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Car Forum / Land Rover Cars / March 2008Chain saws.
The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of lanes have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is sooner or later not going to be big enough. What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for chainsaws??? Lee D > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of lanes > have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is sooner or > later not going to be big enough. > > What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for > chainsaws??? Watch out we will be on to health and safety again with this thread. Mike > What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for > chainsaws??? http://www.hse.gov.uk/pubns/indg317.pdf Don't appear to need one unless you are a professional using one as part of your work, and even then there's quite a few exemptions. Note that the exemptions include anyone using a chainsaw for the clearance of fallen branches causing obstructions for machines. It's health and safety gorn mad I tells ya!  SignatureBlast off and strike the evil Bydo empire! http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/ >> What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >> chainsaws??? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Don't appear to need one unless you are a professional using one as > part of your work, and even then there's quite a few exemptions. As every tin pot shed is selling a range of chainsaws with no notices regarding certification I'd agree with that. However I'd not be happy using one without proper PPE and at least some training on use, the risks and what is considered essential PPE. They really are lethal machines, even with fast acting chain brakes and the like they can still do serious damage to you when (not if) it kicks the wrong way. SignatureCheers Dave. >>> What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >>> chainsaws??? [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >However I'd not be happy using one without proper PPE and at least some >training on use, the risks and what is considered essential PPE. Depends what you're doing with it. Eye protection (specs) is sensible due to flying woodchips. Safety boots are good if you're working near your feet and a GOOD saftey helmet is almost-essential if working overhead - the chain brake works when the bar nose hits something and causes it to kick back, but overhead it doesn't work until after the bar hits your head... However, I'd not consider a helmet essential for the odd casual sawing a branch across a lane. Most of what you need to do is be well aware of the potential for harm and make damned sure you know where the sharp bit is at all times, especially when the saw's running at more-than-idle. Modern saws all have chain brakes and it's not a bad idea to get into the habit of applying it manually whenever you put the saw down, running or otherwise. I'm a bit leery of "essential PPE". In general, with the exceptions mentioned above, I'd prefer knowledge of how the machine works and what it's likely to do, good awareness of high-risk areas and avoiding having parts of you in dangerous places. TPTB would argue that you need special safety trousers (these have cunning long fibres that tangle in the chain and stop it), full helmet and face mask, boots, gloves, etc. etc. Now, you don't need gloves if both hands are, as they should be, holding the saw handles - you shouldn't ever have your hand near the chain of a live saw. There's a tendency to overdo the safety gear in preference to taking good care in how a thing's used, with the result that people become blasé about the risks, because "the saw can't hurt me, I've got all this gear on". Oh yea it can and sod's law will let it find the weakness in the gear to exploit. I work in the workshop wearing sandals, quite often. I KNOW that if something heavy falls on my foot, it'll hurt, so I take damned good care to know where my feet are and if I do drop something like a hammer I make damned sure I move my feet out of the way. If you have toecap boots, you get used to begin able to kick stuff or drop stuff on them without noticing... until the 70lb concrete block you just dropped lands 2" further back and thus hits the top of your foot, not the toecap... SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! >Depends what you're doing with it. Eye protection (specs) is sensible due >to flying woodchips. Safety boots are good if you're working near your feet [quoted text clipped - 37 lines] >noticing... until the 70lb concrete block you just dropped lands 2" further >back and thus hits the top of your foot, not the toecap... Well said Austin !! Nice to see someone else standing up against the "Nanny State" SignatureMarc Draper > Well said Austin !! > > Nice to see someone else standing up against the "Nanny State" TBH much of this thread has shown the lack of "nanny state", it's the fear of the mostly fictional nanny state that causes people to get over-zealous. There's no need to stand up to nanny state that's not interested in nannying you, as in the case of personal chainsaw users or Austin shuffling about in his workshop in sandals. SignatureBlast off and strike the evil Bydo empire! http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/ >> Well said Austin !! >> [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >interested in nannying you, as in the case of personal chainsaw users >or Austin shuffling about in his workshop in sandals. Oi. I don't shuffle. