owner's Manual: "To shift from Second to First, press the release button on the bottom of the shift lever. This position locks the transmission in first gear. By upshifting and downshifting through 1, 2, D3, and D, you can operate this transmission much like a manual transmission without a clutch pedal." Have fun. Just make sure you shift below the redline.  SignatureTegger The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ >>> You are causing 20 times the amount of wear in your transmission each >>> time you drive like this. At this rate, you will be looking at a >>> complete rebuild in about two years. > Shifting manually will do no harm at all; the tranny is designed for this. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Have fun. Just make sure you shift below the redline. Okay so now I have conflicting information. Both seem to know about Honda's but since Tegger's information is like the manual I would tend to believe this. Also wouldn't shifting the auto manually be like using the sequential sport shifter in the acura's for instance? Either way theres no clutch. > Okay so now I have conflicting information. Both seem to know about Honda's > but since Tegger's information is like the manual I would tend to believe > this. Also wouldn't shifting the auto manually be like using the sequential > sport shifter in the acura's for instance? Either way theres no clutch. Is there any particular reason you believe an Internet poster over the Owner's manual? It simply amazes me regarding the number of posts made (not just here but other car boards I am on) with questions that can be answered simply by looking in the Owner's manual. Or by people second-guessing the Owner's manual. Here, I will tilt the balance for you: it's okay to shift it manually! Don't confuse your automatic transmission with an 'automated manual' transmission. Yours is an automatic that you can shift manually, if you desire. An 'automated manual' - such as that found in Audis, Ferraris, BMWs - is a true manual transmission with automated clutch operation that can be asked to shift automatically. They are 2 totally different animals. Dan D '07 Ody EX Central NJ USA >>>> You are causing 20 times the amount of wear in your transmission >>>> each time you drive like this. At this rate, you will be looking [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > using the sequential sport shifter in the acura's for instance? Either > way theres no clutch. Tegger has done lots of thinking about this. The product of that thinking is below. In a Honda automatic transmission, shifted automatically, the transmission computer (TCM or PCM)decides when it will trigger the shifts. It makes its decisions based on many factors, chief among them being: road speed, engine speed, engine coolant temperature and throttle position. The PCM effects automatic gear changes by powering/depowering the various transmission solenoids (and there are many of them) necessary to engage/disengage particular gear ratios. Operating the shift lever manually means that you -- and not the computer -- command the solenoids to operate. Placing the lever in "2" for instance, causes the shift solenoids to assume the identical same positions they would had the PCM forced the shift to "2" itself. Either way the transmission responds in an identical manner using identical parts, and will engage the new gear with identical vigor. In other words, the same parts are operated to change gear whether the PCM gives the signal via its logic or you give the signal using the position of the gear lever. Honda did not install two separate sets of transmission control mechanisms. I can see just two possible problems with shifting an automatic manually. These problems are: overspeed of the engine, and "lugging". In a manual transmission there is nothing to save you from catastrophic engine failure should you, say, shift into second and let out the clutch at 85mph. Even though the engine's ECM will have cut off fuel near redline, the solid mechanical connection between engine and road wheels will pull the engine into mechanical failure territory and a rod will poke itself through the block. Likewise, if you choose to shift your manual 5th at 10mph, the engine will labor mightly to keep the car moving, pounding the crankshaft and rod bearings oval in the process. In an automatic the PCM constantly monitors engine and road speed, even when you shift manually. I would *think* the PCM would block the manual gear-change signal from reaching the solenoids if the resulting engine speed would exceed redline, but I have never tried this, not having a disposable car to test on. With an automatic, if you put the lever into a lower gear and repeatedly forget you've done so, you'll be running the engine at a far higher RPM than the PCM would run it at, leading to greatly increased engine wear. Remember that moving the lever to "2" locks the transmission in that gear. It is therefore possible to overheat and damage the transmission and its fluid due to lugging at low road speeds in too high a gear, provided you lug the powertrain for long enough. It is interesting that the Owner's Manual mentions the engine speed limiter (present on both models), but has a caution ONLY for the manual transmission model. The manual transmission caution warns that the engine speed limiter only works on upshifts, it does not work on downshifts; you are warned to make sure you will not exceed the engine's redline when downshifting. Plus there are tables indicating maximum speeds in gears. The automatic transmission section gives no such warning and has no speed tables. This implies that the PCM will protect you from major stupidity. Elmo's warning has truth to it: When you take upon yourself the responsibility of choosing your own gear ratios, you also take upon yourself the responsibility of knowing something of the machinery of your car, and the damage you may cause by manipulating that machinery incorrectly. Maltreatment of the equipment is called "abuse". Honda will not honor warranty claims resulting from abuse. SignatureTegger The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ "Tegger" <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote in ( snip ) Killer post, Tegger...thanks. Peace, Polfus >>> AAAAAAAAAAAGH! STOP IT! STOP IT RIGHT NOW! >>> [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Have fun. Just make sure you shift below the redline. 