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Car Forum / Mercedes-Benz Cars / September 2004MAYBACH test drive...
Finally got time to write something that needs a bit of thought. You got about two hours to drive the car, I think I had it for three hours or so. I did not feel the time at all. Its very comfortable, never a felt bumps on the road, its silky ride is highly memorable; its least fatiguing... time flies in the car. It accelerates vigorously yet with the civility of a luxury automobile; no head snapping, yet you feel the pull, very strong like an aircraft about to be airborne. During this massive acceleration, you can change lanes, overtake and get back to your original track--its truly a beautiful experience--its composure stays calm during all this. Speedometer reads 120 mph within few seconds during that maneuver, do not feel the speed at all. It felt like 70 mph or so ... except you begin to feel the cars in the front, traveling in your direction, suddenly speeding toward you. It can be a bit scary. The breaks are very powerful: In no time you are following the traffic! Only thought that goes through your mind at the end of this few seconds is, this is good, I want one! Though, I felt the steering wheel could be a bit tighter, sport mode or otherwise, it was a bit too free wheeling or may be I am used to tighter... I am not suggesting we go back to manual steering ... far from it. The 57 Maybach, as big as it looks, its a nimble car. Its butter smooth and crisp in corners as well as in tight parking lots! I was very surprised. Interior is sweet. Seats, head rest, trims are the worlds best. Its just perfect. Some part of the dashboard uses real leather, but treated to look like suede. It makes for great look, but it shows finger marks too easily and that doesn't look good. I am sure you could lint-free cloth or something and wipe it down in on uniform direction and it would look super. I think such would be great on the 63 Maybach as its a driver-driven car, you sit at the back and enjoy the view. The 600 some HP engine is well mated and felt precise. Though, it is typical of the SOHC of Mercedes of today. Somewhat tinny, light weight feeling and not so refined, reminds me of it as a "lease" car feeling. While the past SL600 or the S600 engine has a sense of weight and "command" is clearly absent. Paint job is first class, the one I tested was gray on silver dual tone. Its very classy, I loved it. Unfortunately, the front grill is trendy than classy, it looks like they looked for inspiration form the International truck grill. I wish they designed a grill for the next 100 years. Head lights are nice, again, I would set the industrial design of the head lights to something of a classic shape "beaming with power." Its the eyes of the machine. May be Maybach should call me in to consult on overall theme/design or the ID of the car. On U-turns or extreme sharp corners I couldn't break its back loose to swing the back to reposition the car. May be I should try it again, but there was something strange: On a U-turn from rest, when I tried to get the back to break away, the car instead tilted, sort of like sitting on its side feeling. My speculation is that the six or seven thousand pounds was thrown off and the self leveling may be doesn't kick in till a certain speed.... It does leave you with a somewhat mixed feeling of spending U$350,000 or so on it. I am still thinking. I need something, that final oomps, to just walk in there and buy one. Oh well... Overall, it is a fine, ultra classy automobile. Regards, Jayanthan (Jay) Bala. P.S. In the future please use: [PixMovieMaker@hitpix.net] Chauffeur-driven, dear Jay, chauffeur-driven... More seriously, other than some of the detail, I would have thought you get just about most of this on an S-Class (even bearing your specific comment in mind). I have a far lesser car (a 'mere' CLK), but with its relatively 'tiny' 218 hp 3.2 l engine I still get to 100+ mph in a frighteningly short time. The noise inside the cabin is somewhat higher, especially as it's a rag-top cabrio, but I accept that. The feel is of quality even there, and the ride is fine. You have given the Maybach a lot of merit points, very nice, but are they worth the USD 200 000 plus over the top S-Class? (Other than the exclusivity/rarity/look-I'm-rich aspect.) As I suggested in another, similar thread, admittedly without driving a Maybach, a top S and an SL together are a better, more economical proposition than a Maybach. DAS  SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [..........] > ...its a driver-driven car... "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng@nospam.co.uk> haute in die Tasten: > As I suggested in another, similar thread, admittedly without driving a > Maybach, a top S and an SL together are a better, more economical > proposition than a Maybach. IMHO the Maybach 57 does not make any sense. Compared to a S 600L, this car does not handle better, offer more space for the driver, deliver more performance. It is more expensive (and in my opinion: it looks less good). Okay, so we take the Maybach 62 and a chauffeur. This