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! On Tuesday, in article <slrnftcrn7.oja.news06@desktop.tarcus.org.uk> > > Well said Austin !! > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > interested in nannying you, as in the case of personal chainsaw users > or Austin shuffling about in his workshop in sandals. I was working in an office once. To get to the site loos you had to ge through the warehouse--safety footwear and hard hats. I wouldn't go as far as Austin, and remember that some of the stuff is multi-use. For instance, a decent pair of safety boots should be OK for any outdoor work. Maybe even some hiking. Likewise, an approved hard hat is cheap, and if nothing else can keep the rain off. Actually, if you're clearing a tree off the road, a bright yellow hard hat and high-vis jacket is vital, whatever the tools you use. And, while it doesn't give you any legal authority, it does help if you have to stop traffic: people see it and have some confidence you know what you're about. SignatureDavid G. Bell -- SF Fan, Filker, and Punslinger. On the horizon, a carrier task force of the Salvation Navy was turning into the wind, preparing to launch Zeppelins. > To get to the site loos you had to ge through the warehouse--safety > footwear and hard hats. Legally required or just someone with a peaked cap? More likely the latter. I used to work in a supermarket warehouse and in another job, in a sawmill and wood yard, and I never needed anything like that in either. SignatureBlast off and strike the evil Bydo empire! http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/ Ian Rawlings typed: >> To get to the site loos you had to ge through the warehouse--safety >> footwear and hard hats. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > in a sawmill and wood yard, and I never needed anything like that in > either. Depends on the risk. If there was a gantry crane in said warehouse, a hard hat would be pretty much essential wear, and for good reason. Personally, I much prefer the approach of making sure everyone is fully aware of any risks and letting them sort it out themselves, and that's my own approach to risk when I do things for myself (Austin's comments ref chainsaws above are hereby seconded). SignatureRich B Take out the obvious to email me. A life? Cool - where can I download one of those? >>>> What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >>>> chainsaws??? [quoted text clipped - 53 lines] > dropped lands 2" further back and thus hits the top of your foot, not > the toecap... But that only hsappens the once or maybe twice if you don't learn quick. SignatureIf Your specification is vague or imprecise, you'll likely get what you asked for not what you wanted! Do not say it cannot be done, rather what you need to do it! >> I work in the workshop wearing sandals, quite often. I KNOW that if >> something heavy falls on my foot, it'll hurt, so I take damned good [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >But that only hsappens the once or maybe twice if you don't learn quick. so does dropping stuff on yer toe. but knowing that you've got saftey boots makes you careless, 'cos you know it ain't gonna hurt. Until you miss the toecap, or something too heavy for the boots land on yer foot and the toecap cuts yer toes off. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! >>> I work in the workshop wearing sandals, quite often. I KNOW that if >>> something heavy falls on my foot, it'll hurt, so I take damned good [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >toecap, or something too heavy for the boots land on yer foot and the toecap >cuts yer toes off. I saw someone drop a gearbox once, one of the mounts hit just behind the steel toe, nasty. SignatureMark. www.MarkVarleyPhoto.co.uk www.TwistedPhotography.co.uk www.TwistedArts.co.uk www.BeautifulBondage.net >>>>I work in the workshop wearing sandals, quite often. I KNOW that if >>>>something heavy falls on my foot, it'll hurt, so I take damned good [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > I saw someone drop a gearbox once, one of the mounts hit just behind > the steel toe, nasty. That's where things always land! Has anyone actually had something land on the cap itself? .... but they're very good for supporting heavy objects while you reposition your hands. >>>>>I work in the workshop wearing sandals, quite often. I KNOW that if >>>>>something heavy falls on my foot, it'll hurt, so I take damned good [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > the cap itself? .... but they're very good for supporting heavy objects > while you reposition your hands. Yep on odd occasions and the reason it hit the toe cap rather than the instep ...because I was watching what was occuring and was able to move out of the way enough to avoid injury. I have taken enough folk to hospital with injuries to know that an industrial working environment is safer if you watch two things. 