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Car Forum / Kia Cars / February 2007Timing belt
I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are people driving past the recommemded change point. Thanks Bob >I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are people > driving past the recommemded change point. > > Thanks Bob === IMHO the 60K is based on giving the engine Mfg. as much ground to get out of any damage caused by a timing belt failure if one does fail past 60K. I read that many people drive over 100K with their same timing belts. Also IMHO the 60K gives the dealers a chance to hit someone for and extra $500 to $600 for really just changing out a still good belt. Others may disagree it's their money not mine. > === > IMHO the 60K is based on giving the engine Mfg. as much ground to get [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > someone for and extra $500 to $600 for really just changing out a > still good belt. Others may disagree it's their money not mine. I agree with you. Cover the Mfg, and get the dealer 600 for a 3 hour job. >> === >> IMHO the 60K is based on giving the engine Mfg. as much ground to get [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >> someone for and extra $500 to $600 for really just changing out a >> still good belt. Others may disagree it's their money not mine. == > I agree with you. Cover the Mfg, and get the dealer 600 for a 3 hour job. == I am not trying to tell others what they should or should not do in regards to their timing belts. I am just saying from what I have seen and read it's a SCAM the replacing timing belts at 60K. A real SCAM and many are falling into it and dishing out their hard earned cash for nothing. >>> === >>> IMHO the 60K is based on giving the engine Mfg. as much ground to [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > timing belts at 60K. A real SCAM and many are falling into it and > dishing out their hard earned cash for nothing. My experience is a Plymouth that still had the original belt when traded at 140K and a Daewoo that broke at 66K. Considering that replacing an engine costs over 5 times a belt replacement, I will replace them on schedule now (with an interference engine anyway). >My experience is a Plymouth that still had the original belt when traded >at 140K and a Daewoo that broke at 66K. Considering that replacing an >engine costs over 5 times a belt replacement, I will replace them on >schedule now (with an interference engine anyway). I have an '02 Plymouth Voyager. As far as I know, the timing belt has never been changed and it's now at 198K miles. -- Christian > I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are people > driving past the recommemded change point. > > Thanks Bob It would help if we knew which vehicle you had exactly. The early sephia's did not have interference engines, thus driving past 60k was 'relatively' safe(and I use that term loosely) because if the belt broke the engine would simply stop running. Later models have interference motors which will destroy pistons and valves if the belt breaks while the engine is running. The bottom line, you can err on the side of reliability and change it out at 60k, or you can play the risks of going past 60k and having it let go during your vacation or drive to work. The choice is yours. The comments about the dealer nailing you for $500 to $600 is probably about right..you're getting taken. Take your vehicle to a repuatable independent shop and have them install a kia belt from the dealer. Using the kia belt will protect your warranty. But interestingly enough, Kia does not make belts. The dealer belt will probably have "Gates PowerGrip" stamped all over it. Mine did. $134 at the dealer, $35 for the same damn belt at auto zone. But if doesn't say Kia on the package they will not honor your powertrain warranty if it fails. Good luck with it. Chris This is a great post. It really does depend on what you are driving. On a similar site (Hyundai), there is a mechanic who does this work all the time. He knows about how long each of the engines in cars will last. Some can handle 90-100,000 miles, especially, if the miles are piled up in, say four years. But there are other engines where they are breaking at not much past 40,000 miles. My first experience with a timing belt was when a one on a Korean built engine in a Pontiac I owned broke at 57,000 miles. I recently bought a Hyundai Elantra for my son. It had 78,000 miles on it and still had its original timing belt. Another relative had one that ran for over 100,000 miles. But unless you know for sure the history of your engine, I wouldn't chance it, especially if you find that your engine is an interference engine. I have an '04 Kia Sedona that is approaching 60,000 miles. I'd like to think by now that a history is being built up where I can get some idea how many miles I can REALLY expect before I have to change the belt on that V-6. But unless I get that information, and know I can rely on it, I WILL be changing my timing belt at 60,000. I just can't take a chance of ruining my engine. Tom Wenndt >> I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are >> people [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > > Chris >Take your vehicle to a repuatable >independent shop and have them install a kia belt from the dealer. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >$35 for the same damn belt at auto zone. But if doesn't say Kia on the >package they will not honor your powertrain warranty if it fails. The US law(s) governing warranties prohibits companies from requiring the consumer to buy a specific brand of replacement part. So, the $35 AutoZone belt and an independent mechanic is just as protected as a "Kia" belt and a Kia service center. From the FTC (http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/buspubs/warranty.htm): "'Tie-In Sales' Provisions "Generally, tie-in sales provisions are not allowed. Such a provision would require a purchaser of the warranted product to buy an item or service from a particular company to use with the warranted product in order to be eligible to receive a remedy under the warranty. The following are examples of prohibited tie-in sales provisions. "In order to keep your new Plenum Brand Vacuum Cleaner warranty in effect, you must use genuine Plenum Brand Filter Bags. Failure to have scheduled maintenance performed, at your expense, by the Great American Maintenance Company, Inc., voids this warranty. "While you cannot use a tie-in sales provision, your warranty need not cover use of replacement parts, repairs, or maintenance that is inappropriate for your product. The following is an example of a permissible provision that excludes coverage of such things. "While necessary maintenance or repairs on your AudioMundo Stereo System can be performed by any company, we recommend that you use only authorized AudioMundo dealers. Improper or incorrectly performed maintenance or repair voids this warranty." -- Christian Christian, While I agree that warranty provisions would require Kia to use an aftermarket belt had I given them one, if that belt did break of its own accord and as a result of the breakage damaged the engine, the engine damage would not be covered by Kia. Any claims for liability would have to be charged against the company that made the defective belt, as opposed to the belt breaking and taking out the head, if the belt was made by kia and installed by kia, then the warranty is on their shoulder. Sure, you could try to prove that it was some other part that failed and took out the belt, but if you really want to fight an issue like that good luck to you. They would have installed an aftermarket belt, but if that belt broke two blocks down the road the engine repairs would be my problem, not theirs. My point is that the belt in the dealer package and the belt from autozone are made by the same company. As to the talk about checking the timing belt, on the sephia it is a pain because you have to remove the valve cover(same way on the 1.6 and 1.8 miata engine). The later model sephias had a redesigned valve cover that made removal of the timing belt covers substantially easier, allowing a person to check the condition of the belt without having to replace the valve cover gasket. Chris >While I agree that warranty provisions would require Kia to use an >aftermarket belt had I given them one, if that belt did break of its >own accord and as a result of the breakage damaged the engine, the >engine damage would not be covered by Kia. Ahh, good point. I hadn't considered that. -- Christian Hi, Kia Sportage, 97 Belt changed at 120.000 Km....looked like new. cheers all jerry >I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are people > driving past the recommemded change point. > > Thanks Bob >I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are people >driving past the recommemded change point. I don't know what you have. But, if I'm not mistaken, it's pretty easy to get a glance at the timing belt on a Sedona. I don't know if this holds true for other Kia vehicles. -- Christian Ihad my Hyundai sonata 2-Timing belts changed at 83000 mile and the large Timing belt looked like new the small belt would have broke! > I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are > people driving past the recommemded change point. > > Thanks Bob PS the car in question is a 2003 Kia Rio, Hi Bob, I have a 2003 Kia Rio, well I guess I should say that the dealership now has my 2003 Kia Rio. Yesterday, on my way home, just as I came to a stop at a stop sign, the engine shut off. This had never happened before, so I attempted to re-start it with no success. After getting it in to the dealership, they first thought the engine had blown. They opened it up and stated how clean it looked, said they could tell it was well maintained and even went as far as to say they believed that the warranty would cover it. All that changed though when the shop manager took a look at the timing belt. A few teeth were missing, it jumped timing and screwed up the engine. The service center (not the dealership) that I had taken it to over the years never mentioned anything about it being necessary to change the timing belt at 60K miles. I had heard it was recommended, but not a necessity. I am paying for it now. Since my belt was not changed at 60K all the repairs for the damage to the engine and the replacement of the timing belt are on me. I am waiting for the dealership to call me back this morning to let me know how bad it really is. They won’t know for sure until they get in it good and see. Last night they were pretty sure it would run at least 1K to fix, possibly more. My advice, don’t play with it... get it done now before you regret not doing it. Andre > bob <rmh32495@nospamcomcast.net> wrote in > news:Xns985C9BFA3A6E4rmh32495comcastnet@216.196.97.136: [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > PS the car in question is a 2003 Kia Rio,  SignaturePosted at author's request, using http://www.AutoBoardz.com interface Articles individually verified to usenet standards. Visit URL to contact author/report abuse Thread archive: http://www.AutoBoardz.com/Timing-belt-ftopict186310.html andreame70 <none@000.com> wrote in news:961926 _ce2ef6c040716e890ccae58a02fb412d@autoboardz.com: > Hi Bob, > [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > Andrea Thanks for the info, Kia had the belt for 65.00. Now Sat I get to play mechanic. > andreame70 <none@000.com> wrote in news:961926 > _ce2ef6c040716e890ccae58a02fb412d@autoboardz.com: [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Thanks for the info, Kia had the belt for 65.00. Now Sat I get to play > mechanic. After reading all the stories on here I had the belt my 03 Rio with 71k miles replaced this afternoon . Walkout price with tax for the belt only , no waterpumps or other belts was $400 , hated parting with the money but it was a lot cheaper than having the valves etc. replaced. Phil, I think that was a wise decision. I am glad to hear that you took care of it now before it was too late. I heard back from the service center about mine and it is BAD. Not just bad, horrible in fact. At least two pistons are shot, it damaged the head, rings, etc. etc. But slightly on the upside, they found me an engine with only 20K miles on it. They are offering me a warranty that will cover me until after it is paid off in 16 months and they are going to combine all the work done so far and the new engine for a total of $2800. I know it probably sounds ridiculous for me to pay it instead of trading it in, but I am getting it fixed. I spent hours at the dealership today trying to incorporate the $4000 pay off on this one into a new car and being that far upside down, the offers they made just didn’t suit me. I was willing to give a down payment of 2K. There was 500 in cash back and they said they could give me 1K in trade on the Kia and pay it off. This all sounded pretty good, but as I was running the numbers with my calculator, I was coming up with a figure of approx. $300 a month for 60 months (including taxes, title, tags and fees.) They said I was figuring wrong and claimed it would be $300 a month for 72 months. I knew right away that they were fornicating with the numbers somehow to reach this, so I told them I was taking my 2K and getting my Kia fixed. They said I was making a big mistake and even called me hard headed and stubborn (they may be right I suppose) but I walked out.. So, in a few days I will have my little Rio back with a fairly new engine in it. Maybe by the time the timing belt needs to be changed on this one, I will be ready to trade it in, but for now, I still love my little Rio and I am not ready to give up on it just yet. Andre > "bob" <rmh32495@nospamcomcast.net> wrote in message > news:Xns98B5B992DA75Frmh32495comcastnet@216.196.97.136... [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > money but it > was a lot cheaper than having the valves etc. replaced. SignaturePosted at author's request, using http://www.AutoBoardz.com interface Articles individually verified to usenet standards. Visit URL to contact author/report abuse Thread archive: http://www.AutoBoardz.com/Timing-belt-ftopict186310.html > Phil, I think that was a wise decision. I am glad to hear that you > took care of it now before it was too late. > > I heard back from the service center about mine and it is BAD. Not > just bad, horrible in fact. At least two pistons are shot, it damaged > the head, rings, etc. etc. > So, in a few days I will have my little Rio back with a fairly new > engine in it. Maybe by the time the timing belt needs to be changed on > this one, I will be ready to trade it in, but for now, I still love my > little Rio and I am not ready to give up on it just yet. > > Andrea Sorry you had too go through all that , I think you have done the right thing . I do service calls out of mine ( on copiers, printers etc.)A lot of stop and go , opening and closing doors and windows ,I'm a bit rough with it but it gets me to work everyday. Phil > I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are people > driving past the recommemded change point. > > Thanks Bob 179.800 miles and still no belt! >> I am coming up on 60k, do we have to change the timing belt, or are people >> driving past the recommemded change point. >> >> Thanks Bob >179.800 miles and still no belt! It's not an item that gives you any warning. When it breaks, you lose the motor. Pistons meeting valves kind of stuff. I do not believe that changing it every 60k is warranted, but you, my smug friend, are living on borrowed time. CWM Ah men. I can tell you from first hand experience. My friend blew his at 59,991 miles. I changed the belts in both my Sportages, plus the rollers and tension springs. my only mistake was using an aftermarket waterpump. you should change the pump anyway wheile you have it off. I tried to save a few buck, only to have one disintegrate at 70 mph and take out everything with it. guess what, the temp gauge said everything was normal. I put my hand on the radiator after I heard the strange noise the engine was making, stone cold. the engine then ceased.$3700 to rebuild, but I saved $40 on the water pump. ONLY use a Kia water pump! I recently got an 01 Rio that the engine was locked up on. When I took it apart I found bad thing after bad thing. 1st was the spark plugs were destroyed. 2nd I found the timing belt was oose and the timing marks didnt look like they lined up but I couldnt really tell since the motor wouldnt turn more than half a revolution. Well it did jump time and took off EVERY exhaust valve head. Yes it ruined the motor beyond repairs. The replacement motor with 50K on it also has trouble- 1st thing I found was a VERY LOOSE timing belt. Tightening it to proper tension also took out ALL the adjustment in the pulley. My suggestion is to check the timing belt tension with EVERY service interval and adjust as necessary. I have not seen this problem on any other cars. Another silly thing was that you HAVE to use sealant on the flywheel bolts! When I took them out oil seeped out of the crank. They sure have some strange engineering! Good luck on your own cars! -SP |
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