car features without a doubt more luxury for the rear passengers than any other Mercedes product. Having sit in one, I felt like in a business jet: Much space for the legs, some space for the head, but overall not enough space to move my body like in a Jumbo Jet. Who needs such a car? I think, the Maybach 62 would be an interesting option for those who usually use a Learjet for their transportation. If I were a manager who had to travel between Munich and Stuttgart very often, I would seriously consider a Maybach instead of a Lear Jet, because it saves time and lets me work/sleep/watch tv without disturbing me. So the Maybach 62 is the business jet for distances shorter than 200 miles. For all other transportation desires (including representation/boasting about one's wealth) there are other, better suitable cars. And if you think of a Maybach as a business jet without wings, you can see its total cost of ownership from a different view. Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citroen - Made in Trance "So the Maybach 62 is the business jet for distances shorter than 200 miles." Hmmm . . . suppose there will be Fractonal Ownership programs for Maybachs?!! Pete Cowper (1987 300E) Can I be your London franchisee? DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- > "So the Maybach 62 is the business jet for distances shorter than 200 > miles." [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Pete Cowper (1987 300E) << Chauffeur-driven, dear Jay, chauffeur-driven... >><BR><BR> ummm... too French :-) Like the Maybach grill, for the moment its politically correct not to use French words. I am sure it will change fast, just like the trendy Maybach grill, and unlike Rolls... Regards, Jayanthan (Jay) Bala. P.S. In the future please use: [PixMovieMaker@hitpix.net] So the summary is that the small Maybach is like the current miniS - too small. The big Maybach is also really too small, but the back seat space is a bit bigger and can sub for a small, mildly uncomfortable private jet. Seems like ole Jerkin Shrimp has done it again! mcbrue under the bridge in the trailer down by the river 96 S420 What, not ...cramped under the bridge... ? DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- > So the summary is that the small Maybach is like the current miniS - too > small. The big Maybach is also really too small, but the back seat space [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > 96 S420 Sorry... ...crampedly under the bridge... :-) DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- > What, not > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >> >> 96 S420 Not where I am, it's not. Nous pouvons parler Francais toujours... ...and we don't have any of that freedom fries nonsense...and, in any case, in Britain we call them chips. In Germany they call them Pommes, pronounced in two distinct syllables (pom-ess). They don't normally bother with the "frites" bit. Why the Americans call them French fries beats me...Not even the Franch call them "Frites Francaises". DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- > << Chauffeur-driven, dear Jay, chauffeur-driven... >><BR><BR> > > ummm... too French :-) [........] .......for the moment its politically correct not to use > French words .................. > Why the Americans call them French fries beats me...Not even > the French call them "Frites Francaises". Well, of course not. It'd be redundant, kind of like dialing the area code when calling one's next-door neighbor. Geoff Signature"Unless one understands that leftist ideals function as a religion, one cannot understand the Left." -- Dennis Prager > Well, of course not. It'd be redundant, kind of like dialing > the area code when calling one's next-door neighbor. We have to do that here. Pretty ridiculious, IMO >> Well, of course not. It'd be redundant, kind of like dialing >> the area code when calling one's next-door neighbor. >> > We have to do that here. Pretty ridiculious, IMO Yep, here too. As of the last year or so, all calls in NYC, even within area codes, require you to dial the code. Yes, I noticed that change during a visit in 2003 (or was it 2002?). In the UK it became possible to dial the area code when dialling locally (previously the call would not go through). On mobile phones (at least outside NA) you always have to dial the 'area' code (a network or system access code, in fact) and you can always dial the country code. DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [.........] >>> Well, of course not. It'd be redundant, kind of like dialing >>> the area code when calling one's next-door neighbor. [...............]