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Car Forum / Jaguar Cars / June 2004XJ40 non-starter :: exhaust comes out of oil filler tube !!!
I have a 89 XJ40, it's been of the road for 6 months now and is getting me down . Now, it has been at 2 garages one a Jaguars specialist and they both could not get my jaguar to fire up. Now it's down to me . I gone through the whole fuel injection system and the ECU unit and senders are all checked out. Now over the months there been lots of trying to start it and flooding the engine. The oil fills with fuel pretty quick. Now. This is what I got. If I take off all the leads so there is no spark nothing much happens. Just turns over on a start. If I plug any of the leads to the plugs you can hear and tell it is firing.Bit of a shudder. Put them all on and it will not start. What is interesting? Is it is going boom, so mixture and fuel is good. But the oil fill tube smoke comes out. The coolant has been checked for oil and vice versa. So not that. The more spark plugs connected the more smoke from the tube. So this suggests that the exhaust gases are just passing through the piston rings and out the bottom. No good oil seal Now how do I get back to sealing it. Have I got it all wrong. Please HELP!!!!.... The oil is drained now and ready to execute any ideas. When an engine is badly flooded with raw fuel it will wash the oil from the rings and cylinders. This can reduce the compression to the point that the engine will not start. The solution is to drain the oil, remove the plugs and squirt a little oil in each cylinder. Spin the engine over with the starter to distribute the oil and reinstall the plugs and crankcase oil. Hope this helps. Don Young > I have a 89 XJ40, it's been of the road for 6 months now and is getting me > down . Now, it has been at 2 garages one a Jaguars specialist and they both [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Now how do I get back to sealing it. Have I got it all wrong. Please > HELP!!!!.... The oil is drained now and ready to execute any ideas. > When an engine is badly flooded with raw fuel it will wash the oil from the > rings and cylinders. This can reduce the compression to the point that the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Hope this helps. > Don Young I would also like to add that you should pull the fuel pump relay or fuse during this time as a flooded engine already has plenty of fuel. I would try to start it awhile then spray some fuel into the intake tract to see if the engine responds. If it does not then pull the valve cover, set engine to TDC, and see if your cam notches line up. It sounds like a bad flow sensor or pressure regulator to me. *NOTE ABOUT FUEL INJECTED CARS..fully depressing the throttle while cranking will set a flood clear mode; very much the opposite of a carb. DieInterim What Don Young said, but too much left out... What did the Jaguar specialist tell you? How many miles are on the car? Has the timing been set? Has the crank sensor been checked/replaced? (this is a common problem) What do the spark plugs look like? > I have a 89 XJ40, it's been of the road for 6 months now and is getting me > down . Now, it has been at 2 garages one a Jaguars specialist and they both [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Now how do I get back to sealing it. Have I got it all wrong. Please > HELP!!!!.... The oil is drained now and ready to execute any ideas. I assume this engine is high mileage and that's why it was off road for 6 months. So its compression is probably marginal even without being flooded with fuel. Somehow you need to confirm that the spark is at least approximately correct - that #1 spark plug fires at #1 cylinder's TDC. Once the engine's timing has breen checked and found OK or corrected, you should remove all the spark plugs, squirt about 1/2 teaspoon of lube oil into each cylinder crank the engine in very short bursts to coat the cylinder walls and rings, replace the spark plugs and, on a dark and stormy night, when all the neighbors are huddled inside, start the engine. The oil smoke will be considerable! Thank you for all your advice..and help.... The compression is good well within spec. Timing has been checked and is fine. ECU dinositic check done with Jaguar computer and ECU reproted all sensors are fine including the Air flow. good The car has fired up and ran for about 5 seconds at high rev and then as soon as returned to idel dies FAST. (very rare to start tho) 1 in every 200 attempts Now it it might seems nuts that 2 garages did not get this fault i found. A chance event i hve to say. i noticed that my so called spark was OK was not a snapping, fat blue one .But a skinny ..white one. i took of the rotor it looks fine and so does the cap. but if you simulate the rotation of the rotor by hand you notice that the rotor does not even come close to toching the contacts on the cap. It is suspected that the spark was jumping in the cap..and then not having enought juice to jump to anything usefull to the spark plug. It makes sense sine one minute the care is fine and then suddlenly just when dead at lights....6 moths later......we find sothing that fits the bill. This would explain why.....then the engine somtimes cought it would fire up since the power from the engine would increase input voltage to the coil so stronger sparks. As soon as revs drop ...the sparks would not have enought ummmph after jumping in the cap and then having to jump in the plug. I have ordered.......new rotor and cap..and ....put a new coil for good meausure. Expect to try tommorow....Please Please Please let this be it. I