1. the only "fun" alfred ever has is finding things to worry about. [and bleat on newsgroups about.] 2. it's impossible to manually abuse that transmission. it's all electronic, so the ecu won't let you shift in a pattern that'll harm anything. > Hello, > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > on until the transmission has caught the next gear. I wouldn't think so, > but wanted other opinions. Hey Al, I remember you asking about this back in Jan, and its okay to do this the way you are doing it. Downshifting is another matter, and that will depend on how fast you are going and to which gear you are downshifting to. I recommend that you downshift to D3 only if you need to because you are getting on the brakes hard and you feel the engine can help you slow down. This takes practice and is not good to do unless you know how to, so if you do, go ahead. If not, then don't unless its an emergency situation and even then you should use your free hand to grab the emergency brake instead of the gearshift to take down to D3 or lower. Personally, I use D3 to slow the car in certain situations like hills where I don't want to get too fast...otherwise I don't use D3, 2, or 1 to slow the car. Upshifting, however, I really use 1 or 2 only if I feel like playing or making the revs higher just to feel the engine. Otherwise, if I start from a stop I really think the car is fine in D3 and I leave it there until I need to switch to D. I've really decided that going from 1 to 2 to D3 to D is kind of harsh with the '08 Accord, in that the engine feels great but nothing beats a superb Honda manual foot clutch and 5 speed gearbox...so since the auto isn't one of those, I just use the extended power range of the D3 function now. The car jumps pretty good in D3 from a stop in the first 3 gears, and since its so much smoother the trade off is better for me...no 1 or 2 because its not smooth as I like, not because the car can't handle it. > I know what everyone is going to say "Why didn't you get a manual > transmission??" Well the fact is I only like to shift every now and then, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Thanks, > Al Once in a while is fine, so don't worry..just upshift at or before redline to be safe. And don't downshift to 2 or 1 to slow car not nececcary. You can downshift freely between D and D3...even if you are going 70. The new engine is amazing, IMHO....man I love it. My old 1990 Accord 4-cyl had 130 hp....now at 190 and it feels great to me. Peace, Polfus > Once in a while is fine, so don't worry..just upshift at or before redline > to be safe. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > Peace, > Polfus Thank you everyone for the information. I appreciate all the information. I am still wondering if a sequential sport shifter like in the Acura TSX would make the car faster than using the regular auto mode? I wanted to say that although the manual shifting can be fun, I don't think that it really works that well with the car for performance. Today I thought I would try a test against a Kia Amanti using the manual shifting method in my 2008 EXL Accord Auto. I had trouble keeping up using the shifting method. Then at the next light I put it in D3 and my rpms hit about 5500 rpms I and blew the doors off the Kia Amanti. So maybe its just better suited that way and should only be used to control the revs or slow down faster etc. > Thank you everyone for the information. I appreciate all the information. > I am still wondering if a sequential sport shifter like in the Acura TSX > would make the car faster than using the regular auto mode? Well sure...you'd be able to use the engine's powerband more. > I wanted to say that although the manual shifting can be fun, I don't > think that it really works that well with the car for performance. Today I > thought I would try a test against a Kia Amanti using the manual shifting > method in my 2008 EXL Accord Auto. I had trouble keeping up using the > shifting method. Well....hmmm. Maybe you aren't aggressive enough on the manual shifting? I guarantee both of us using manual shifting in 2 Accord automatics will result in one car faster than the other. Since you are gonna understand that simple logic, then you can also follow that some can make the car go faster than others, even with all else equal. Regardless....its a pain to shift manually in an auto from 1 to D, so the hell with it. > Then at the next light I put it in D3 and my rpms hit about 5500 rpms I > and blew the doors off the Kia Amanti. Yup...exactly why I said to do this in the first place to you! > So maybe its just better suited that way and should only be used to > control the revs or slow down faster etc. "Slow down faster"....like what situation are you talking about? Peace, Polfus > "Slow down faster"....like what situation are you talking about? > > Peace, > Polfus I just mean if you are on the highway going 60 mph for instance and you want to take an exit and as your breaking in D you realize that there are cars going slower than you thought in front of you. You can then put it in D3 when your going about 45 mph and this will help you slow down faster. I think speed wise its better to use D3 in the city and when the rpms get high enough, such as 3000 at a cruising pace, put it in D. Then if your going slower you can always drop it back down to D3. If you know anything about New England you know that we have some very steep hills. Sometimes 2 is good when going down one of these. I also like to use 2 when accelerating in snow from a stop, so the car takes off from 2nd gear. I think this helps with wheel spin. Although having traction control probably does the same thing anyway. Al >> "Slow down faster"....like what situation are you talking about? >> [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > Al take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and worry. then you can stop wasting our electrons. > take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and worry. I can't WAIT to see him blow up his engine! Or will the transmission go first? >> take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and worry. > > I can't WAIT to see him blow up his engine! Or will the transmission go > first? neither - he'll get hit by a meteorite. >> take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and