Car Forum / Jaguar Cars / April 2004
HELP: Buying a Jaguar XJS
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Mega Man - 24 Mar 2004 09:44 GMT I'm thinking about buying a Jaguar XJS and would like to know if there was a "Best Year" for this model.
Should I look for one with a conversion engine in it or buy one with stock engine?
Do these come with stick shift or just automatic?
Are these cars high maintenance?
What type of problems are frequent with this model and what does it cost to fix them?
Thanks.
__________________________ Mega Man JobCrunchersUnite.com
Jerry McG - 24 Mar 2004 16:29 GMT > I'm thinking about buying a Jaguar XJS > and would like to know if there was a [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > Mega Man > JobCrunchersUnite.com The XJS is, in some circles, considered something of a Jaguar "odd duck" and is not one of the more revered Jaguar models. However, it has its own special charm and is a superb cruiser.
The V12 versions are the best performers, but pre-89 V12s are notorious oil leakers and very expensive to repair. '89 and beyond V12s received a modern, one-piece rear main seal in place of the old-fashioned split rope seal which eliminated the most egregious leaks.
Nearly all XJS's imported to the USA were automatics, with the exception of a very small number of AJ6-equipped cars imported as a market test in 1985-86, and a very small number of AJ16 6 cylinder cars imported in '94. The car for most of its life was equipped with a very stout 3 speed GM400 trans, which gave way to a GM 4 speed in '93 (I may be wrong on the year here.)
XJS early on were absolute maintenance & repair hogs, numerous problems from bumper to bumper. It received a major facelift in '92 and gradually became quite relaible by the time of its replacement by the XK8 in '96 for '97 m.y.
My personal favorite XJS Story: in the mid-80s, in response to market pressure for a convertible XJS, Jaguar management negotiated a consulting agreement with the outstanding German cachbuilder, Karmann. Karmann was supplied with a set of plans for the XJS, and a complete set of body tooling. Karmann came back to Jaguar and reported that the vehicle was 1" longer on one side vs. the other! (When XJS was designed it was under BL-ownership and no one had ever bothered to check the specs.) This was rationalized at great expense with the advent of the factory convertible in '89.
Other funny XJS facts, bodies were welded up on five individual "turntable" jigs at the Castle Bromwich body plant. As part of their imposition of Ford build quality standards within Jaguar, Ford manufacturing engineers discovered that all five jigs were set at different specs! Therefore, one could determine through panel fit issues which of the five jigs it had been welded up on. NONE of the jigs were set to the actual specs, which is why XJS had so many bad panel fits, particularly the doors and rear trunk lid seams.
While the convertible was in development, Jaguar made an interesting "Cabriolet" model in the mid-80's, with removeable "t-top" roof panels and a plastic rear screen that could be dropped. (Later fitted with a removeable glass top section). All of these were covered with a sub-standard fabric, which faded rapidly in sunlight. Jaguars "fix" was to "paint" it with a colored dye substance, which looked awful and did not stop it from completely deteriorating within a year or so of prolonged UV exposure. Most have been recoverd by custom top shops by now. Regardless, this is a very cool looking XJS, and quite rare.
One last bit of Jaguar trivia, due to infighting between the factory and the USA management team over the need for a convertible, in 1985 Mike Dale (then US VP Sales & Marketing) decided to take matters into his own hands and contracted with a Cincinnati, Ohio USA coachbuiler, Hess & Eisenhardt, to convert XJS coupes into convertibles. The resulting vehicle was a complete disaster, massive body flex, weird fuel tank arrangement that leaked fuel into the passenger compartment, the list goes on. The project banrupkted Hess & Eisenhardt and led to a very costly out-of-court settlement. To the amazement of many, Mike Dale BS'ed his way out responsibility for the mess a nd became President of Jaguar under Ford. Most of these cars ended up being either bought back by Jaguar and crushed or junked by the marketplace. No parts availabiluity exists for the special conversion stuff, top bows, tanks, etc. are only available by scrounging. (If you see one of these DO NOT BUY IT, RUN, do not walk away!)
Lastly, a nmber of these were converted along the way to Chevrolet V8 power. If the conversion was done by a reputable installer the vehicles run well and are much cheaper to maintain. However, they have very little if any value and should be avoided.
linehauler - 26 Mar 2004 00:42 GMT >> I'm thinking about buying a Jaguar XJS >> and would like to know if there was a [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >> Mega Man >> JobCrunchersUnite.com
>Lastly, a nmber of these were converted along the way to Chevrolet V8 power. >If the conversion was done by a reputable installer the vehicles run well >and are much cheaper to maintain. However, they have very little if any >value and should be avoided. Thanks Jerry- that's the best short history of the XJS I've ever seen. I'm been a Jag fan for decades and finally bought a 1982 XJ-12 VdP 4 years ago. I've never been attracted to the XJS, just personal preferences regarding the styling. Don't think you mentioned the horrible fuel economy of the V12- pre HE engines are lucky to get 12 MPG (that's about what I get and I'm talking Imperial gallons). The HE engines (not sure what year they were introduced) apparently get 30-40% better fuel mileage. For sure the V12 is expensive to maintain and repair; it also presents some real challenges to a home mechanic who does his own repair/maintenance work (myself). Cooling is also a critical issue with the V12- these engines generate a LOT of heat and absolutely cannot be allowed to overheat, ever. The above being said, I believe the V12 is a true testament to Jaguar's design engineers- one horsepower per cubic inch out of an engine that is turbinelike in its smoothness, silence, and power was a real achievement in the 1970's. The engine is of very robust construction and as long as it is properly cooled and oiled should last indefinitely. Finally, if and when my V12 journeys to the great scrapyard in the sky I would consider a smallblock Chevrolet as a substitute if the cost of a rebuilt V12 was prohibitive. The smallblock is coming up on its 50th anniversary, there are millions of them around, parts are cheap and available everywhere, and they are really easy to work on. The right choice of smallblock will provide an engine that is both lighter and much more powerful that the V12. BUT, I won't have a true Jaguar anymore. It is something to consider anyway.
