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Car Forum / Honda Cars / June 2006Cost of Transmission Fluid Flush
I was wondering how much I should expect to pay for a transmission fluid flush (not a drain). I'm talking about when they completely remove all the old fluid and replace it with new fluid, as opposed to just draining and re-filling. I've got a 1998 Honda Accord LX 4-cyc with 72K miles. I was quoted a price of $220 from a mechanic I trust, but just wanted to make sure. I have been told by MANY that this will do more damage than good on a Honda transmission. Just drain and refill. G-Man >I was wondering how much I should expect to pay for a transmission > fluid flush (not a drain). I'm talking about when they completely [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I was quoted a price of $220 from a mechanic I trust, but just wanted > to make sure. > I was wondering how much I should expect to pay for a transmission > fluid flush (not a drain). I'm talking about when they completely > remove all the old fluid and replace it with new fluid, as opposed to > just draining and re-filling. I've got a 1998 Honda Accord LX 4-cyc > with 72K miles. What does Honda's service manual say? Modern Hondas are supposed to get a drain-drive-drain service of about 4 cycles. "Flushing" isn't recommended. And from my experience, you'd do good to avoid "flushing". Assuming that I WILL go ahead with the fluid flush, how much should I expect to pay? I don't know, how much is a new transmission these days? :-) G-Man PS, I consulted my AAMCO dealer whos mechanic was the head mechanic at my Honda dealer for years. They WILL NOT do a flush on a Honda transmission even if someone asks. Do what ya have to, but don't complain at the results! G-Man > Assuming that I WILL go ahead with the fluid flush, how much should I > expect to pay? > Assuming that I WILL go ahead with the fluid flush, how much should I > expect to pay? --------------------------------------------- The reason that Honda says you can't 'flush' their trannies (as I understand it) is Murphy's Law. There's more than a 50/50 chance that the bozos at Monkey Lube will hook up the hoses BACKWARDS and when they start pumping, the contents of the INTERNAL FILTER will be distributed equally throughout the transmission. Yes, it's very expensive. Ask 'Chip', if he's around these days..... 'Curly' For drain and refill it cost me 3 litre @7.something = $21.something + 30 min labour= $25 All prices is Canadian dollars and from a Honda dealer. > I was wondering how much I should expect to pay for a transmission > fluid flush (not a drain). I'm talking about when they completely [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I was quoted a price of $220 from a mechanic I trust, but just wanted > to make sure. > For drain and refill it cost me > 3 litre @7.something = $21.something + > 30 min labour= $25 > > All prices is Canadian dollars and from a Honda dealer. A half-hour of dealer labor is $25? Was this 20 years ago or something? Dealer shop rate these days is more like $90 per hour. Even higher in some places. Even the independents are around $60-$70/hr. And that drain and fill only replaced about half the total fluid, so you'd need to get it done several times to make sure most of it's fresh.  SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ I must admit that I'm disappointed. I ask a simple question and I get a bunch of advice that I didn't ask for. I appreciate the concern about having a transmission FLUSH in a Honda, but I've decided to do it (no post on this board will change my mind). And I wanted to know how much a FLUSH costs, not a breakdown of how much labor costs these days. If you haven't had one done or don't know how much they cost, then don't reply to the post. > I appreciate the concern > about having a transmission FLUSH in a Honda, but I've decided to do it > (no post on this board will change my mind). Enjoy. If you didn't want advice, just pick up the phone and ask the dealer. You posted in a public newsgroup. Take the good with the bad. Some of us see you standing on a bridge, and we are just trying to talk you down! G-Man Enjoy your flush! >I must admit that I'm disappointed. I ask a simple question and I get > a bunch of advice that I didn't ask for. I appreciate the concern [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > If you haven't had one done or don't know how much they cost, then > don't reply to the post. > If you didn't want advice, just pick up the phone and ask the dealer. > You posted in a public newsgroup. Take the good with the bad. > > Some of us see you standing on a bridge, and we are just trying to > talk you down! Jump...jump...jump...jump...jump... SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ > I must admit that I'm disappointed. I ask a simple question and I get > a bunch of advice that I didn't ask for. you ask for free advice from experienced experts, but it "disappoints" you? then why ask us? just pick up the phone and ask people who don't know - they'll tell you what you want to hear, and charge you for it too. > I appreciate the concern > about having a transmission FLUSH in a Honda, but I've decided to do it > (no post on this board will change my mind). And I wanted to know how > much a FLUSH costs, not a breakdown of how much labor costs these days. use the TELEPHONE. sheesh. > If you haven't had one done or don't know how much they cost, then > don't reply to the post. > I must admit that I'm disappointed. I ask a simple question and I get > a bunch of advice that I didn't ask for. I appreciate the concern [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > If you haven't had one done or don't know how much they cost, then > don't reply to the post. It's a fool who ignores advice from those in the know... JT > I must admit that I'm disappointed. I ask a simple question and I get > a bunch of advice that I didn't ask for. I appreciate