will be such a happy man. I can not beleive that 2 garages 1 a Jagaur garage fail to spot somthing so simple. We all knew it would be a stuiped thing....but this is testamony to DIY, get down and dirty with it one week of fighting with this problem. It was begining to enter the realms of super natrual. I will keep you posted and thnk you for all your help. God Bless Jaguars...dont care hwat they say...one of the best cars in the world. Tom > I have a 89 XJ40, it's been of the road for 6 months now and is getting me > down . Now, it has been at 2 garages one a Jaguars specialist and they both [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > Now how do I get back to sealing it. Have I got it all wrong. Please > HELP!!!!.... The oil is drained now and ready to execute any ideas. > Thank you for all your advice..and help.... > > The compression is good well within spec. > Timing........ <Snippy snip snip> You know once I had a Jaguar come in for an occassional "trying to run in reverse". The engine would be idling along then, snap pop rrrrrrmmmmm in reverse. I founf that the center electrode in the cap had "vanished", making the spark jump from the center to the rotor. Everyonce in a while the spark would bypass the rotor and jump over to the nearest plug electrode. In short, make sure your center electrode is still there and touching the rotor. Blake The car has fired up and ran for about 5 seconds at high rev and then as soon as returned to idel dies FAST. (very rare to start tho) 1 in every 200 attempts. After you work on the ignition you might look for a possible vacuum leak. A good size vacuum leak could prevent idle. I know little about these engines but recall a comment that someone found a vacuum leak under the intake manifold, but only after much searching. As to your comment about the professional mechanics, time is money and mechanics, like MDs get paid for doing "procedures" - MDs operate on us and mechanics remove and replace this or that part. There's not much original thought in auto repairing just routine of what they've previously encountered. > The car has fired up and ran for about 5 seconds at high rev and then as > soon as returned to idel dies FAST. (very rare to start tho) 1 in every [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > original thought in auto repairing just routine of what they've > previously encountered. I cannot disagree with you. First of all many mechanics do not compile results of ...vaccuum tests, compression, and fuel pressure. Now these are basic tune up tests, yet most mechanics immediately plug in computers to retrieve codes without performing the basics. Listen, given the information given, we fire off "oh this or that'' but we can be miles off. A vaccuum leak you bet, it sounds good. But it could also be a miscalibrated idle control valve. Well never know.....how about fuel pressure? I can tell you how many electronic devices I have repaired after some other "professional" said that there was nothing wrong with them. Get back to the basics. Lambach is very very correct. Well I am a very very happy man. i mean!! i was fizzy with the joy as i heard my jaguar 3.6 fire up and sound very very very good. As was outlined before 6 months and 2 garges of failing to get it going. it was time for plenty of determination and a lot of thinking about what it need to get going and not excluding any possabiity. logical one by one inevistagation of the key components. Thank you all for your help on things i was not sure on. You all helped get my bird flying ;o) I got the new distribuar and arm and looked at ...i compared it to the one from my non starter it was only millimieter shorter. So i though at that time perhaps i was wrong. I fitted the rotor and distributar and first time. It started!!!! WOW and plety of YEA HAAAA I was so happy........i could now even consider enjoy the merits of such a buityfull car. Life is a peach. when you think about it, in electrical spark jumping terms millimeters count so the lesson for me is make sure you get a spare one and keep an eye on its condiition. As soon as i got over my joy i thundered down to the first macanics and told them what it was. He was gutted....feeling very bad that such a simple things was missed. They did explain that they put a new rotor and distributar & arm on.......and it still did not start. Perhaps the engine was too flooded.....when they put it on so compression was too low anyway. or simply the aftermarket one they had was not right. i mean if my rotor was only 2 or so millimeters shorter then it should of been, it might tolrence thing going on.with the after market stuff. A long shot but a thought. I do have to say that with all the cleaning and redoing and sorting out of small things like cleaning hoses, throttle bodies. wiring and coneections all over the engine area. It seemes the engine has a real sense of zip it might not of had before. It been so long since i heard it but it sounds better...stronger. I could not fight the temptaion to drive the car of the drive and back and work out the rusty disks. It was like a magic carpet......So smooth and effortless and refined......Brillant...Brillant!!! thats all i can say...so glad i never scaped as other people were telling me too. Take it easy jaguar men. Tom > The car has fired up and ran for about 5 seconds at high rev and then as > soon as returned to idel dies FAST. (very rare to start tho) 1 in every [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > original thought in auto repairing just routine of what they've > previously encountered. |
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