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Car Forum / Mazda / Mazda Miata / January 2006Wheel weight?
I am looking for a new set of wheels and tires for my '95 and can't find any OEM one locally for a reasonable price. I don't really care if they are 14" or 15" and am planning on putting Falken Ziex's on them or perhaps Bridgestone Traction TA's... Meaning that I am not looking to the ultimate in performance, but rather a very good value. Tirerack has some wheels that I like but many they are quite heavy. The 14" OEM wheels weight in at about 11-11.5lbs (13lbs for the '99 14"). The 15" OEM are 13lbs. Tirerack has the SportEdition D5 that weights 12.8/15.4lbs for 14/15" respectively. And the Borbet CA weights 16lbs for the 14" (15" not listed). These wheels are under $70 each. I like the styling of the Borbet CA's and think it provides a modern look that still manages to reflect the roaster spirit with its spokes. I also think that the painted finish on the Borbet is higher quality and doesn't look cheap like the Sport Editions. But if I go with the Borbet CA am I going to regret the added weight? Or should I forget about looks and just go for the price/weight leader of the 9.3lb Kosei K-1 TS at $119 each? All comments welcome, I can take it ;) Thank you. http://www.miata.net/faq/wheel_weights.html > Or should I forget > about looks and just go for the price/weight leader of the 9.3lb Kosei K-1 > TS at $119 each? See: http://www.good-win-racing.com/mazda/miata/title.html?toparea=Miata%20199 0%2d2005&catname=Alloy%20Wheels&titlename=Wheels (watch the line wrap) Goodwin has reasonable prices on strong, light wheels. The Heliums may still be on sale for $89.  SignatureLanny Chambers '94C, St. Louis http://www.hummingbirds.net/alignment.html >I am looking for a new set of wheels and tires for my '95 and can't find any >OEM one locally for a reasonable price. I don't really care if they are 14" [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >I like but many they are quite heavy. The 14" OEM wheels weight in at about >11-11.5lbs (13lbs for the '99 14"). The 15" OEM are 13lbs. The 15" Enkei was 15. So were the 15" 6-spokes. Mazda also put 18 lb 16" OEM wheels on the 2002 SE. It is all essentially the same car. > Tirerack has >the SportEdition D5 that weights 12.8/15.4lbs for 14/15" respectively. And [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >quality and doesn't look cheap like the Sport Editions. But if I go with >the Borbet CA am I going to regret the added weight? I do not know that Mazda was deluged by 2002 SE owners regretting the added weight. Also, do not forget that wheels are only a small part of unsprung weight. The tires add a lot to it (and tires on a 14" wheel are likely to be many lb lighter than on a 16" one.) The brakes, shocks, and suspension elements add more unsprung weight. Frankly, I doubt whether I would really notice if someone put wheels weighing another 10 lb each on my Miata. ;) I might, but I sure do not guarantee it. > Or should I forget >about looks and just go for the price/weight leader of the 9.3lb Kosei K-1 >TS at $119 each? How about the 1995 M-Edition BBS at 12 lb and $900 each? > All comments welcome, I can take it ;) Why not just go for the Borbets that you like? Leon SignatureLeon van Dommelen :) Bozo, the White 96 Sebring Miata .) rammm@dommelen.net http://www.dommelen.net/miata EXIT THE INTERSTATES (Jamie Jensen) > The 15" Enkei was 15. So were the 15" 6-spokes. Mazda also put 18 lb 16" OEM > wheels on the 2002 SE. It is all essentially the same car. Well, technically, the 15" Enkei was 14.5 pounds on the '96M and '97 STO. Mazda never reached 15 pounds on any of their alloy wheels until they went to 16". > I do not know that Mazda was deluged by 2002 SE owners regretting the added > weight. Probably not, though anyone who is really concerned with wheel weight probably swapped them for something with less weight. > Also, do not forget that wheels are only a small part of unsprung weight. > The tires add a lot to it (and tires on a 14" wheel are likely to be many > lb lighter than on a 16" one.) The brakes, shocks, and suspension elements > add more unsprung weight. Frankly, I doubt whether I would really notice > if someone put wheels weighing another 10 lb each on my Miata. ;) I might, > but I sure do not guarantee it. I think that you would notice it. I drove two '96M editions within minutes of each other. One car had a new set of RE-71 tires on the 14.5 Enkeis. The other miata had worn-out Toyos T-1's on the 15" BBS wheels. This was probably a bit more than a 10 pound difference, but the feel of the two cars was completely different. While mine gripped better with the new tires, the other car felt more nimble and tossable to a good degree. > How about the 1995 M-Edition BBS at 12 lb and $900 each? $900.00 each? Is that a typo or is BBS insane? Actually, that would be the buyers that are insane. Those wheels are nice, but $3600.00 for a set of 15" wheels that are not even the best on the market seems WAY, WAY, WAY too high a price to me. My SSR's are larger (16X7), weigh almost the exact same, (they would weigh another pound or two less than the BBS wheels if