Again, thanks for your comments and insight, you've clearly done a lot of homework on the subject.
Paul
Jerry McG - 26 Mar 2004 02:43 GMT > Again, thanks for your comments and insight, you've clearly done a lot of homework on the subject. <
Thanks. Actually, it was a bit more than "homework". I was with Jaguar Cars in the States from '86 - '00 and aside from being involved with the factory on service issues, I drove many XJS's as company cars. Despite all it's flaws, it was a great car whose quality problems and lack of development always worked against it. FWIW, in '67 I bought a spanking new E-Type and have always used that marvelous vehicle as the benchmark as to what a Jaguar truly was....they haven't come close since, though the XKR is a nice try!
The V12 was a heavy beast, but if set up properly ran like a thoroughbred, a real masterpiece. Now, if the oil would just stay INSIDE the engine!
taltos - 26 Mar 2004 22:25 GMT > > Again, thanks for your comments and insight, you've clearly done a > lot of homework on the subject. < [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > sounds like a Triumph motorcycle with the oil loss. Paul x-type owner
bill@microsoft.com - 08 Apr 2004 03:02 GMT >> Again, thanks for your comments and insight, you've clearly done a >lot of homework on the subject. < [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >The V12 was a heavy beast, but if set up properly ran like a thoroughbred, a >real masterpiece. Now, if the oil would just stay INSIDE the engine! Being the owner of a '79 XJ-S for the last 3 years, I can attest to the truth of your statements :-)
Fortunately I live 2 blocks from one of the best XJ-S repair shops in the Midwest (Speciality Sport Cars in Columbus OH) so I benefit from all the wonderful things this car can do when set up correctly... The V-12 is damn tear a turbine in smoothness and generates great torque.
As to oil leaks, well, oil is cheap.
(Was just in Speciality last month... they had 3 E-types in the shop, a I, a II, and a III... nice cars. But the D-Type they had was a lot prettier!)
<eeeb.remove@eeeb.remove.com>
Nick - 09 Apr 2004 22:18 GMT Its all subjective but here is my take on Jaguars. By the way , before I start let me make it very clear that I love Jaguars, in a passionate emotive way ( thanks why I spend so much bloody money on them ) To me they are the poor mans Aston, not the best but you just have to have one!!
Having driven lots of Jaguars over the years, E types, XK's, XJ 6. XJS. XJ40, XK8, the car that has stood out for me is the V12 XJS. Its the perfect blend of styling ( I drive a convertible ), comfort, space and speed. they are also a bargain 2nd hand and there is no reason why I'm not going to own mine forever, if it gets tired buy a new engine, paint dulls get it sprayed etc. Its always going to be worth keeping it going as its always going to be desirable and turn heads
Its flawed, all Jags are. Its outdated, something that normally happens as soon as they are produced. Its expensive, not only to buy new and suffer horrendous depreciation but to maintain one in top fettle takes copious amounts of wad.
BUT Jags are gorgeous, my head tells me to buy Mercedes. Each similar car technically more advanced than a Jag. Each Mercedes is better built with finer quality parts. Mercedes generally maintain a slower and lower depreciation curve. I don't buy Mercedes I buy Jaguars. I want Mercedes but there is a Jag I caould buy. I want my Jaguar to be as well built as a Mercedes, but hey I still love it ITS A JAG. Everyone remembers a ride in a Jaguar, everyone knows someone who owns a Jag, flash, reckless, whatever. Jaguar is a love story from start to finish
Nick
-- Nick Bennett buys 007 memorabilia The Biggest Online Bond Collection @ www.jamesbondtoys.co.uk
Jagwire - 09 Apr 2004 23:50 GMT > Its all subjective but here is my take on Jaguars. By the way , before > I start let me make it very clear that I love Jaguars, in a passionate > emotive way ( thanks why I spend so much bloody money on them ) To me > they are the poor mans Aston, not the best but you just have to have > one!! Poor mans Aston Martin!
You have to be joking, I would'nt be seen dead in a bloody poofy Aston Martin. Sheeesh!!!
> Having driven lots of Jaguars over the years, E types, XK's, XJ 6. > XJS. XJ40, XK8, the car that has stood out for me is the V12 XJS. Its [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > Nick Bennett buys 007 memorabilia > The Biggest Online Bond Collection @ www.jamesbondtoys.co.uk
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