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Car Forum / Land Rover Cars / May 2008Axle Oil Seals in 90
All, Some help for the inexperienced please. 1986 ex MOD 90..... I need to replace the wheel bearings on a 1986 90 with drums on the rear axle. I have found two differing pieces of information relating to the oil seals. It would appear that there may be one or two per side. How can I identify if I need the one or two without taking the axle apart? If it is two, are they the same part number which I think is: - RTC3511 Rear Hub Seal. I have seen reference to FRC8222 Rear Outer Hub Seal. Many thanks RichardB > All, > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > RichardB To be honest, i always use 2 anyway. Those seals always seem perticually flimsy to me!  SignatureMark 1996 90 300tdi 1987 RR V8 EFI 2007 Golf GT http://www.mozilla.com/firefox/ - Firefox Rules! http://fireftp.mozdev.org/ - FTP Plugin for Firefox http://ietab.mozdev.org/ - IE tab. Get Windows updates in Firefox >> All, >> [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > Those seals always seem perticually flimsy to me! Mark, Can you tell me where you put the second seal. The HBOL only shows placement if one is used? I assume you use the same part also. Thanks for the quick response!! RichardB > Can you tell me where you put the second seal. The HBOL only shows > placement if one is used? This is it FRC3988 http://www.paddockspares.com/pp/DEFENDER/Axle/Gasket_-_drive_flange_(aka_hub_gas ket)_-_rear_axle_to_KA930455.html I just stuck 2 together. SignatureMark 1996 90 300tdi 1987 RR V8 EFI 2007 Golf GT http://www.mozilla.com/firefox/ - Firefox Rules! http://fireftp.mozdev.org/ - FTP Plugin for Firefox http://ietab.mozdev.org/ - IE tab. Get Windows updates in Firefox >> Can you tell me where you put the second seal. The HBOL only shows >> placement if one is used? [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I just stuck 2 together. Bad practice! It reduces the capacity of the bolted joint - specifically by making it more prone to relax after initial tightening. i.e. you'll lose more than the expected reduction in bolt tension and may end up with insufficient to keep the joint tight. One paper gasket is enough. >>> Can you tell me where you put the second seal. The HBOL only shows >>> placement if one is used? [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > may end up with insufficient to keep the joint tight. One paper gasket > is enough. Gents, I thought that what I had read was about rear hub seals and not gaskets? Some axles have two seals whilst some models only one. I am trying to sort out which my early 90 axle needs as I have found an outer hub seal mentioned as well as the inner one. The inner one is RTC3511 and the outer FRC8222 and as Mark say FRC3988 is the drive flange gasket. Do I just need the inner one or do I need both? Thanks, RichardB >>>> Can you tell me where you put the second seal. The HBOL only shows >>>> placement if one is used? [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > RichardB More ... There are two oil seals - one inboard of the inner bearing and one outboard of the outer bearing plus the paper gasket for the drive flange. I'm mailing you a piece of the manual, Richard. > > Gents, > > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > > > Do I just need the inner one or do I need both? > More ... > > There are two oil seals - one inboard of the inner bearing and one > outboard of the outer bearing plus the paper gasket for the drive flange. If you can find the axle number under the crud then you won't need to strip it to the one/s you want. Up to axle number 22S08283B only has one seal RTC3511 and the same hub nut lockwasher as the series. From axle number 22S08284B there are two seals as Dougal says, FRC8221 inner and FRC8222 outer which runs on a special spacer (FRC8227) between the bearing and the inner hub nut. This is similar to, if not the same, as the early Disco with a flat on the lockwasher and stub axle. The wheel bearings are the same for both types (RTC3429 which is superceded to STC4382) but the stub axles are different. If you can't find the axle number, you will only have to remove the hub drive plate and the first hub nut as the type of lockwasher will tell you which one it is. The one with the tag is the early one and the one with the flat is the later. HTH Martin >>>Gents, >>> [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > HTH Martin Just a thought, Martin ... can you see enough of the end of the stub axle to determine which version you've got? It'll save disturbing the nut if you can. > >>>Gents, > >>> [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > axle to determine which version you've