 |
 | Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us |
 | Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network |
Car Forum / Jeep / May 2008Jeep CJ7 Mopar MPFI - Failed California Smog Test
Have had the MPFI on my CJ-7 for several years. Very satisfied. Problem is, have moved to CA from TX - in CA they test for NOX - CO and CO2 readings are excellent - failed NOX. Tester (reliable; actually a "Referee" )said the engine was running too lean, thus failed NOX. Looking for a fix, larger injectors?? Just advance the timing?? Need to find out - trying to regeister in CA - but need to pass Smog Is your EGR working? That is supposed to cut out NOx by cooling the top end I think. Geese, I got 589 NOx on my manually tuned (no computer) BBD (POS) carb in my CJ7 on a recent test and I don't even have a catalytic converter, just a straight pipe to a Dynomax turbo muffler. Mike 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06 http://www.imagestation.com/album/pictures.html?id=2115147590 (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page) > Have had the MPFI on my CJ-7 for several years. Very satisfied. Problem is, > have moved to CA from TX - in CA they test for NOX - CO and CO2 readings are [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > -- > Message posted via http://www.carkb.com Hi Tate, I'm surprised he didn't fail you for the injection, as any variance from stock needs certification. Was your CJ a Kalifornia car to begin with, or a state requiring a catalytic converter? NOX is it's job: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/catalytic-converter2.htm Anyway, a new converter will solve your problem. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > Have had the MPFI on my CJ-7 for several years. Very satisfied. Problem is, > have moved to CA from TX - in CA they test for NOX - CO and CO2 readings are [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > -- > Message posted via http://www.carkb.com Bill, I think (probably wrong) that the Mopar MPFI is 'certified', at least here in the Peoples Republik of Massachusetts. > Hi Tate, > I'm surprised he didn't fail you for the injection, as any variance [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >> -- >> Message posted via http://www.carkb.com Yes it is, but if you want to pass Kalifornia's SMOG, you'd better have that certificate in your hot little hands. Out here it's the VIN number they run with. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > Bill, > > I think (probably wrong) that the Mopar MPFI is 'certified', at least here > in the Peoples Republik of Massachusetts. Do they ever stop smog testing out there? It used to be a 15 year old vehicle didn't need the smog test, but now they've locked it at 1984 and newer. That's why I'm using the parts from my 87 YJ to rebuild an 83 CJ. > Yes it is, but if you want to pass Kalifornia's SMOG, you'd better > have that certificate in your hot little hands. Out here it's the VIN [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >> here >> in the Peoples Republik of Massachusetts. They've modified SMOG laws a couple of times here in Kalifornia, but this last time they stop it letting people like me that like old cars at '76 and older, so this high performance tunnel port 429 engine pictured in front of my '78 Bronco will never meet: http://www.billhughes.com/429ford.jpg God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/429.jpg > Do they ever stop smog testing out there? It used to be a 15 year old > vehicle didn't need the smog test, but now they've locked it at 1984 and > newer. > > That's why I'm using the parts from my 87 YJ to rebuild an 83 CJ. Why not install it and just pull it out when the tests need to be done? > They've modified SMOG laws a couple of times here in Kalifornia, > but this last time they stop it letting people like me that like old [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >> >> That's why I'm using the parts from my 87 YJ to rebuild an 83 CJ. We have unannounced highway SMOG check points, just your dui checks. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > Why not install it and just pull it out when the tests need to be done? I thought your Governator was gonna crush those girlymen in Sacramento and all their silly rules? > We have unannounced highway SMOG check points, just your dui > checks. > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O > mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > >> Why not install it and just pull it out when the tests need to be done? Arnie's a Republican in name only, it was all we could do to get him to give us some help on the boarder: http://www.billhughes.com/temp/minutemen.jpg God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com > I thought your Governator was gonna crush those girlymen in Sacramento and > all their silly rules? That's border. > Arnie's a Republican in name only, it was all we could do to get > him to give us some help on the boarder: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >> and >> all their silly rules? Thank you. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > That's border. As in Border Jeep: http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=Border+Parts,+3875+Bancroft+Drive,+Sprin g+Valley,+CA+91977&output=html God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > That's border. Well...... he is sleeping with a Kennedy... > Arnie's a Republican in name only, it was all we could do to get > him to give us some help on the boarder: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >> and >> all their silly rules? Stand by to repel boarders ! Dave Milne, Scotland > Arnie's a Republican in name only, it was all we could do to get > him to give us some help on the boarder: [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > I thought your Governator was gonna crush those girlymen in Sacramento and > > all their silly rules? I thought I heard he refused to send troops to the border and they had to bring down yankee boys to do their job. >> Arnie's a Republican in name only, it was all we could do to get >> him to give us some help on the boarder: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > and >> > all their silly rules? It's not often that North Carolina is more enlightened then other states but this is one of those times. In NC if a vehicle is 35 years old or older it is exempt from all inspection requirements, and we can run plates from year of manufacture without having to notify the DMV (of course you have to have a current plate and registration in the car with you). So I drove my Studebaker pickup through one of those "Click it or ticket" checkpoints a while back, no seatbelts, no inspection sticker, and a plate that expired in 1961 and the only comment from the Highway Patrolman was "Have a nice evening" <BG> Jeff DeWitt > We have unannounced highway SMOG check points, just your dui > checks. > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O > mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > >>Why not install it and just pull it out when the tests need to be done? Bill, you are full of sh.t. Part of the system is a batch of stickers, and stamped numbers ON THE SYSTEM that designate it as one of the certified systems. One needs nothing "in his hot little hands." > Yes it is, but if you want to pass Kalifornia's SMOG, you'd better > have that certificate in your hot little hands. Out here it's the VIN [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >> here >> in the Peoples Republik of Massachusetts. So you never had to go to a control station, as you once told me? God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > Bill, you are full of sh.t. > > Part of the system is a batch of stickers, and stamped numbers ON THE SYSTEM > that designate it as one of the certified systems. One needs nothing "in his > hot little hands." No. I never said I had to go to a control station. The first time I went for smog, the tester was an idiot -- newbie -- that did not know what he was doing, and he caused the machine to demand I call the control station. The guy I called asked me, so why are yo calling me? He sent me, via phone conversation, back to the original smog shop. Once I got past the newbie, I've never had a problem again. > So you never had to go to a control station, as you once told me? > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >> his >> hot little hands." Thanks, glad to hear, I must have been thinking of someone else's problem. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > No. I never said I had to go to a control station. The first time I went for > smog, the tester was an idiot -- newbie -- that did not know what he was > doing, and he caused the machine to demand I call the control station. The > guy I called asked me, so why are yo calling me? He sent me, via phone > conversation, back to the original smog shop. Once I got past the newbie, > I've never had a problem again. :> Thanks, glad to hear, I must have been thinking of someone else's :>problem. Must be a new experience for you, thinking I mean! The Lurkers Creed: 'Tis better to remain silent and be thought a fool... Than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt". See another example of taking responsibility for one's actions. An impossibility ofr cowards too afraid to use a real name and address. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > Must be a new experience for you, thinking I mean! Just thought I'd follow you here because you ran off so fast from A.B.P.A. and wondered why you didn't answer the questions I had asked except with your standard BS below! Shell we get back to it, or you going to run off again? :> See another example of taking responsibility for one's actions. An :>impossibility ofr cowards too afraid to use a real name and address. :> :>"24Bit®" wrote: :>> :>> Must be a new experience for you, thinking I mean! I thought I go fishing, you ever go deep sea fishing? God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > Just thought I'd follow you here because you ran off so fast from > A.B.P.A. and wondered why you didn't answer the questions I had asked > except with your standard BS below! > Shell we get back to it, or you going to run off again? Not at 2am in the morning, but then again you do strange things! And there you go again, trying to change the subject at hand! Would you like a repost so you can get back to the allegations? :> I thought I go fishing, you ever go deep sea fishing? :> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] :>> except with your standard BS below! :>> Shell we get back to it, or you going to run off again? > Just thought I'd follow you here because you ran off so fast from > A.B.P.A. and wondered why you didn't answer the questions I had asked [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > :>> > :>> Must be a new experience for you, thinking I mean! Just re-read Stipid! >> Just thought I'd follow you here because you ran off so fast from >> A.B.P.A. and wondered why you didn't answer the questions I had asked [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >> :>> >> :>> Must be a new experience for you, thinking I mean! Message-ID: <hY-dnTlNRKNK25DVnZ2dnUVZ_tjinZ2d@giganews.com> I was required to take the officer's test, while in Advanced Individual Training, which means I have a 59 IQ, and you didn't! God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:BillHughes@billhughes.com http://www.billhughes.com/jeep_bookmark.htm > :> Thanks, glad to hear, I must have been thinking of someone else's > :>problem. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > 'Tis better to remain silent and be thought a fool... > Than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt". Your Ignorance never ceases to amaze me, El LardO. >> :> Thanks, glad to hear, I must have been thinking of someone else's >> :>problem. >> Must be a new experience for you, thinking I mean! Message-ID: <hY-dnTlNRKNK25DVnZ2dnUVZ_tjinZ2d@giganews.com> I was required to take the officer's test, while in Advanced Individual Training, which means I have a 59 IQ, and you didn't! God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:BillHughes@billhughes.com http://www.billhughes.com/jeep_bookmark.htm Bill, you are full of sh.t. Hesco makes a MPFI Kit, and has for years, that meets California Smog Rules. TO THE OP, I have the same system on my Jeep, and I pass smog easily. You have to have something wrong or out of adjustment. I'm not certain, but I think NOX is an issue that results from a beat to sh.t CAT. > Hi Tate, > I'm surprised he didn't fail you for the injection, as any variance [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >> -- >> Message posted via http://www.carkb.com Yes, and we all know you had to get yours certified. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > Bill, you are full of sh.t. > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > something wrong or out of adjustment. I'm not certain, but I think NOX is an > issue that results from a beat to sh.t CAT. You apparently don't know ... > Yes, and we all know you had to get yours certified. > God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >> an >> issue that results from a beat to sh.t CAT. I stand corrected. God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com http://www.billhughes.com/ > You apparently don't know ... Like Bill said, the cat helps take care of NOx, but it needs to be at operating temperature for it to function like it should. Take your Jeep for a good highway run right before you take it in for the test, and it will help immensely. Chris > Have had the MPFI on my CJ-7 for several years. Very satisfied. Problem > is, [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > injectors?? Just advance the timing?? Need to find out - trying to > regeister in CA - but need to pass Smog Ditto: http://www.billhughes.com/smog.jpg God Bless America, Bill O|||||||O mailto:LWHughes3rd@aol.com > Like Bill said, the cat helps take care of NOx, but it needs to be at > operating temperature for it to function like it should. Take your Jeep for > a good highway run right before you take it in for the test, and it will > help immensely. > > Chris I'll second that. My BMW had high NoX readings, and the tech told me to take it around the block at high speed in a low gear, and then he tested it IMMEDIATELY upon my return. It passed. When I drove in the first time, I had just come off the freeway, BUT I had to wait in line for 45 minutes before I got to the test station. > Like Bill said, the cat helps take care of NOx, but it needs to be at > operating temperature for it to function like it should. Take your Jeep [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >> injectors?? Just advance the timing?? Need to find out - trying to >> regeister in CA - but need to pass Smog Pretty much anything that raises the combustion temperature is a suspect for high NOX. Crapped out cat, possibly just running too lean. If a good run takes it under the limit, figure you'll want to check/replace the cat before the next bi-annual. The smog stations are supposed to let the engine cool down before testing, but even the test only stations seem to want you