>> > Yep, here too. As of the last year or so, all calls in NYC, even within > area codes, require you to dial the code. Would seem a bit wierd if they call them pomme in Germany since pomme is French. Pomme de terre is French for "apple of the ground"...or potatoe. This whole thing about not calling them "French fries" here in the US is a backlash against the French for their back-stabbling, under-the-table deals with Saddam in the UN Oil for Food Program. They, along with the Germans and Russians, were caught red-handed with their hand in the money barrel so Americans decided to retaliate. Besides, California wines are not only better but much less expensive than the French stuff. I even prefer German wines to French, especially the white wines from the Rhine Valley. Ta..da! > Not where I am, it's not. Nous pouvons parler Francais toujours... > [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > > French words > .................. "The earnest one" <earnest37@sbcglobal.net> haute in die Tasten: > Would seem a bit wierd if they call them pomme in Germany since pomme > is French. Pomme de terre is French for "apple of the ground"...or > potatoe. Germans have not developed a genuine word for Pommes frites (fried potato sticks), they use the original french name. If you look into a menu in a german restaurant you will find exact these words for it. "Pommes" or "Fritten" are simple synonyms for the original french word, which usually are used only in spoken language. The direct translation of "Pomes frites" is "Bratkartoffeln", but this word describes a different kind of meal: Sliced potatoes with herbs and pieces of onion, fried in a pan (not swimming in a pot of boiling oil). It seems that your knowledge about german culture is as low as your knowledge about the Iraq war backgrounds. I suggest the following: 1. get yourself a real name 2. avoid mentioning this issue in a newsgroup where it does not belong to Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citro?n Xantia - Made in Trance > "The earnest one" <earnest37@sbcglobal.net> haute in die Tasten: > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > 2. avoid mentioning this issue in a newsgroup where it does not belong > to "Does not belong to"??? Ending a sentence in a preposition??? Tsk tsk. Shows your level of intel..... Get rid of that stupid fly...SWAT! > Frank I suggest you refrain from silly remarks about people's linguistic abilities until such time as you speak German or French or... as well as Frank or others speak English. Furthermore, we are quite aware of the backgound for the "freedom fries" nonsense in the US. Pathetic, isn't it? Just because a few people in the US disagree with French government's policies you blame the language... Whether you think Californian wines are better than French wines is fine. Enjoy your boycott of the products of the world's greatest wine industry. DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- >> "The earnest one" <earnest37@sbcglobal.net> haute in die Tasten: >> [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] >> >> Frank "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng@nospam.co.uk> haute in die Tasten: > Whether you think Californian wines are better than French wines is > fine. Enjoy your boycott of the products of the world's greatest wine > industry. Good example. I do not like the current italian prime minister at all. In fact I believe, that he committed several crimes and tries to get away with it by changing the law. But this does not affect my consumption of italian wines of all vintages and brands;-). Funny enough: One of the worst glasses of wine I drank in my whole life was a white californian wine, which I had for dinner in a restaurant in the SF Bay area. Obviously the Californians sell their best wines abroad - the Italians do it just the other way 'round;-) To come back to the topic: I assume that the Maybach was not primarily made for the domestic german market. In Germany DaimlerChrysler set up only two Maybach showrooms in Germany, one in Berlin, one in Munich. I can very well imagine that Singapore will buy more Maybachs than Germany. Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citro?n Xantia - Made in Trance > To come back to the topic: I assume that the Maybach was not primarily > made for the domestic german market. In Germany DaimlerChrysler set up > only two Maybach showrooms in Germany, one in Berlin, one in Munich. I > can very well imagine that Singapore will buy more Maybachs than Germany. I don't have the source at hand but I remember DC saying the main markets are the US and Asia - which makes sense as many wealthy Germans prefer not to show how rich they are. Juergen "Juergen ." <jaguare@bigfoot.com> haute in die Tasten: > I don't have the source at hand but I remember DC > saying the main markets are the US and Asia - > which makes sense as many wealthy Germans prefer > not to show how rich they are. ACK. I remember I read several times, that Germany is an under-average market for Rolls Royce and Bentley, if you compare the number of citizens who could afford one to other, overseas markets. From my personal reception I can say that Rolls and Maybach seem to sell about equal in germany. Of the new Rolls Royce and the new Maybach I have seen exactly one each on the road yet;-) Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citro?n Xantia - Made in Trance > I can say that Rolls and Maybach seem to sell about equal in germany. Of > the new Rolls Royce and the new Maybach I have seen exactly one each on the > road yet;-) I see so many more Rolls - but that is because I live not far away