the concern > about having a transmission FLUSH in a Honda, but I've decided to do it > (no post on this board will change my mind). It's heartening to know you're flexible. > And I wanted to know how > much a FLUSH costs, not a breakdown of how much labor costs these days. > If you haven't had one done or don't know how much they cost, then > don't reply to the post. Okey-doke. You wouldn't want to phone around, would you? Be a lot faster than posting here, and more accurate for your local market. Hey, wait. I just replied when I wasn't supposed to, didn't I? Bad, BAD Tegger! A spanking for you with an old timing belt! SignatureTeGGeR® The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ > > For drain and refill it cost me > > 3 litre @7.something = $21.something + [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > -- > TeGGeR® That's a big fault that I find with Honda automatics... No converter drain plug. JT >>>For drain and refill it cost me >>>3 litre @7.something = $21.something + [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > JT why? it's not necessary. and on a thin sheet converter like this, it would not only cause unnecessary balance issues, it would be a potential fatigue point. > >>>For drain and refill it cost me > >>>3 litre @7.something = $21.something + [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > would not only cause unnecessary balance issues, it would be a potential > fatigue point. Why??? Why should one have to change fluid several times to renew and even then, some old fluid will remain. It is a major flaw in a lot of modern tin, er.. plastic. There is no excuse for poor serviceability by Honda or any other manufacturer for that matter. Shame on Honda for shaving a few cents in manufacturing savings that results in a major inconvenience for customers regarding the maintenance of their cars. Just because it's a Honda does not mean it's perfect. JT >>>>>For drain and refill it cost me >>>>>3 litre @7.something = $21.something + [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] > > JT with respect, i don't think you're considering all the design criteria. as far as lubrication is concerned, there's really no need to fret too much about the changes. there's two main sources of fluid problems: contamination and heat degradation. contamination comes from friction lining wear [not as much of an issue with the honda design], from gear tooth wear and to a much lesser extent, bearing wear. as far as gear box control operation is concerned, the filter ensures contaminant particle size is kept below a critical level where they won't cause harm. and as you know, the filter can't be changed]. heat degradation is not common unless service conditions are unusual or there's something wrong. this, in combination with better lube technology these days, means a lot of cars not only specify highly extended change intervals, some [bmw] don't even specify a change at all and don't provide any kind of drain plug! my friend's 88 automatic accord had /never/ had a fluid change in 360k miles [yes, three hundred and sixty thousand miles] and that car ran & shifted like a champ. so, sure, it's a "nice to have" to be able to change 100% of the fluid, but reality is, when looking into the actual service conditions of the lube itself, that it's just not that critical. balance that against the very sound mechanical reasons [converter design] for /not/ putting in a converter drain, and the 100% fluid change concept is easily abandoned. > >>>>>For drain and refill it cost me > >>>>>3 litre @7.something = $21.something + [quoted text clipped - 61 lines] > very sound mechanical reasons [converter design] for /not/ putting in a > converter drain, and the 100% fluid change concept is easily abandoned. Uh, in the Texas heat, dino fluid is good for not much longer than 50K. Add to this the lack of a filter that cannot be changed (or cleaned) plus the lack of a drain plug in the converter (where the majority of fluid resides), Honda is shortchanging its customers pure and simple. The record of tranny failures speak for itself. I'm done with this thread. JT >>>>>>>For drain and refill it cost me >>>>>>>3 litre @7.something = $21.something + [quoted text clipped - 63 lines] > > Uh, in the Texas heat, dino fluid is good for not much longer than 50K. texas gets hotter than ca or nv? tx is more humid, but that just affects wet stuff like humans, not sealed stuff like transmissions. besides, ambient of 100F isn't exactly extreme for a lubricant. > Add to this the lack of a filter that cannot be changed (or cleaned) > plus the lack of a drain plug in the converter (where the majority of > fluid resides), Honda is shortchanging its customers pure and simple. > The record of tranny failures speak for itself. record of tranny failures? 300k on an automatic? name a domestic that'll regularly and reliably do 300k! i know there's issues with modern hondas, but what about the 20-odd years prior to that? and modern failures are gear design problems - nothing to do with excess fluid contamination. buy a ford, then let's talk about the difference being able to change the fluid seems to make... > I'm done with this thread. > > JT >record of tranny failures? 300k on an automatic? name a domestic >that'll regularly and reliably do 300k! i know there's issues with >modern hondas, but what about the 20-odd years prior to that? and >modern failures are gear design problems - nothing to do with excess >fluid contamination. buy a ford, then let's talk about the difference >being able to change the fluid seems to make... But given some of the misbehaving trannies Honda has been turning out the last few years, maybe a drain plug is worth the rather small cost and effort involved. J. This brings up a good point. I wonder if you could put a drain on the tranny that would do a better job, and if so, where? BTW, I have sold two Accords with Auto trans with almost 200k on them, and now one ever had a problem. And from what I know, they are still going strong. I did change the fluid at the recommended intervals, and I NEVER flushed one. And in response to that other comment, I would agree, Honda's are NOT prefect by far, but I find them to be the lesser of the evils. I have now had 15 new Hondas on over 22 years. I commute, and I rack up miles. I have had everything fro Civics to Accords. In those 15 cars, other than regular maintenance, I have had the following expenses. 