in and out asap. Jeff Strickland proclaimed: > I'll second that. > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >>> injectors?? Just advance the timing?? Need to find out - trying to >>> regeister in CA - but need to pass Smog > Pretty much anything that raises the combustion temperature is a suspect > for high NOX. High temps _lower_ the NOX. Crapped out cat, possibly just running too lean. If a > good run takes it under the limit, figure you'll want to check/replace the > cat before the next bi-annual. I agree with that. The smog stations are supposed to > let the engine cool down before testing, but even the test only stations > seem to want you in and out asap. My car failed the low speed test, but passed the high speed test. It left me wondering why they do the low speed first on a cold engine when if they do the test on a hot engine, it will pass. If the high speed test was done first, the engine would come to temp and pass on the low speed test. Jeff Strickland proclaimed: >> Pretty much anything that raises the combustion temperature is a >> suspect for high NOX. > > High temps _lower_ the NOX. Sorry, but wrong. NOX is formed when the compression and/or temperature is high enough to get the nitrogen in common air to react with oxygen to form one of the nitrogen oxides. Nitrogen doesn't combine easily at either lower compression or lower combustion temperatures. "NOx emissions are formed when enough heat and pressure exist in a vehicle's combustion chamber to combine oxygen with nitrogen. In the 1970s, vehicle manufacturers attempted to control NOx emissions by preventing their formation. They lowered compression ratios (compared to 1960s levels), retarded ignition and cam timing, and installed exhaust gas re-circulation components to lower combustion temperature. " > Crapped out cat, possibly just running too lean. If a > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > test was done first, the engine would come to temp and pass on the low > speed test. >> Pretty much anything that raises the combustion temperature is a suspect >> for high NOX. > >High temps _lower_ the NOX. _Wrong_ NOx is formed when combustion temp is high. >Crapped out cat, possibly just running too lean. If a >> good run takes it under the limit, figure you'll want to check/replace the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >> let the engine cool down before testing, but even the test only stations >> seem to want you in and out asap. 'Cool down' is a bit misleading. They don't want you 'preconditioning' the vehicle by trying to heat up the cat, but the vehicle needs to be tested at normal operating temperature. So, you're supposed to let it idle until up to temp. The idea is that they've allowed enough time in the test for the cat to 'heat up' while the loaded mode test is running. If it doesn't, there's something wrong. A 'cool' cat converter is a sure way to fail for high NOx emissions, since the cat needs to be hot to rip the nitrogen loose from the oxygen. Too much O2 can also reduce the cat's ability to reduce NOx, so an exhaust leak upstream of the cat can cause problems too. >My car failed the low speed test, but passed the high speed test. It left me >wondering why they do the low speed first on a cold engine when if they do >the test on a hot engine, it will pass. If the high speed test was done >first, the engine would come to temp and pass on the low speed test. The engine is supposed to be at normal operating temp before the test begins. >>> Pretty much anything that raises the combustion temperature is a suspect >>> for high NOX. >> >>High temps _lower_ the NOX. > > _Wrong_ NOx is formed when combustion temp is high. Sorry, I was thinking that high CAT temps was the goal of having a "hot" engine during a smog test. High CAT Temps _lower_ the NOx readings. >>Crapped out cat, possibly just running too lean. If a >>> good run takes it under the limit, figure you'll want to check/replace [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > of the > cat can cause problems too. Which is what I said earlier. One wants the CAT to be hot in order to keep NOx numbers low. >>My car failed the low speed test, but passed the high speed test. It left >>me [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > The engine is supposed to be at normal operating temp before the test > begins. > >>> Pretty much anything that raises the combustion temperature is a suspect > >>> for high NOX. [quoted text clipped - 47 lines] > > The engine is supposed to be at normal operating temp before the test > > begins. --------------------------------------- You all just made me happy that my 1982 CJ-7 passed emissions in Washington state for the final time with a header, Howell fuel injection and no smog pump on the original/rebuilt 258 engine at 220,000 miles. Pleased, Norman
|
Reply to this Message |
 Sign In
 Join
 My Latest Posts My Monitored Threads My Blog My Photo Gallery My Profile My Homepage Start New Thread Enable EMail Alerts Rate this Thread
|
©2008 Advenet LLC Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.