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Car Forum / Mercedes-Benz Cars / April 2007Turn signal and headlamp question (87 300SDL)
I have an electrical problem that I need a little guidance on solving. This in an '87 300SDL. When the headlamps are turned on the bulb out lamp illuminates on the dash. I suspect a loose connexion rather than a bulb being out since repeated walking-arounds show no lights being out. The guy that I purchased the sedan from had replaced the original head lamp assemblies with "Euro-style" units which is why I'm suspicious of a loose connexion. Last week, I was making a left hand turn with the turn signal engaged, headlamps on. The turn lamps both fore and aft now come on, but do not flash when the switch is engaged. This occurs only when the headlamps are operating or the parking lamps are selected. When the headlamps are not on, the turn signals operate normally. So, the question is should I look at the relays for the headlamps or consider replacing the headlamp switch? After twenty years, I think that the switch may be a candidate for replacement. TIA  SignatureCheers, Kurt The only time I've seen or heard of a swutch failing is when they burn up and release lots of smoke. I'd be much more inclined to have a good and hard look at the wiring going to the headlights and trurn signals. Properly done yo udont need to cut or solder anything, you just move pins aruond in the connectr shell but not everybody gets this and it may well be a dogs breakfast in there. >I have an electrical problem that I need a little guidance on solving. >This in an '87 300SDL. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > >TIA SignatureNeed Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net > The only time I've seen or heard of a swutch failing is when they > burn up and release lots of smoke. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > move pins aruond in the connectr shell but not everybody gets this > and it may well be a dogs breakfast in there. Thanks, I think that it is wiring related. Switch suspicions are from the hi-beam not engaging all the time and that the indicator bulb (left side) and parking lights 'sticking' on when the headlamp switch is turned on. SignatureCheers, Kurt First, make sure the light lite up as it should be... then check all the bulbs... make sure they are all german bulbs except for the headlight. It is easy to tell as german bulbs have silver base while american one has brass. This is number one reason for bulb out lite. The wattage is slightly off that triggers the bulb out lamp. As far as blinking? I am not sure, I think maybe the flasher relay is bad. > First, make sure the light lite up as it should be... then check > all the bulbs... make sure they are all german bulbs except for [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > As far as blinking? I am not sure, I think maybe the flasher relay > is bad. Thanks, I'll lay in a supply of OEM bulbs later today and replace any that look suspicious. Will try the flasher relay too. SignatureCheers, Kurt >First, make sure the light lite up as it should be... then check all the >bulbs... make sure they are all german bulbs except for the headlight. It is [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >As far as blinking? I am not sure, I think maybe the flasher relay is bad. It seems very unlikely that the flasher relay went bad and that there are other problems with other components. That is it's very unusual that several components fall suddenly and simultaneously. Verify with a volt/ohm meter that the wiring to eh headlights hasn't been botched first. It's a minor truism that the thing that was messed with last is invariably the problem. SignatureNeed Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net > In article <sWrTh.31$Q64.20@newsfe12.lga>, Tiger > <tiger0002@hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > hasn't been botched first. It's a minor truism that the thing that > was messed with last is invariably the problem. Thanks again, as you probably have seen my responses to the other suggestions, I'm first gonna have to find the voltmeter. As to the "minor trusim", methinks that it's one of Murphy's Axioms, yes? Therefore, valid and true and often a painfull experience. <g> SignatureCheers, Kurt >Thanks again, as you probably have seen my responses to the other >suggestions, I'm first gonna have to find the voltmeter. As to the >"minor trusim", methinks that it's one of Murphy's Axioms, yes? >Therefore, valid and true and often a painfull experience. <g> I just bought a new one in walmart for $30. Even if I cuold find mine it would take hours to do so :-) And it's a BIG IF. SignatureNeed Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net >>Thanks again, as you probably have seen my responses to the other >>suggestions, I'm first gonna have to find the voltmeter. As to the [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > And it's a BIG IF. <BG> I finally found mine in the last place I looked. It has a dead battery, Murphy again. SignatureCheers, Kurt >I finally found mine in the last place I looked. It has a dead >battery, Murphy again. I knew that before you found it. It's the first law of automotive voltmetering. SignatureNeed Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net > I have an electrical problem that I need a little guidance on solving. > This in an '87 