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Car Forum / Mercedes-Benz Cars / January 2008What is a 300TD - a wagon or a sedan?
I saw an ad for a 1987 300TD. They have a sedan pictured. I understood that TD meant station wagons.  Signaturewww.perfectreign.com You're right. 300D is their car's trunk badge; they meant to convey that it's a 300D Turbodiesel. Station wagons are noted by "T" for "touring". Signature© 2007 T.G.Lambach. Publication in any form requires prior written permission. > You're right. 300D is their car's trunk badge; they meant to convey that > it's a 300D Turbodiesel. Station wagons are noted by "T" for "touring". > -- > (c) 2007 T.G.Lambach. Publication in any form requires prior written > permission. Thats why people write 300TDT when they want to be sure to convey a wagon. The idea being Turbo Diesel Touring (wagon). Instead of just the Turbo Diesel assumption. T.G. might be able to correct me on this, but I assume people started using 300TD to denote turbo diesel because the earlier 300D's were not turbo's. Of course, if you state the year of the 300D you should be able to tell if it is turbo or not. I don't know the specific year, but after 82 or 83, they were all turbo 3L engines, before that all non-turbo 3L diesels. Personally, I don't assume it is a wagon unless the "T" is after the "D" in the description. (i.e. 300DT or 300TDT) > On Dec 20, 1:57 pm, "-->> T.G. Lambach <<--" <"T.G. Lambach at > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > wagon. The idea being Turbo Diesel Touring (wagon). Instead of just > the Turbo Diesel assumption. What assumption? AFAIK, MB only used TD to designate the diesel wagon, never to designate it being a turbo anything. Making up model numbers that don't exist makes no sense, is confusing and can only lead to trouble. 300TD is a MB model designataion and means it's a 3 litre diesel wagon. 300D is the 3 litre diesel sedan. If anyone wants to convey additional information, whether it be that it has a turbo or anything else, they should just spell it out in the description. > T.G. might be able to correct me on this, but I assume people started > using 300TD to denote turbo diesel because the earlier 300D's were not [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Personally, I don't assume it is a wagon unless the "T" is after the > "D" in the description. (i.e. 300DT or 300TDT) > Making up model numbers that don't exist makes no sense, is > confusing and can only lead to trouble. That's why the cognoscenti often write it as "300tD" or "300tDT," with a lowercase "t," when they want to make it clear that a car is turbocharged. On another note, I've never heard of a 300D or 300TD with a six-cylinder engine; I thought they were all fives. The only 6-cylinder Mercedes diesel I'm familiar with is the one in the 300/350SDL. Do the newer (post-W124) 300Ds have sixes? Was the 4-valve 1987 300D engine a six? My copy of Barrett isn't at hand. Geoff -- "If everybody in this town connected with politics had to leave town because of chasing women and drinking, you would have no government." -- Barry Goldwater The 124 body diesels were either 5 or 6 cylinders. They were still called 300D. The 5 cylinder 617 diesel engine last appeared, in the USA, in the 85 123 and 85 126 bodies. Starting in the 86 model year, in the USA, the 124 body replaced the 123 and the 126 300SD used the 603 6 cylinder diesel. > > Making up model numbers that don't exist makes no sense, is > > confusing and can only lead to trouble. [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > leave town because of chasing women and drinking, you > would have no government." -- Barry Goldwater > The 124 body diesels were either 5 or 6 cylinders. They were still > called 300D. In what year(s) did the 124 body diesels have a 6-cylinder engine? I used to have a '91 300D 2.5 (5-cyl), and I thought the standard, 3-litre 124-body 300D also had a 5-cylinder engine. No? > Starting in the 86 model year, in the USA, the 124 body replaced > the 123 and the 126 300SD used the 603 6 cylinder diesel. You mean the 126 *300SDL.