from a top-dealer selling RR, Bentley, Aston Martin and such, but no Maybach centre is close... BTW I find the Maybachs not that elegegant - and I find especially the front of the RR ugly, to me it seems as if the designers had no more ideas left once they came to the styling of the front. But one has to admit both have a strong presence in real life which IMHO also comes from their hige size. Juergen > I suggest you refrain from silly remarks about people's linguistic > abilities until such time as you speak German or French or... as well [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > people in the US disagree with French government's policies you blame > the language... Who blames the language? The day I heard about the freedom fries bullshit I went out and bought 2 good bottled of french wine. Don't assume all americans are dumb just because our government is. Marty I don't. Please see careful choice of words: "a few people in the US". The "you" refers to the poster to whom I replied. DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [..........] > bullshit I went out and bought 2 good bottled of french wine. > > Don't assume all americans are dumb just because our government is. > > Marty > > I suggest you refrain from silly remarks about people's linguistic > > abilities until such time as you speak German or French or... as well [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > > Marty Many in government are "dumb"...but look at who puts them in place. And it's usually those who never vote who complain the most. "The earnest one" <earnest37@sbcglobal.net> haute in die Tasten: > And it's > usually those who never vote who complain the most. This seems to be something true, which you can see in almost every country. Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citroen - Made in Trance > "The earnest one" <earnest37@sbcglobal.net> haute in die Tasten: > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Frank Jeeze Frank. Relax. So...I stand corrected. I only spent three years in Germany and didn't learn as much German as I'd wished, just enough to get my point across in the machine shops, paint stores, etc. Did marry a girl born and raised in Paris (huge mistake). Thirteen years and five children later we split (naturally after she'd become an American citizen. Got myself a great American born and raised lady now...livin' happily everafter! By the way, I sincerely appreciate the thoroughness with which the German people pursue a project. Nothing like the French. Found out that only one master machinest is allowed in any one machine shop. Putting two together is like putting a couple of pitbulls together in a ring. Never saw any slums in Germany, everyone kept their homes, cars and streets spectacularly clean, nothing like the slobs here in the states. Make some great friends and drank up a fortune in German wines while there (at least by today's standards). Only problem I found about most Germans? They are too much "by the book" for me, at least 40 years ago they were. Otherwise, they and most Brits are my favorites. That's very good of you, earnest one. Thanks ever so much. And, by the way, how about doing something about your spelling? It's "favourites". DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [.......] Otherwise, they and most Brits are my > favorites. ............. > That's very good of you, earnest one. Thanks ever so much. > > And, by the way, how about doing something about your spelling? It's > "favourites". Only in British dictionaries. Here in the US it's as shown. Favor, as in favour??? > DAS > [.......] > > Otherwise, they and most Brits are my > > favorites. > ............. You obviously didn't get my sarcasm. Well, as you mention dictionaries, the 'ou' spelling should be in every English dictionary (Canadian included) except the American one. Stick that in your pipe and smoke it... DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- >> That's very good of you, earnest one. Thanks ever so much. >> [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >> > favorites. >> ............. > You obviously didn't get my sarcasm. > > Well, as you mention dictionaries, the 'ou' spelling should be in every > English dictionary (Canadian included) except the American one. > > Stick that in your pipe and smoke it... Sorry, didn't see the tongue in your cheek from here. > DAS > > [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >> > favorites. > >> ............. << but are they worth the USD 200 000 plus over the top S-Class? >><BR><BR> Over the current S-class, yes. Over the early 90's S-class, may be not that much better, except in dynamics and interior opulence. It is hard to quantify/justify $200,000. I must say, the engineering of the car is what you are paying for, not the content of it. Its how well, part from other Mercedes came together for a greater whole. I would say if it had a $200,000 price tag, it would be in my driveway now. Its far superior to any Mercedes (as a whole car) ever made. Considering there is about 500 or so cars to be sold in US, I guess you need to charge a premium to keep a float. Besides, many