the size was the same for both), and cost about $350.00 each, which is not inexpensive by any means, but $900.00 for any 15 inch wheel is just nuts, unless it is made of precious metals. > Why not just go for the Borbets that you like? Good call. :-) Pat I think BBS gave up on the aftermarket market some time ago and kind of plays that role of "we're the best, if you want us PAY FOR US!". It seems to me that they still do supply allot of OEM wheels (admittedly, high end cars) and I would think they'd have to be somewhat competitive on those. I had been told quite a few years ago (when having a heart attack over the price of replacing two 15" OEM BBS wheels on a Jetta GLI) that VW had bought up BBS. Can anyone here confirm or debunk that? I'd like to know if that was smoke being blown up my ......well, you know. FWIW I ended up replacing all 4 wheels with alternate aftermarket wheels and at that time in my life I had no clue about wheel weights and never did notice any handling difference / change. Chris 99BBB >> The 15" Enkei was 15. So were the 15" 6-spokes. Mazda also put 18 lb 16" >> OEM [quoted text clipped - 45 lines] > > Pat > I think BBS gave up on the aftermarket market some time ago and kind of > plays that role of "we're the best, if you want us PAY FOR US!". It seems to [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Chris > 99BBB Even though what you say makes sense, I think that you are a quack, that you are talking out of your butt, and that you are a sheltered fool. ;-) Just wanted to keep the hostile tone of the group going....... With that, I just got through working, it is over 70 degrees and not a cloud in the sky, and I am going for a comfortable top-down ride. Take that you frozen Northern scum! ;-) Pat > > I think BBS gave up on the aftermarket market some time ago and kind of > > plays that role of "we're the best, if you want us PAY FOR US!". It seems to [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Pat That's the dumbest thing I ever heard. > That's the dumbest thing I ever heard. The dumbest thing in your whole life? Would that make you a sheltered fool? ;-) Also, that would be the dumbest thing you ever read, not heard, since we are being so technical. Lighten up Chas, this is a miata newsgroup, you know, the fun little 2-seater drop-tops. There is nothing to prove here. :-) What year model of miata do you have? Pat > > That's the dumbest thing I ever heard. > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Pat Your comments to lighten up are misdirected Pat. That said, I own a '99 10AE. http://www.cardomain.com/ride/783728 > Your comments to lighten up are misdirected Pat. That is not unusual for me, (misdirected comments), but what a polite reply from you. Thanks! > That said, I own a '99 10AE. > > http://www.cardomain.com/ride/783728 Nice car. I still love the blue that they used on the 10AE, though I think I would like to see one with a black top. Pat Pat, you're obviously drinking excessively again, lighten up! Chris 99BBB >> Your comments to lighten up are misdirected Pat. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Pat > Pat, you're obviously drinking excessively again, lighten up! > > Chris > 99BBB I think it was an 80's acid flashback this time. I kept avoiding hallucinations during my drive. To my credit, I did not hit any of them, though it was a close call with Big Bird. That would have been messy, blood and yellow feathers everywhere. ;-) I finally hit my driveway on the fifth try, which is strange, because there are only two houses on my street.......... Pat >> Also, do not forget that wheels are only a small part of unsprung weight. >> The tires add a lot to it (and tires on a 14" wheel are likely to be many [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >While mine gripped better with the new tires, the other car felt more >nimble and tossable to a good degree. That is a good point. What I see are people complaining about the heavier wheels and tires having less road contact, and transmitting more perturbations to the car, but tossing all that additional front wheel weight around during maneuvers might also be a factor. Though I would think in the above case, the additional tossability might just be the smaller amount of road adhesion to overcome with the worn tires. >> How about the 1995 M-Edition BBS at 12 lb and $900 each? > >$900.00 each? Is that a typo or is BBS insane? Some years ago, I asked Trussville about them, and they cited me about $800 MSR or $650 from them. But then you need wheelcaps, made from the finest plastic and aluminum, which are $65 each too (from Trussville, not the dealer.) (I have bought quite a few from Trussville since they tend to fall off.) That makes it $900 or maybe a bit more after price increases since then. > Actually, that would be >the buyers that are insane. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >any means, but $900.00 for any 15 inch wheel is just nuts, unless it is >made of precious metals. It is! Pure aluminum! The way I know is that every pothole puts them out of round. In fact, I would not be surprised if they were made from pure gold. Leon SignatureLeon van Dommelen :) Bozo, the White 96 Sebring Miata .) rammm@dommelen.net http://www.dommelen.net/miata EXIT THE INTERSTATES (Jamie Jensen) > It is! Pure aluminum! The way I know is that every pothole puts them > out of round. In fact, I would not be surprised if they were made from > pure gold. > > Leon Pure gold wheels at less than 12 pounds each? ;-) It does seem to me like a better wheel material would have been invented by now. Some type of composite that never goes out of round, is very lightweight and is at least as break-resistant as the wheels we use now. I know that magnesium has been used, but I would also prefer that my wheels not burn at thousands of degrees if a fire occurs. Pat >I am looking for a new set of wheels and tires for my '95 and can't find >any OEM one locally for a reasonable price. I don't really care if they >are 14" or 15" and am planning on putting Falken Ziex's on them or perhaps >Bridgestone Traction TA's... I've got a set of 14" OEM wheels from a '99 that I'm willing to part with for a reasonable price if you can pick them up in Southern California. They are not new but in good condition. Reply with an offer if you are interested. Gus (91 BRG) > I am looking for a new set of wheels and tires for my '95 and can't find any > OEM one locally for a reasonable price. I don't really care if they are 14" [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > http://www.miata.net/faq/wheel_weights.html Chris, A couple of years ago I e-mailed Miata Bob referencing what would be the maximum wheel weight for a Miata. His recommendation was the less weight the better, but no more than 35 lbs. wheel/tire combo at each corner. Gary >> I am looking for a new set of wheels and tires for my '95 and can't find any >> OEM one locally for a reasonable price. I don't really care if they are 14" [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >His recommendation was the less weight the better, but no more than 35 >lbs. wheel/tire combo at each corner. In that case, Mazda itself probably exceeded the recommendation with the 18 lb 2002 SE wheel, or at least was right on it. The lowest 16" tires in the table on miata.net are 18 lb. Norman H Garrett III, in his "Mazda Miata Performance Handbook", noted that one popular 15" wheel-tire combo weighted 48 lb, and that while this was a substantial performance and ride penalty, it will not bother everyone as a price to pay for good looks. In short, nobody doubts that lighter is better, but what you want to accept depends on your tolerance level. Not that I would touch 48 lb wheel-tire combos myself with a 10 ft pole, of course. Leon SignatureLeon van Dommelen :) Bozo, the White 96 Sebring Miata .) rammm@dommelen.net http://www.dommelen.net/miata EXIT THE INTERSTATES (Jamie Jensen) > Not that I would touch 48 lb wheel-tire combos myself with a 10 ft > pole, of course. > > Leon Isn't that about what the 17" wheels/tires combo weighs on the 2006 MX-5? ;-) Seriously, does anyone have a weight on these 17" wheels yet? I am guessing about 18 to 20 pounds. Pat Thanks for all the responses. I spoke to BF Goodrich (not Bridgestone as previously stated in error) and learned that the Traction T/A 185/60/14 weighs 19.29lbs. That means 32lbs per wheel when paired up with the SportEdition DS, or 35.5lbs per wheel when paired up with the Borbet Type CA. If I just look at the total weight of the Borbet and the SportEdition I do see a 10% weight differential, but that is also just 3.5lbs. It seems to me that it probably won't make a difference to me one way or the other between these two. On the other hand if I am willing to make the extra effort and pay the extra expense to get the Konig Helium's (which are 15" and not sold bundled with tires mounted and balanced as far as i know - hence my comment regarding effort) or something even more expensive... Thanks again for all the comments. >>> I am looking for a new set of wheels and tires for my '95 and can't find >>> any [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > > Leon Ya, the Heliums that Lanny mentioned seem to be the 'hole in one' with being inexpensive, light weight and not at all bad looking! Anyone know of a vendor doing a package deal? Chris 99BBB (40lbs/corner :-() > Thanks for all the responses. > [quoted text clipped - 67 lines] >> >> Leon I bought a set of Heliums from Good-Win and a set of Toyo TR-1s from online tire. Both were on special. The tires may still be on special but I think Good-Win's sale is finished. It's still worth checking. > Ya, the Heliums that Lanny mentioned seem to be the 'hole in one' with being > inexpensive, light weight and not at all bad looking! Anyone know of a [quoted text clipped - 78 lines] > >> rammm@dommelen.net http://www.dommelen.net/miata > >> EXIT THE INTERSTATES (Jamie Jensen) I looked the other day after Lanny mentioned these wheels and they were still showing up as $89 ea. That's quite a buy considering the weight / look. Chris 99BBB >I bought a set of Heliums from Good-Win and a set of Toyo TR-1s from online > tire. [quoted text clipped - 99 lines] >> >> rammm@dommelen.net http://www.dommelen.net/miata >> >> EXIT THE INTERSTATES (Jamie Jensen) |
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