1) what you are doing 2) what other folk are doing all the hiviz vests safety boots hats gloves and sundry paraphenalia will not stop accidents just mitigate them - a sure sign of a clueless twat on H&S is insistance on Hiviz as if it was a magic charm in enviroments where it makes no difference. Derek Dougal typed: >>>>> I work in the workshop wearing sandals, quite often. I KNOW that >>>>> if something heavy falls on my foot, it'll hurt, so I take damned [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > land on the cap itself? .... but they're very good for supporting > heavy objects while you reposition your hands. Or standing on with your other heel if you need to pee. SignatureRich B Take out the obvious to email me. A life? Cool - where can I download one of those? > >>>>I work in the workshop wearing sandals, quite often. I KNOW that if > >>>>something heavy falls on my foot, it'll hurt, so I take damned good [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > on the cap itself? .... but they're very good for supporting heavy > objects while you reposition your hands. The fun bit is trying to balance on one leg while you try to position your foot in the vice fastened to the bench to squeeze the boot sideways to release your toes when the cap gets partly squashed and traps your toes. Not nice. Martin GbH typed: >>>>> What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >>>>> chainsaws??? [quoted text clipped - 57 lines] > But that only hsappens the once or maybe twice if you don't learn > quick. "Oops, there goes the other one!" SignatureRich B Take out the obvious to email me. A life? Cool - where can I download one of those? >Modern saws all have chain brakes and it's not a bad idea to get into the >habit of applying it manually whenever you put the saw down, running or >otherwise. You were sort of doing OK until you got to this bit. The chain brake should be everytime you move your feet and I would suggest at anytime when you aren't actually sawing. >Safety boots are good if you're working near your feet Safety boots are good if you're working with chainsaws period. >and a GOOD saftey helmet is almost-essential if working overhead - the chain >brake works when the bar nose hits something and causes it to kick back, but >overhead it doesn't work until after the bar hits your head... Working with a chainsaw over head is an unsafe practice, most of the time the saw should have 3 points of contact ( two hands and a brace, either your thigh or the passive bit of the work piece) as well as the bit being cut. >However, I'd not consider a helmet essential for the odd casual sawing a >branch across a lane. I would because the visor and earmuffs hang of it. >Most of what you need to do is be well aware of the potential for harm and >make damned sure you know where the sharp bit is at all times, especially >when the saw's running at more-than-idle. There are only two modes of running a chainsaw engine, idle and full throttle, the work is what controls the revs. >Modern saws all have chain brakes and it's not a bad idea to get into the >habit of applying it manually whenever you put the saw down, running or >otherwise. It's actually a good habit to test the chainsaw brake at full throttle on first start and always when the engine is running and one hand is off the saw. >TPTB would argue that you need special safety trousers (these have cunning >long fibres that tangle in the chain and stop it), full helmet and face >mask, boots, gloves, etc. etc. The safety trouser are very effective, I would feel uncomfortable not wearing them. Prior to their introduction I made several visits to A&E with people who had gashed their left knee/thigh area. > Now, you don't need gloves if both hands >are, as they should be, holding the saw handles - you shouldn't ever have >your hand near the chain of a live saw. It took me 30 years before I learnt this lesson the hard way. Like you I became accustomed to working with no gloves, I adopted all the other safety equipment ( Hat visor and muffs in 74 when I first bought my own brush cutter though I did use a danarm 110 before, trousers and kevlar boots by 1981) as they became available but never got into the habit of using gloves. Anyone starting now I would advise to use all this kit and become accustomed to it at the outset, it all works to protect you and I have seen instances of how all the bits work in the workplace. > If you have toecap boots, you >get used to begin able to kick stuff I'll agree with that bit, many's the time I kick logs out of my way and only notice how hard it is when I'm doing hobby stuff in trainers. AJH >Working with a chainsaw over head is an unsafe practice, most of the >time the saw should have 3 points of contact ( two hands and a brace, >either your thigh or the passive bit of the work piece) as well as the >bit being cut. But what about trying to cut something that happens to be overhead? I agree, in general - ANY overhead work is more risky. But sometimes, there isn't an option. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! >I agree, in general - ANY overhead work is more risky. But sometimes, there >isn't an option. Firstly I didn't say I never did it ;-) but if you stop and think about it there are often other ways around the problem, so there won't be many occasion that warrant using a chainsaw overhead. One of the things about mentioning unsafe practices is to make someone stop and think, then perhaps proceed more cautiously. It's a simple fact that should you choose to work with a chainsaw above chest height you will not be assessed as competent in its use! AJH >It's a simple fact that should you choose to work with a chainsaw >above chest height you will not be assessed as competent in its use! See, that's where I have a problem. It is possible to mitigate the risk (by using suitable safety gear), and to work competently if you take the right care and precautions. And sometimes, it's not practical to avoid a risky situation. Obviously, if you can avoid it you do, since it's easier to work at waist-level or below than overhead. But if to avoid working overhead for 5 minutes you spend a day getting an access platform in to do 5 minutes work, then that's silly. And if as a result you leave a road blocked which could have been cleared a day earlier, the consequences are out of proportion. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! Austin Shackles typed: >>>> What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >>>> chainsaws??? [quoted text clipped - 53 lines] > dropped lands 2" further back and thus hits the top of your foot, not > the toecap... Agreed x2. Sometimes PPE makes people complacent and can do more harm than good. That's why HSE always insist that PPE is used as a "last resort" when all other control measures have been put in place and a residual risk exists. One area where I insist on PPE for myself is always wrapping a towel round my waist when I shave with a straight razor. The consequences of wet hands and a clumsy action are just too awful to contemplate. SignatureRich B Take out the obvious to email me. A life? Cool - where can I download one of those? >One area where I insist on PPE for myself is always wrapping a towel round >my waist when I shave with a straight razor. The consequences of wet hands >and a clumsy action are just too awful to contemplate. I don't use such dangerous items. saftey razor or electric shaver... SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! Austin Shackles typed: >> One area where I insist on PPE for myself is always wrapping a towel >> round my waist when I shave with a straight razor. The consequences [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > saftey razor or electric shaver... Even a lecky one could give it a nasty knock ... SignatureRich B Take out the obvious to email me. A life? Cool - where can I download one of those? >Austin Shackles typed: >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >Even a lecky one could give it a nasty knock ... but the risk of inadvertent autobobbitting would, I venture to suggest, be practically non-existent. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! >> What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >> chainsaws??? [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > >It's health and safety gorn mad I tells ya! If you are using one yourself, on your own property it's not necessary. If you are going to use one where the public have access then you really need liability insurance, which you won't get without the certificate. Case in point - One club I belong to frequently have voluntary work parties to maintain grounds they own. The organisers stipulate that no-one may use any power tool on the site, except a certificated and insured person, as it a requirement of the club's insurance - and they adhere to this rigidly. On the other hand, another club I belong to also have similar working parties, but they do not impose any such rules, and if a tree needs "attention" someone with a chainsaw(and there's quite a few of us) just does it! In this case we just apply common sense and awareness, in keeping with the risks involved with powered equipment. Felling and limbing trees is easier by chainsaw, but the real bonus of the chainsaw is when bucking or chopping up the timber into usable or manageable pieces. Or it is in my experience! Actually there's a very good chainsaw manual available to download from Stihl's website. Not only does it cover maintenance of the machine but also some good guidance to new chainsaw users. I don't have the website to hand but it's not hard to find. Neil (Reply via NG please) > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of lanes > have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is sooner or [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lee D Sorry to hear your hand held chopper is not big enough > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of lanes > have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is sooner or [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lee D never had a lot of faith in choppers - a nice folding saw or bowsaw floats my boat. Btw we do have a chainsaw a handy McCulloch like this un http://tinyurl.com/yowkax but I seem to spend forever resharpening the chain when I use it . Derek Lee_D typed: > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of > lanes have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lee D Only if you use them for work - oops, wrong thread. SignatureRich B Take out the obvious to email me. A life? Cool - where can I download one of those? "Lee_D" <newsgroupsNOSPAM@NOSPAMlrproject.com> wrote in message > or whatever for chainsaws??? > > Lee D Three essentials: 1. A chain brake (they weren't fitted to the cheapies - don't know if it is a legal requirement these days). 