corporations are willing to pay $350,000 for a car to take their CEOs around. You can write it off. I am not trying to defend the high price tag. Its overpriced, no need to beat around the bush. I just want more, at least more real content like a ground braking classic grill, classic headlights, not so droopy body, just about no trendy design (if so I would get a Toyota), turbo charged twin-DOHC V24 (yes 24... why not), and some nicer looking wheels... Regards, Jayanthan (Jay) Bala. P.S. In the future please use: [PixMovieMaker@hitpix.net] Name three... (besides yours). DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [....] . Besides, many corporations are willing to pay > $350,000 for a car to take their CEOs around. You can write it off. > Considering there is about 500 or so cars to be sold in US, I guess you > need to > charge a premium to keep a float. Besides, many corporations are willing > to pay > $350,000 for a car to take their CEOs around. You can write it off. If there are only 500 in the US, then at least half of them are in NYC. I see more Maybachs now than I have ever seen Rolls or Bentley. The other day I saw a report where a DC spokesman admitted to difficulties in the top end (i.e. Maybach) sector. Now there's a surprise. DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- >> Considering there is about 500 or so cars to be sold in US, I guess you >> need to [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > If there are only 500 in the US, then at least half of them are in NYC. I > see more Maybachs now than I have ever seen Rolls or Bentley. > The other day I saw a report where a DC spokesman admitted to difficulties > in the top end (i.e. Maybach) sector. > Now there's a surprise. They miss sales figures by far - and they will never ever be able to make any money from the Maybach brand in the next ten years or so even in case the to-come Baby-Maybach (greetings to Stuttgart - I know you hate that expression!) will be a good seller as break-even is 15.000+ cars. Juergen >> The other day I saw a report where a DC spokesman admitted to >> difficulties [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Juergen "Baby Maybach"? Wouldn't that be more like a top-end Mercedes? If they plan to introduce such a product, then I really don't understand their marketing strategy (and I'm in marketing). I realize that at this point they need the brand to begin show some kind of return, but to force it by introducing a product that may very well cut into the sales of their bread-and-butter line just seems remarkably short-sighted. Unless MB conciously plans to downgrade the overall MB brand in favor of broader Maybach line (unlikely and foolhardy), introducing a 'small' Maybach will serve little purpose other than to confuse MB's top-end consumer by diminishing from the exclusivity of the Maybach brand (still it's major selling point), and at the same time reducing the desirability of the overall Mercedes line by conspicuously promoting another (presumably) similarly-priced product as a major step up from the 'standard' high end Mercedes. If I were a marketing director with MB, I'd send this plan straight back to the drawing board. Absolutely. How's this for a theory? The Maybach concept was misconceived from the start. Sole purpose was to satisfy the egomania of one or two senior execs to have an outrageously expensive car to top Bentley (i.e. VW) and RR (i.e. BMW). I, as a humble salesman of machines to industry, thus knowing nothing about the general 'consumer', think that honouring/remembering Wilhelm Maybach in some way is, in fact, a worthy idea. I would take one or two 500 or 600 S long-wheelbase models, kit them out with extra-expensive options, add maybe 30 000 to 50 000 euros to the price, add a discreet 'M' logo (not jokes about BMW please) somewhere and call them S-Class Maybach Edition. I am sure I read at the Maybach launch that the total market in this sector is only 10 000 per annum. This would include Bentley et al. I think DC were being optimistic in thinking they can sell 1000 per year. DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- >>> The other day I saw a report where a DC spokesman admitted to >>> difficulties [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > If I were a marketing director with MB, I'd send this plan straight back > to the drawing board. "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng@nospam.co.uk> haute in die Tasten: > I am sure I read at the Maybach launch that the total market in this > sector is only 10 000 per annum. This would include Bentley et al. I > think DC were being optimistic in thinking they can sell 1000 per > year. One have to take one other thing into consideration: Chances for Maybach to sell a lot of cars have become smaller, because the new Rolls Royce seems to be a hard competitor. Actually I did never understand the urge to launch a new top brand. Mercedes has succeded in the '60s to launch a top-end limousine, the 600 Pullman. They could have done that again, instead of just providing bad looking stretch S-classes. Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citro?n Xantia - Made in Trance The more we discuss this the more I think the present Maybach concept is mad. But then, Mercedes corporate management (as opposed to car division people) has a history curious decisions: electric household goods, aerospace (all loss-making). If you have that kind of money, wouldn't you buy a Ferrari instead, to add to the S-Class or Jag saloon you already have? Just read the first review of the CLS. Actually a dramatic-looking car ("just don't call it a coup?...") and good against putative competitors like a BMW 6 or a Jag 'S', but its target group? Many years ago I read that for an automobile company to survive it will have to be good a making small runs of a variety of 'specialist' cars (in the days when only long runs of the same thing were economical. Clearly Mercedes is going down this route but the extent seems extreme. The wonderful German expression "sich verzetteln" springs to mind. It is related to frittering away. Irrelevant aside: I found a Berlinerisch - English dictionary.... http://wolfram.schneider.org/dict/dict.cgi?query=jwd&plang=bln&db=tuc&lang=0&db= tuc&icase=1&wholewords=0®exp=0&hits=50&matches=0 DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- [..........] > One have to take one other thing into consideration: Chances for Maybach > to [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Frank "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng@nospam.co.uk> haute in die Tasten: > Just read the first review of the CLS. Actually a dramatic-looking > car ("just don't call it a coup?...") and good against putative > competitors like a BMW 6 or a Jag 'S', but its target group? My guts tell me that the CLS will not be a huge success for the company. I think that most CLS buyers would have bought another Mercedes, if the CLS would not have been launched. Okay, maybe Mercedes can earn some additional money, because a CLS is more expensive than an E-class. Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citro?n Xantia - Made in Trance "Thomas J. Paladino Jr." <tpaladino@nyc.rr.com> haute in die Tasten: > "Baby Maybach"? Wouldn't that be more like a top-end Mercedes? I do not want to argue with you, but what exactly is the current Maybach other than a top-end Mercedes? Given the fact that most prospective Maybach buyers are quite old, I think the Maybach 57 is too big for them to drive it on their own. I would suggest that Maybach launches a 4 seat convertible, soon. This may sell better than the sedans (but not 15.000 units) Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citro?n Xantia - Made in Trance > "Juergen ." <jaguare@bigfoot.com> wrote in message > > They miss sales figures by far - and they will never ever [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > product that may very well cut into the sales of their bread-and-butter line > just seems remarkably short-sighted. DC of course can afford the Maybach brand never ever to become profitable - the other brands (and here esp. Mercedes) earn enough money. A problem the Maybach brand has is the cars are too few in nterms of sales numbers to establish them in the public, so they have to have a model selling so good that it makes at least a slight public presence in countries like Germany. Another problem is that the brand is _too_ exclusive and at the same time unknown so potential buyers hesitate to jump to it - unknown not in Germany, but in many other countries: Maybach does not really have a _soul_ or brand identity at present, they still have to built it up as the glorious days of the brand are too long ago now (last Maybach was built until 1941). Now having a model like the Maybach 53 - starting at around 200.000 Euro - would solve those problems and also catch buyers who would never pay 350.000 and more Euro for a Maybach, but are willing to spend more than the 150.000 or so Euro for a MB S 600 L. Also the 53 is a bit smaller than a 57, giving it the sometimes decisive edge in crowded European cities and parking lots and at the same time not having the _impact_ as the 57 - not to speak of the 62 here... Plus the amateurs at DC simply did not think about a simple fact: A Maybach 57 with a length of 5728 mm simply is too long for most German/ European garages and multi-storey car parks (being typically no more than ca. 5500 mm) - this is one of the things where you can easily notice the leading guys at DC have no car knowledge at all (with the 62 length is of no importance in that respect, that is no owner-driver car but a chauffeured limo - the 53 will be below 5500 mm). > Unless MB conciously plans to downgrade > the overall MB brand in favor of broader > Maybach line (unlikely and > foolhardy), introducing a 'small' Maybach > will serve little purpose other They will not downgrade the MB brand - it is just the other way round, after _only_ some 10 years or so they now begin slowly to realize they have to try to return to the MB quality of the past. Also the next S-Class (W221 for 2005) will have some styling elements of the current Maybachs (especially th the rear), trying to close the gap from Mercedes to Maybach a bit and