300SDL. [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > consider replacing the headlamp switch? After twenty years, I think > that the switch may be a candidate for replacement. Could be a bad headlamp assembly ground connection. Switching on the headlights rises the voltage for the other lamps and the turn signal so much that the bimetal switch doesn't work any more. SignatureRoland Franzius It is a good possibility that the guy did not hook up the euro light properly... with problem in low beam, high beam if it exist. > It is a good possibility that the guy did not hook up the euro light > properly... with problem in low beam, high beam if it exist. I would not be surprised. I've read back though the conversion procedure that was in The Star to familiarize self with what might have been done. Tomorrow, if I find the excremet deleted volt meter, I'll be working on the problem. SignatureCheers, Kurt It is not hard.... only 4 wires... one is ground, one is low beam, one is high beam and other is foglight. Just turn them on one by one and you will know if it is not right. No need for voltmeter. Dont forget the headlight realay/bulb out indicator are one unit. It could be bad also. Whole system goes nuts when it goes bad. >It is not hard.... only 4 wires... one is ground, one is low beam, one is >high beam and other is foglight. Just turn them on one by one and you will >know if it is not right. No need for voltmeter. Of course there is. You want to verify the ground is ground and not +12V when a switch is turned on when there should not be anything on that wire. SignatureNeed Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net If the wire were not set up correctly, then there wouldn't be any high beam or fog light... one circuit would not be 'complete.' > If the wire were not set up correctly, then there wouldn't be any > high beam or fog light... one circuit would not be 'complete.' Got foglight(s). Got the sidelamp/turnlamp sorted. Have replaced two yankee bulbs (one that I did in left rear) the other was the front left that may have suffered from old age and/or vibration. Next step is the headlamp. I still think that it's the switch not making full contact as you can move the selector lever from High beam to normal with no highbeam, then a slight push gets you high beam. Something is not making complete contact...and I'm thinking it's gonna be a case of that minor truism striking again. SignatureCheers, Kurt If you pull the flasher toward you, you get momentarily flashing of high beam. If you push the flasher stalk toward the speedometer, you turn on the high beam. > If you pull the flasher toward you, you get momentarily flashing > of high beam. If you push the flasher stalk toward the > speedometer, you turn on the high beam. Right. In my vehicle, when you push (the lever)forward, you get the high beam then the lights usually go out. If you push forward just a wee bit more, the lights come back on. This why I think that the switch in the steering column is not making good contact. SignatureCheers, Kurt >Right. In my vehicle, when you push (the lever)forward, you get the >high beam then the lights usually go out. If you push forward just a >wee bit more, the lights come back on. This why I think that the switch >in the steering column is not making good contact. That's unusual. But, having exhausted all other possabiities you're probably right. Now, Mercedes uses very high quality switches and they're designed to be taken apart, cleaned, and good for another 20 years. Try doing this. It might just be oxidation or a burned contact and may respond well to being cleaned up. SignatureNeed Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net >>Right. In my vehicle, when you push (the lever)forward, you get >>the high beam then the lights usually go out. If you push forward [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > doing this. It might just be oxidation or a burned contact and may > respond well to being cleaned up. I'll see if I can get it apart once I get the steering wheel out. That may have to wait another week. Fortunately, I don't need the high beams most of the time. Thanks for your patience and input. SignatureCheers, Kurt >If the wire were not set up correctly, then there wouldn't be any high beam >or fog light... one circuit would not be 'complete.' Your lack of comprehension of Mercedes electrical failure modes is apalling. :-) You're thinking rationally and logically. This does not help. I've seen things tha not only don't make sense but are impossible with conventional laws of physics -which as we all know these cars do not adhere to. Some guy installed lights. I have less faith in him than in the guys that made the electrics work for the past 20 years. I'd really start by verifying the wiring changes he made. SignatureNeed Mercedes parts? http://parts.mbz.org Richard Sexton | Mercedes stuff: http://mbz.org 1970 280SE, 72 280SE | Home pages: http://rs79.vrx.net 633CSi 250SE/C 300SD | http://aquaria.net http://killi.net [...] > Could be a bad headlamp assembly ground connection. Switching on > the headlights rises the voltage for the other lamps and the turn > signal so much that the bimetal switch doesn't work any more. Thanks. I'll add that to my list of things to check out tomorrow. Now, to go find that expeltive deleted voltmeter! SignatureCheers, Kurt |
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