* Or are you saying that there was such a thing as a 1986 300SD (short wheelbase) with a 6-cylinder engine? Geoff -- "One notes, as a matter of sociology, that Islam in its current incarnation seems to offer a larger pool of stupid angry men than other world religions." -- National Review USA 126 body: 560SEL 86-91 126.039 117.968 420SEL 86-91 126.035 116.965 300SEL 88-91 126.025 103.981 300SE 88-91 126.024 103.981 350SDL 90-91 126.135 603.970 350SD 91 126.134 603.970 300SDL 86-87 126.125 603.961 500SEL 84-85 126.037 117.963 380SE 84-85 126.032 116.963 560SEC 86-91 126.045 117.968 500SEC 84-85 126.044 117.963 380SEC 82-83 126.043 116.963 300SD 81-85 126.120 617.951 380SEL 81-83 126.033 116.961/963 USA 124 body: E500 94 124.036 119.974 E420 94-95 124.034 119.975 E320 Wagon 94-95 124.092 104.992 300TE 93 124.092 104.992 E300 Diesel 95 124.131 606.910 E320 Coupe 94-95 124.052 104.992 300CE 93 124.052 104.992 E320 Convertible 94-95 124.066 104.992 E320 Sedan 94-95 124.032 104.992 300E 93 124.032 104.992 300E 2.8 93 124.028 104.942 300CE CONV. 93 124.066 104.992 500E 92-93 124.036 119.974 400E 92-93 124.034 119.975 300E 2.6 90-93 124.026 103.940 300E 4MATIC 90-93 124.230 103.985 300TE 4MATIC 90-93 124.290 103.985 300D 2.5 90-93 124.128 602.962 300TE 90-93 124.090 103.983 300CE 90-92 124.051 104.980 300CE 88-89 124.050 103.983 260E 87-89 124.026 103.940 300TDT 86-87 124.193 603.960 ('87) & 603.962 ('86) 300DT 86-87 124.133 603.960 ('87) & 603.962 ('86) 300E 86-93 124.030 103.983 Watch for the differences in engine numbers...... A 602 is a 5 cyl diesel, a 603 and 606 is a 6 cyl diesel. > > The 124 body diesels were either 5 or 6 cylinders. They were still > > called 300D. [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > of stupid angry men than other world religions." > -- National Review I thought TD meant turbodiesel in the early days of turbo, to emphasize the turbocharging. Now that all diesel engines are turbocharged there is no need to insert the "T" for turbo. DAS For direct replies replace nospam with schmetterling --- [...] > That's why the cognoscenti often write it as "300tD" or > "300tDT," with a lowercase "t," when they want to make it > clear that a car is turbocharged. [...] > I thought TD meant turbodiesel in the early days of turbo, to emphasize the > turbocharging. Now that all diesel engines are turbocharged there is no [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >>"300tDT," with a lowercase "t," when they want to make it >>clear that a car is turbocharged. The first generation of turbodiesels were explicitely named on the back http://www.flickr.com/photos/kiezpro/84324283 The T meant Transport or as some people were guessing Teuer (expensive) in those times when E meant Einspritzer (injection) and S something like Superior an L Luxus (not Lexus). SignatureRoland Franzius > > I thought TD meant turbodiesel in the early days of turbo, to emphasize the > > turbocharging. Now that all diesel engines are turbocharged there is no [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > - Show quoted text - Agree with the fact that T was never used to designate Turbo and the early models where in fact distinguished by a badge that says "turbodiesel." T was used to designate the wagon, though which German word it refers to, I don't know. Actually L was for Long, indicating the car was the longer wheelbase chassis, eg 450SEL as compared to 450SE and comes from the German word lange. Or T = Turnier... Or is/was that Ford? Or is my memory playing up again? DAS For direct replies replace nospam with schmetterling --- [...] > The T meant Transport or as some people were guessing Teuer (expensive) > in those times when E meant Einspritzer (injection) and S something like > Superior an L Luxus (not Lexus). All USA 87 300 diesels are turbo powered. Should have said 300DT for a sedan. The USA vin would start WDBEB33..... Model number is 124.133 Engine is 603.960 300TDT for a wagon. USA vin WDBEB93.... Model number is 124.193 Engine is 603.960 There was also a 300D 2.5 Turbo It was a 5 cylinder as opposed to the others being 6 cylinder. USA vin WDBEB28.... Model is 124.128 Engine is 602.962 > I saw an ad for a 1987 300TD. They have a sedan pictured. I understood that > TD meant station wagons. on Thursday 20 December 2007 11:54 am, someone posing as Karl took a rock and etched into the cave: > All USA 87 300 diesels are turbo powered. > [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Model is 124.128 > Engine is 602.962 So it is a W124 sedan then. I called the guy and left a message. Signaturewww.perfectreign.com |
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