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Car Forum / Jeep / August 2007

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Oh boy, what's that noise?

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Jon - 23 Jul 2007 21:18 GMT
'97 TJ, 4.0, roughly 130-140k on the odometer.

Bear with me, as I'm trying to narrow down the source of a persistent
engine noise.  I'm well versed in mechanics, but this is the first
engine "rattle" I've run across that has been more noticeable at idle/
deceleration than under a load -- as a matter of fact, it's gone once
you get the slightest load on the engine.  I'd say it's louder than
the constant tap-tap-tap of a bad lifter or rocker, but far softer
than bearing noise.  At idle, it the sound oscillates a bit and isn't
quite as "even" as it is upon deceleration (where it sounds in time
with every cylinder).  Based upon the sound, my thoughts wander toward
piston slap or a really loose timing chain, but that doesn't gel with
the no-noise factor under a load, or with every other worn-out engine
I've dealt with.

I only ask now because, with the recent failure of an idle control
valve, "honey" idled in traffic on the way home at 3,000
rpm......which happens to be right around the no-load resonant
frequency of this sound....and either it's a fair bit louder now or my
head makes me think so.

Just to cover a few bases:

Not transmission/clutch related.
Not an exhaust leak.
35 psi oil pressure at idle, hot on a manual gauge with 10w30.
Runs and idles smooth.
Present hot and cold.
The harmonic dampener not hitting the timing cover.
Sound does not emanate from inside the valve cover.

Hoping you all can shed some light on this issue -- I know this engine
can be dependable and has a few noises that creep up over time, I'd
just hate to miss an opportunity to service an overlooked part during
a maintenance tear-down....or worse yet dive into a sand bowl with a
real soft engine...

Thanks in advance,

Jon
DougW - 23 Jul 2007 22:45 GMT
> '97 TJ, 4.0, roughly 130-140k on the odometer.
>
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> the no-noise factor under a load, or with every other worn-out engine
> I've dealt with.

Couple of thoughts with pics from a ZJ..

How's the motor and transmission mounts doing?
http://revbeergoggles.com/motormount/

Might want to put a stethescope to the distributor and listen
there.  I've had noise come from a sloppy bushing and wound up
replacing the distributor.  The giveaway was oil intrusion.
http://revbeergoggles.com/distributor/

I've also had the center exhaust hanger's rubber bit fall out
and that made a nice buzzing noise every now and then.

Signature

DougW

SnoMan - 24 Jul 2007 13:04 GMT
>Might want to put a stethescope to the distributor and listen
>there.  I've had noise come from a sloppy bushing and wound up
>replacing the distributor.  The giveaway was oil intrusion.

You might want to feel engine if you can while it is making noisy. If
it is lifter related or such you will not feel it but if it is bearing
related, you will feel the vibrations in block even if it is not that
loud
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
Jon - 24 Jul 2007 21:54 GMT
Doug + Sno, both solid ideas and direction, thank you.

All mounts are less than a year old, this is definitely something
internal.  Didn't think to listen to the distributor area, I'll post
if I find the solution.

Jon
Nick Hughes - 06 Aug 2007 19:30 GMT
I may have a similar issue.  Does the rattle go away when you step on
the clutch?  I think there was a TSB out on this.  There was a problem
with some spring holding the clutch when the Jeep was idle.

I brought my Jeep to the dealership and asked they fix per the TSB.
Either the fix didn't work or they just charged me for nothing.

> '97 TJ, 4.0, roughly 130-140k on the odometer.
>
[quoted text clipped - 36 lines]
>
> Jon
Jon - 08 Aug 2007 01:40 GMT
> I may have a similar issue.  Does the rattle go away when you step on
> the clutch?  I think there was a TSB out on this.  There was a problem
> with some spring holding the clutch when the Jeep was idle.
>
> I brought my Jeep to the dealership and asked they fix per the TSB.
> Either the fix didn't work or they just charged me for nothing.

Hi Nick,

Sorry hear of your bad luck, at least that's one item "checked off".
The noise I'm referring to is definitely engine internals, not related
to clutch or transmission operation.  Rapidly developing into a "run
it 'til it breaks" issue -- but thanks for the tip.

Jon
 
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