2. A bearing at the tip of the chain bar otherwise the friction between the chain and the chain bar causes severe overheating and rapid wear to both. Without a bearing neither are likely to last more than a few minutes if you attempt to tackle a hardwood obstruction to your route. 3. A good design for quick adjustment with secure locking of the chain bar position to maintain chain tension. My cheapie required constant adjustment due to a combination of the chain stretching and the chain bar slipping in its clamp. Don't forget the chain oil and the right size sharpening file - with a proper handle on the tang! -- Fred Fred typed: > Don't forget ...the right size sharpening file - with a > proper handle on the tang! Oh yes ... SignatureRich B Take out the obvious to email me. A life? Cool - where can I download one of those? >Don't forget the chain oil and the right size sharpening file - with a >proper handle on the tang! If you're not an expert, I'd recommend the cunning sharpening jig thing to put the file into, as well. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! >>Don't forget the chain oil and the right size sharpening file - with a >>proper handle on the tang! > > If you're not an expert, I'd recommend the cunning sharpening jig thing to > put the file into, as well. you reading my mind again Austin - I got that one from machine mart makes it easier http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/zor16265-chain-file-guide-setI notice they got powered ones an all hmmmDerek >>>Don't forget the chain oil and the right size sharpening file - with a >>>proper handle on the tang! [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > you reading my mind again Austin - I got that one from machine mart > makes it easier notice they got powered ones an all hmmmDerek feckin mickeysnot outlook correected url----------------- http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/zor16265-chain-file-guide-set > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of > lanes have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is > sooner or later not going to be big enough. > > What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for > chainsaws??? We now carry a small bowsaw, fairly small, light and easy to use. We also have a small chopper, but rarely use it nowadays. Chain saw's a bit of overkill I reckon, unless you're using it regularly or really need to shift a tree. ;) SignaturePaul - xxx '96/'97 Landrover Discovery 300 Tdi 'Big and Butch' '98 Suzuki DR 200 Djebel 'Small but perfectly formed' Dyna Tech Cro-Mo comp "When I feel fit enough' >> The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of >> lanes have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is >> sooner or later not going to be big enough. >> >> What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >> chainsaws??? I've got one and have always been very careful with it so no problems so far. However, a patient came into the hospital where I work the other day having taken two fingers clean off with one. No pain at all, he says, walking around like nothing had happened. He didn't feel any pain at all when it happened and even drove himself to the hospital. The pain kicked in when he had his x-ray done despite a morphine shot on arrival. The saw mangled the ends of the fingers so there was nothing left to sew back on again unfortunately. He was a professional forester. I understand there are two types of chain - one with a "blank" in between each blade which clears the work groove and the other which is all teeth but slightly more prone to jamming and kickback. I've used both with no trouble, but please be very very careful with them. The main problem appears to be if the tip of the blade or the top of the blade strikes the work, then it'll kick back. Also, they can blunt easily, and dirt in the work, or getting the blade too near the ground will result in a blunt saw, it only takes a second or two to blunt one to the point of uselessness. TonyB > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of lanes have > caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is sooner or later not [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lee D Don't be tempted to get a battery one. I learned the hard way. Spotted a Black and Decker one. Thought it would be good for smallish work and as it was compact could be stored in the back if going away. Also on Camps can be used if charged before going away. I even checked reviews that it was OK, and everyone was complimentary stating the obvious, it wouldn't fell a whole tree but good for branches and round the garden. Well it is basically a souped up pruning saw. B&D and the reviewers idea of small work is obviously different to mine. Is ok for anything up to small branch size but beyond that the battery just goes. Part of a tree feel down in my garden, just a side section high up of branch so not even any trunk. Once I got beyond the ends I was having to recharge after 25 mins max. Gutted. >The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of lanes have >caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is sooner or later not >going to be big enough. > >What is this malarky with a certificate / licence or whatever