got? It'll save disturbing the > nut if you can. Good thinking, I should have thought of that. Yes, of course you can see the flat or groove whichever on the stub, no need to see the lockwasher as the stub sticks out past the nuts. Old timer's disease, I'm losing it. :-) Martin >> Just a thought, Martin ... can you see enough of the end of the stub >> axle to determine which version you've got? It'll save disturbing the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Martin So, If I have understood this story so far I need to remove the Hub Driving Member / Flange and I will be able to see the end of the stub axle. If it is flat I need the gear for two oil seals if it is round I need one....Simple when you know! Really appreciate the help gents. RichardB >>> Just a thought, Martin ... can you see enough of the end of the stub >>> axle to determine which version you've got? It'll save disturbing the [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > > RichardB Thinking even more about it (look at the sectioned view that I sent you) - if you have an outer seal it, too, will be visible with the drive flange off. The absence of the outer seal doesn't mean, of course, that it wasn't made with one which was never been replaced on some later occasion! >> So, If I have understood this story so far I need to remove the Hub >> Driving Member / Flange and I will be able to see the end of the stub [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > The absence of the outer seal doesn't mean, of course, that it wasn't > made with one which was never been replaced on some later occasion! I'll have a look for both the seal and the type of stub axle - should be conclusive then - in theory at least.... Have to be a good mechanic and not drip oil all over the new drive when I get started! RichardB > >> Just a thought, Martin ... can you see enough of the end of the stub > >> axle to determine which version you've got? It'll save disturbing the [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > > RichardB I probably did not explain it right. If you look at the end of the stub axle one has a section of thread missing as a chord on a circle (about one sixth of the circumference) and the early type with only one seal has a notch cut out about 1/4" wide in line with the axle just like the old Series 1,2 and 3 type. Can you make sense of that? :-) And if you remove the drive plate you can see the outer seal on the later type with two. The axle number is usually stamped towards the top of the case on the longer section in numbers and letters about 1/2" high. Martin > If you look at the end of the stub axle > one has a section of thread missing as a chord on a circle (about one sixth > of the circumference) and the early type with only one seal has a notch cut > out about 1/4" wide in line with the axle just like the old Series 1,2 and 3 > type. Can you make sense of that? :-) Like this - http://www.paddockspares.com/pp/DEFENDER/Axle/images/frc8002.jpg Or this - http://www.paddockspares.com/pp/DEFENDER/Axle/images/217352.jpg SignatureMark 1996 90 300tdi 1987 RR V8 EFI 2007 Golf GT http://www.mozilla.com/firefox/ - Firefox Rules! http://fireftp.mozdev.org/ - FTP Plugin for Firefox http://ietab.mozdev.org/ - IE tab. Get Windows updates in Firefox >> If you look at the end of the stub axle >> one has a section of thread missing as a chord on a circle (about one [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Or this - > http://www.paddockspares.com/pp/DEFENDER/Axle/images/217352.jpg Thanks for that Mark. I can see exactly what is need now. I'll have a look at the notch / grove as well as the axle number.Life with a Land Rover does get complicated sometimes. My problem is that working from home I get itchy feet and want to and do stuff instead of what I should be doing.... RichardB >>> Gents, >>> [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > > HTH Martin Martin, Good information thanks. Not likely to find the number under the multiple layers of waxoyl and the like. I will have a look though. Any idea where on the axle I will find it? RichardB >>>>> Can you tell me where you put the second seal. The HBOL only shows >>>>> placement if one is used? [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > > I'm mailing you a piece of the manual, Richard. Dougal, Many thanks for the Email. Just what I needed! Just need the hub spanner to see what lurks in my axle. Richard > Bad practice! Im good at that. :) SignatureMark 1996 90 300tdi 1987 RR V8 EFI 2007 Golf GT http://www.mozilla.com/firefox/ - Firefox Rules! http://fireftp.mozdev.org/ - FTP Plugin for Firefox http://ietab.mozdev.org/ - IE tab. Get Windows updates in Firefox |
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