2001 Accord had a main oil seal let go at 115k, $10 part and $700 to get replaced. 2001 Accord had to have a seat belt replaced because the SRS sensor in it was bad, cost $120 installed. 94 Civic I got used had a Head Gasket go at 90k, cost $500 94 Civic, CV Joint Replacement. 94 Accord had a clutch warp. Complained when it was under warrant, so the dealer replaced it long after the warranty, cost $0 I'm sure I have forgotten some minor under $50 items, but this has been my major expenses other than normal brakes, timing belts, etc etc. Before Honda, I used to spend a lot on a car after 70-80k miles. G-Man Anything else was less than $100. >>record of tranny failures? 300k on an automatic? name a domestic >>that'll regularly and reliably do 300k! i know there's issues with [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > J. > 2001 Accord had to have a seat belt replaced because the SRS sensor in it > was bad, cost $120 installed. Sucker. Honda will replace seat belts for free, anytime. You just didn't ask. My guess is your dealership pocketed the entire $120, and passed the repair off to Honda warranty--who also paid for it at their rate. Wrong, they will not replace any electronic component on the SB. Only the SB for safety reasons. Per Honda USA. I didn't take it to the dealer either. Cost close to $200. G-Man >> 2001 Accord had to have a seat belt replaced because the SRS sensor in it >> was bad, cost $120 installed. [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > $120, and passed the repair off to Honda warranty--who also paid for it > at their rate. > Wrong, they will not replace any electronic component on the SB. Only the > SB for safety reasons. Per Honda USA. Right. The dealer replaces the entire seat belt mechanism. It's not rocket science. And Honda warrants seat belts forever. They just replace the whole thing. The dealership puts it in for warranty pay. > I didn't take it to the dealer either. Maybe that's why you had to pay out of pocket. Trust me, the mechanism that dealers have for paying for things like this is well established, and the fact that Honda warrants seat belts without question is well known. Honda doesn't want to be caught on the end of any trouble, having refused to replace a simple seat belt. > > Wrong, they will not replace any electronic component on the SB. Only the > > SB for safety reasons. Per Honda USA. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Honda doesn't want to be caught on the end of any trouble, having > refused to replace a simple seat belt. Hey Elmo! Do you think that Honda will replace the slack seat belts in my '83 Civic? <GGG> JT > > Honda doesn't want to be caught on the end of any trouble, having > > refused to replace a simple seat belt. > > Hey Elmo! > > Do you think that Honda will replace the slack seat belts in my '83 Civic? Try it. I bet they will. It does depend on (a) your relationship with your dealer, (b) the effectiveness of the dealer service manager, and (c) their relationship with Honda. But overall, regarding seat belts, I believe they will--if there's any doubt that the seat belt is working correctly. > > > Honda doesn't want to be caught on the end of any trouble, having > > > refused to replace a simple seat belt. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > But overall, regarding seat belts, I believe they will--if there's any > doubt that the seat belt is working correctly. Thanks! I'll give it a shot later this week. Anything to same me $$$$!!! JT > But given some of the misbehaving trannies Honda has been turning out > the last few years, maybe a drain plug is worth the rather small cost > and effort involved. That wouldn't have solved Honda's problems. The tranny problems went deep into basic design flaws. >>record of tranny failures? 300k on an automatic? name a domestic >>that'll regularly and reliably do 300k! i know there's issues with [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > J. has nothing to do with the ability to drain fluid - they're fundamental design problems. >> But given some of the misbehaving trannies Honda has been turning out >> the last few years, maybe a drain plug is worth the rather small cost >> and effort involved. >> >has nothing to do with the ability to drain fluid - they're fundamental >design problems. My concern is not the catastrophic failures but the (much more widespread???) sticky shifting that does seem to be temporarily relieved by new fluid. Of course it's far from a fix, just a crude backup, way to get by. J. > >> But given some of the misbehaving trannies Honda has been turning out > >> the last few years, maybe a drain plug is worth the rather small cost [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > J. Bingo! JT > > For drain and refill it cost me > > 3 litre @7.something = $21.something + [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Dealer shop rate these days is more like $90 per hour. Even higher in some > places. Even the independents are around $60-$70/hr. Hi TeGGeR I am sorry. It was actually CAN$ 25.5 for 0.30 hours. Slip of eye or what you call it in English. > And that drain and fill only replaced about half the total fluid, so you'd > need to get it done several times to make sure most of it's fresh. > -- > TeGGeR® > > The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ > www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ |
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