for >chainsaws??? In most leisure situations a decent bow saw is as quick as a chain saw, a whole lot cheaper and never fails to start ;) > > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of > > lanes have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > In most leisure situations a decent bow saw is as quick as a chain > saw, a whole lot cheaper and never fails to start ;) Heh ... I wouldn't say never ... second time I needed to use ours in anger the chuffin' blade snapped! Mind, it was a tad rusty ... ;) SignaturePaul - xxx '96/'97 Landrover Discovery 300 Tdi 'Big and Butch' '98 Suzuki DR 200 Djebel 'Small but perfectly formed' Dyna Tech Cro-Mo comp "When I feel fit enough' >In most leisure situations a decent bow saw is as quick as a chain >saw, a whole lot cheaper and never fails to start ;) I would say a silky pull saw beats a bow saw for most jobs as it has no frame to limit the cut, much more expensive though and easier to snap. I think a sharp 1kg axe still takes a lot of beating up to a foot diameter. AJH >>In most leisure situations a decent bow saw is as quick as a chain >>saw, a whole lot cheaper and never fails to start ;) [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >snap. I think a sharp 1kg axe still takes a lot of beating up to a >foot diameter. nah, 1Kg is way too light for that size stuff. summat about 4½ or 5lb... and SHARP. Got to admire the axes the axe-show-off-team use (you know, the ones who go around the shows) at close hand once and they are beautiful, mirror polish on the blade and sharp enough to shave with. Their 2-man saw is impressive, too - I even got to work one end of that, they were after volunteers to have a go. Somewhere in the shed I've got a couple of those, but mine are rust and blunt and theirs is shiny and sharp - the demo of cutting an approx 1ft log, starting with the saw on the ground and racing the chainsaw is something to see - About the only thing you can say is that the chainsaw only takes 1 bloke to operate it :-) SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! > Got to admire the axes the axe-show-off-team use (you know, the ones who go > around the shows) at close hand once and they are beautiful, mirror polish > on the blade and sharp enough to shave with. I was out watching some world-class wood chopping competitions last weekend - it was impressive. The top competitors can give the rookies a 20 second head start and still be first to chop through a 14" diameter willow log. > I was out watching some world-class wood chopping competitions last > weekend - it was impressive. The top competitors can give the rookies a > 20 second head start and still be first to chop through a 14" diameter > willow log. Have a search for "v8 chainsaw" on yewchewb for an exercise in excess, from the yanks of course! Slightly less than 2 seconds to cut through a log that's somewhere between 18 and 24 inches in diameter. Not bad for a hand-held chainsaw, even if it needs four hands attached to two huge blokes. SignatureBlast off and strike the evil Bydo empire! http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/ >>> In most leisure situations a decent bow saw is as quick as a chain >>> saw, a whole lot cheaper and never fails to start ;) >> I would say a silky pull saw beats a bow saw for most jobs as it has >> no frame to limit the cut, much more expensive though and easier to >> snap. I think a sharp 1kg axe still takes a lot of beating up to a >> foot diameter. This is the answer http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOGJLoVi-Bg SignaturePete M - OMF#9 Range Rover V8 Turbo Scorpio Ultima 24v "Professional Petrolhead" > This is the answer > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOGJLoVi-Bg Yep, that's the one, the V8 chainsaw I just posted about! A bit excessive for lane clearances ;-) SignatureBlast off and strike the evil Bydo empire! http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/ >> This is the answer >> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOGJLoVi-Bg > > Yep, that's the one, the V8 chainsaw I just posted about! A bit > excessive for lane clearances ;-) Coming late to this thread, but what the heck. I have found for general/camping use the best combination is a folding pruning saw (About 9-10" blade) and a good old machete. Two weekend ago I took the top out of a sycamore with this lot cutting anything up to 6" without a problem. Clearing it up, that is a completely different problem. Giles > Coming late to this thread, but what the heck. I have found for > general/camping use the best combination is a folding pruning saw (About > 9-10" blade) and a good old machete. So far I've not needed owt more than a bowsaw and a folding saw, but then that's for occasional hacking on a lane, for cutting the firewood I bought a cheap electric chainsaw, if I used the bowsaw for firewood I'd be so hot I wouldn't need the bloody fire! SignatureBlast off and strike the evil Bydo empire! http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/ >> Coming late to this thread, but what the heck. I have found for >> general/camping use the best combination is a folding pruning saw (About [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >I bought a cheap electric chainsaw, if I used the bowsaw for firewood >I'd be so hot I wouldn't need the bloody fire! yebbut, that's the point, innit. Logs keep you warm several times: 1) felling the tree 2) carting it home 3) sawing it up and splitting the logs 4) burning it. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! > yebbut, that's the point, innit. Logs keep you warm several times: > > 1) felling the tree > 2) carting it home > 3) sawing it up and splitting the logs > 4) burning it. You forgot "dropping stuff on your toes or snagging your hand and hopping around in a rage", I'd suggest that goes inbetween 1 and 2. And 2 and 3, plus 3 and 4. SignatureBlast off and strike the evil Bydo empire! http://youtube.com/user/tarcus69 http://www.flickr.com/photos/tarcus/ >>>> In most leisure situations a decent bow saw is as quick as a chain >>>> saw, a whole lot cheaper and never fails to start ;) [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOGJLoVi-Bg and having got that, this is what you do with the regular chainsaws: http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=DDWqJe1dCgY SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! >>I would say a silky pull saw beats a bow saw for most jobs as it has >>no frame to limit the cut, much more expensive though and easier to [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >nah, 1Kg is way too light for that size stuff. summat about 4½ or 5lb... >and SHARP. You're right, I carry a 4.5lb Elwell, the bigger axe is much better and it keeps you further out of danger, but for a general tool kit the boy scout size is easier to store. As I generally have axe and power saw I seldom need it but it does have a big advantage over any sawblade and that's when the tension in a limb is unexpected. The advantage the crosscut saws have over the chainsaw is about 1/3 the kerf! In 1978 I was working with a 78 year old who would challenge youngsters to fell 5" oaks. From a cold start he invariably beat the chainsaw. AJH >>>I would say a silky pull saw beats a bow saw for most jobs as it has >>>no frame to limit the cut, much more expensive though and easier to [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] >youngsters to fell 5" oaks. From a cold start he invariably beat the >chainsaw. yeah, well, you have an overhead in cold-starting the saw. I doubt he'd beat them in felling 10 such trees in succession. SignatureAustin Shackles. www.ddol-las.net my opinions are just that Travel The Galaxy! Meet Fascinating Life Forms... ------------------------------------------------\ >> http://www.schlockmercenary.com/ << \ ...and Kill them. a webcartoon by Howard Tayler; I like it, maybe you will too! >Their 2-man saw is impressive, too - I even got to work one end of that, >they were after volunteers to have a go. Somewhere in the shed I've got a >couple of those, but mine are rust and blunt and theirs is shiny and sharp - >the demo of cutting an approx 1ft log, starting with the saw on the ground >and racing the chainsaw is something to see - About the only thing you can >say is that the chainsaw only takes 1 bloke to operate it :-) My grandfather had (and regularly used) a 2-man chainsaw. They are frightening. Regards, Simonm. Signaturesimonm|at|muircom|dot|demon|.|c|oh|dot|u|kay SIMON MUIR, BRISTOL UK EUROPEANS AGAINST THE EU http://www.eurofaq.freeuk.com/ GT250A'76 R80/RT'86 110CSW TDi'88 www.kc3ltd.co.uk/profile/eurofollie/ > My grandfather had (and regularly used) a 2-man chainsaw. They are > frightening. I had one (a Teles) but lent it to a college and they lost it! We occasionally use a two man planking device which is two Stihls joined by a common bar, it's still frightening though. AJH >> My grandfather had (and regularly used) a 2-man chainsaw. They are >> frightening. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >We occasionally use a two man planking device which is two Stihls joined >by a common bar, it's still frightening though. The web is a weird thing. A few years ago I looked for 2-man chainsaw pics, and found a whole ONE. I looked today and there are dozens. I was trying to identify which one they had. I think it was North American (it definitely had handlebar-type handles at both ends) and it had a really long bar, probably six feet or more. It was probably lend-lease or immediately post-war (most of their kit was), but it's a long time ago that I saw it... I still can't imagine having the nerve to be on the unpowered end! Regards, Simonm. Signaturesimonm|at|muircom|dot|demon|.|c|oh|dot|u|kay SIMON MUIR, BRISTOL UK EUROPEANS AGAINST THE EU http://www.eurofaq.freeuk.com/ GT250A'76 R80/RT'86 110CSW TDi'88 www.kc3ltd.co.uk/profile/eurofollie/ > We occasionally use a two man planking device which is two Stihls joined > by a common bar, it's still frightening though. Know anything about planking and band-mills instead of saws Andrew ? I have some nice 9" sycamore trunks I'd like to convert ! Steve > Know anything about planking and band-mills instead of saws Andrew ? I > have some nice 9" sycamore trunks I'd like to convert ! A bit, I ran a woodmizer for a friend while he was away in Nigeria making a mint on seismic surveys. For a few small butts I'd run them into a sawmill with a bandsaw and have them contract sawn. The small portable bandmills probably cost over GBP300/day and it's hard work getting a worthwhile throughput. Have a look to see if the woodlots advertising service