worry. > > I can't WAIT to see him blow up his engine! Or will the transmission go > first? I guess I didn't see Jim Beam's post till now, I have him blocked because we determined he is a troll from way back in January. Elmo, I will not be blowing up the engine. I actually did the same practice with my 2005 Accord and had it for 3 years with no problems. I just wanted to know if this would be different on the 2008 Accord. Its a lease and under warrenty anway. I don't think entering the highway in D3 and bringing the rpms to 5000 rpms and switching to D is anything out of the ordinary. I am sure most people drive the same way if they are performance oriented. Al >>> take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and worry. >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I guess I didn't see Jim Beam's post till now, I have him blocked because > we determined he is a troll from way back in January. Fuk that scumbag....troll indeed. > Elmo, I will not be blowing up the engine. I actually did the same > practice with my 2005 Accord and had it for 3 years with no problems. I [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Al You got that right, plus it allows one to feel the real power of the '08 engines. Peace, Polfus > >> take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and worry. > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Al Are you saying that if you give the car full throttle it won't downshift when you're in "D"? No, I didn't think so. The Accord auto transmission is responsive to throttle inputs. Try it. There's absolutely no reason for manually shifting the car when all you want to do is accelerate up to highway speed. If you plant your right foot the Accord will pull right up to redline. >>> take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and >>> worry. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > anything out of the ordinary. I am sure most people drive the same way > if they are performance oriented. Doing this will do no harm at all. In fact, were you to hold the throttle pedal all the way down for long enough, the transmission (in automatic mode) may even shift itself at 6,000 rpm. SignatureTegger The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ On 5/5/08 6:35 PM, in article UQMTj.5497$1M1.4084@newsfe23.lga, "alfred" <tomboy83=@yahoo.com> wrote: >>> take the bus alfred. it'll absolve you of all responsibility and worry. >> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > I guess I didn't see Jim Beam's post till now, I have him blocked because we > determined he is a troll from way back in January. I'm surprised you didn't first block Elmo. I know I did. Having blocked both of them a couple of years ago, these threads make absolutely hilarious reading as all you see are the frustrated replies of people attempting to use actual logic on these two. Don't feed the troll. > Elmo, I will not be blowing up the engine. I actually did the same practice > with my 2005 Accord and had it for 3 years with no problems. I just wanted [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Al >> "Slow down faster"....like what situation are you talking about? >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > then put it in D3 when your going about 45 mph and this will help you > slow down faster. You'd best be using the brakes for that. The transmission only acts on two wheels, which could be disastrous on wet or icy roads. > I think speed wise its better to use D3 in the city and when the rpms > get high enough, such as 3000 at a cruising pace, put it in D. Then if > your going slower you can always drop it back down to D3. For reasons of fuel economy, the transmission will ordinarily attempt to achieve the highest gear possible as quickly as possible. Therefore, some other makers' transmissions have an "overdrive lockout" button, which accomplishes the same thing as moving the lever to D3 in your Honda. With either system you're intended to manually lock out overdrive in situations where overdrive may be inappropriate, such as in hilly terrain or city traffic. > If you know > anything about New England you know that we have some very steep > hills. Sometimes 2 is good when going down one of these. I also like > to use 2 when accelerating in snow from a stop, so the car takes off > from 2nd gear. I think this helps with wheel spin. It does. The reasons you list in the paragraph above are exactly why you have manual control over gear selection in the first place. SignatureTegger The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ >> I just mean if you are on the highway going 60 mph for instance and >> you want to take an exit and as your breaking in D you realize that [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > You'd best be using the brakes for that. The transmission only acts on two > wheels, which could be disastrous on wet or icy roads. Hi Tegger, Usually when I am getting off the freeway and slowing down on the exit ramp, I only use the brakes. Sometimes if it seems like I have to stop alot faster, I will brake and also put the car in D3. Wouldnt this be safe since I am using the brakes also? Plus I guess you know that the 2008 Accord has traction control, EBD, VSA and Brake Assist. I guess that can help in a slippery situation too. Al >>> I just mean if you are on the highway going 60 mph for instance and >>> you want to take an exit and as your breaking in D you realize that [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > ramp, I only use the brakes. Sometimes if it seems like I have to stop > alot faster, I will brake and also put the car in D3. I do the exact same thing. > Wouldnt this be safe since I am using the brakes also? Generally, yes...in the situations that I mentioned. >Plus I guess you know that the 2008 Accord has traction control, EBD, VSA >and Brake Assist. I guess that can help in a slippery situation too. > > Al :) By the way, I love my 2008 Accord. Peace, Polfus > :) > > By the way, I love my 2008 Accord. > > Peace, > Polfus I love mine too! My brother bought the 2008 Acura TSX, but after being inside it and realizing that it has a feel almost like the Civic with more technology, I love my Accord even more. The Accord is more comfortable inside and has bigger more roomy seats. Al
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