still functions near you. Punters tended to be optimistic about what they where going to use their sawn wood for and I'll bet there's a lot of planked wood slowly rotting away in some back gardens. Truth be known I still have some nice yew boards which would have been worth a lot more as round timber exported for veneer and I know Ill not make anything with them. Sycamore needs converting very soon after felling, the loose sawdust must be brushed off the boards and they season better stacked vertically rather than conventionally stickered. AJH > Have a look to see if the woodlots advertising service still functions > near you. Seems to be just SE. > Sycamore needs converting very soon after felling, the loose sawdust must > be brushed off the boards and they season better stacked vertically > rather than conventionally stickered. Thanks for the tip. These things will just about fit under my 12" bandsaw, maybe a 3 TPI skip tooth might do 'em ? Steve >These things will just about fit under my 12" bandsaw, maybe a 3 TPI >skip tooth might do 'em ? We would take the first slab freehand with a chainsaw, sometimes top and bottom, to get it under the head. Can you increase the set? Use a small wooden wedge to keep the cut open behind the blade. Wood has tensions in it, think of it as growing by adding successive condoms over the previous years growth. AJH > We would take the first slab freehand with a chainsaw, sometimes top > and bottom, to get it under the head. I'll need to make a fitment for the (electric) chainsaw, but on small logs that should work OK shouldn't it ? > Can you increase the set? Using a handsaw-set or do you need something chunkier for bandsaws ? Use a small wooden wedge to keep the cut > open behind the blade. Wood has tensions in it, think of it as growing > by adding successive condoms over the previous years growth. An interesting analogy ! Steve >> We would take the first slab freehand with a chainsaw, sometimes top >> and bottom, to get it under the head. >I'll need to make a fitment for the (electric) chainsaw, but on small >logs that should work OK shouldn't it ? I don't think any fitment is necessary, just chalk a line and follow it. Electric chainsaw will take a bit of time! >> Can you increase the set? > >Using a handsaw-set or do you need something chunkier for bandsaws ? Our narrow bands were only 1"ish and they were set with a simple pliers thing, one left one unset one right, und so weiter. They need to be done accurately and then sharpened (even out of the box) to cut straight. The bands were only 10quid, I wonder if a saw doctor would make one to fit your machine. Broad bandsaws always seem to be swage set (ends of teeth bludgeoned into a chisel). AJH > The survivalist nutter in me says I NEED a chain saw. A number of lanes > have caused the odd delay as my little hand held chopper is sooner or [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Lee D Lee Apologies if any of this has been said much later in this, highly amusing, thread: I looked into buying a chainsaw and found the following: you cannot buy a top hand saw (i.e. tree surgeon's saw for one handed use) without the appropriate bits of paper. This should not be a problem as they are terribly dangerous and not what you want. A Hat with good eye protection is essential, gloves, trousers and boots are a good investment. Trousers need only protect the front and sides of the leg in single user situations - apparently full leg protection is more for forestry work when the possibility of contact with someone else exists. YOu can buy a two-handed saw without any demonstration of competance and you can hire one from a very few places without a certificate, maybe none now. Buy a Stihl if you can afford it. McCulloch/Ryobi/Electrolux(?) are all worth what you pay for them. Be realistic about the length of bar you need - you may be able to cut up an 18" diameter tree but can you then move the logs created or do you carry enough fuel to cut it into portable fragements? Practice using the saw with the bar offset from your leg - it feels much more comfortable using the saw with the bar lined up with your right leg and that lovely Femoral artery! In the end I never did buy a chainsaw - much to the relief of SWMBO ;-) Richard > Buy a Stihl if you can afford it. And buy an Oleo Mac if you can't afford a Stihl. >> Buy a Stihl if you can afford it. > > And buy an Oleo Mac if you can't afford a Stihl. Do they pay flashers in NZ then? ;-) >>> Buy a Stihl if you can afford it. >> >> And buy an Oleo Mac if you can't afford a Stihl. > > Do they pay flashers in NZ then? Nah, that's just a SOT trait :p Learn to respect a Saw as they are Dangerous tools for Fools you should really go & learn to use one there are enough Nutters flying round the lanes with out Chains Saws Regards Skinty >>>> Buy a Stihl if you can afford it. >>> [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Nah, that's just a SOT trait :p > Learn to respect a Saw as they are Dangerous tools That was where this thread started. Luckily chainsaws tend to injure only the user - unlike motor vehicles. > That was where this thread started. Luckily chainsaws tend to injure > only the user - unlike motor vehicles. Darwin's principles in operation on the gene pool :-) |
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