at the same time lowering the fear of some buyers about buying and owning a Maybach - having a brand which stands out too far from the rest is not always of advantage, especially not in countries like Germany where you not so seldom get negative comments and/or looks already when showing up in a new S-Class or SL... > than to confuse MB's top-end consumer by diminishing > from the exclusivity of > the Maybach brand (still it's major selling point), As said that is what DC hoped - but IMHO that is no real advantage, it is more of a disadvantage (sticking out too far). > and at the same time reducing the desirability of the > overall Mercedes line by conspicuously > promoting another (presumably) similarly-priced product > as a major step up from the 'standard' high end Mercedes. The point is Mercedes failed to have cars in the 150.000+ Euro region - they DO need to cover the region until 250.000 Euros, but they haven't realized it yet, no wonder, the CEOs are no car guys but ordinary loudmouths only. > If I were a marketing director with MB, I'd send this > plan straight back to the drawing board. Once they made the mistake of re-introducing the Maybach brand - and that was controversial a long time, we can see this simply by the fact late prototypes still had the Mercedes grille and were named _Mercedes Maybach_, they decided against to not to make the S-Class owners feel inferior, the S-Class should stay the top-of-the-line MB - the move with the Maybach 53 seems ok to me, but I doubt it will boost sales really much. To establish the Maybach brand DC will need _at least_ 10 years, 15 (or even 20) is more likely and within that timeframe they have to quadruple their sales efforts: What they do now is the old and well-known snobbish _We are MB, we have the very best cars and they sell alone_-attitude - which is nothing but amateurish only. And also prospective buyers realize DC does not really stand behind the Maybach brand - there is only three service points for Maybachs in Germany, Stuttgart, Berlin and Munichm, means that in this country with more than 80-million people Maybachs have to be hauled around by truck for hundreds of kilometers for simple service - ridiculous!! There is a similarity with the old Horch brand which is owned by Audi (and thus Volkswagen AG): Years ago Audi re-bought the brand name and all the rights, but Mr. Piech of Volkswagen - a man not undisputed, but an extremely knowledgeable car guy - decided against re-viatalizing the brand, but later simply bought Bentley, a brand which - unlike Maybach - was present in the last 63 years (last original Maybach dates back to 1941) and well-known all over the world - Maybach was a brand mostly unkown outside Germany resp. Europe. I personally would not have re-launched the Maybach brand, there are too many problems involved in that like drawing away too much manpower from the Mercedes brand plus many, many hundreds of millions of Euro cost (if not billions). Ok, we now look forward to the next DC adventure, the B-Class, a VW Golf-class(!) competitor: How on earth can one give a car a name shouting out loud _this is no first class product, but a second-rate product only like a B-movie is_??? ============:-((((((((( Juergen "Juergen ." <jaguare@bigfoot.com> haute in die Tasten: > I personally would not have re-launched the Maybach > brand, there are too many problems involved in that > like drawing away too much manpower from the Mercedes > brand plus many, many hundreds of millions of Euro > cost (if not billions). ACK. 40 years ago Mercedes launched the Mercedes 600 and proved that they can compete with the top brands of the world. Why launch another brand which does not naturally sound superior to Mercedes? Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citroen - Made in Trance Why do you think that Merc needs a car in the EUR 250K bracket? To compete on price with Bentley? It's very strange. The S-Class was widely acclaimed as the best saloon in the world (not the most expensive), and the management just let it go. Yes, maybe that arrogance, or hubris. It's still good, obviously, but it does not seem to have quite that cachet that it did. BTW, to me the word Maybach seems to 'Germanic' and not so suitable for the English-speaking markets at which it is principally aimed. Well, maybe they were happy to emphasize 'German quality', just as a number of companies in Asia sport German names, even though they have no connection with Germany/Austria/CH. The name doesn't have a ring to it, either, like Daimler or Mercedes...and is not evocative like Jaguar... DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- >> "Juergen ." <jaguare@bigfoot.com> wrote in message >> > They miss sales figures by far - and they will never ever [quoted text clipped - 156 lines] > > Juergen "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng@nospam.co.uk> haute in die Tasten: > BTW, to me the word Maybach seems to 'Germanic' and not so suitable > for the English-speaking markets at which it is principally aimed. If Cadillac decided to launch a super-limo under the brand name "Duesenberg", do you think this would work? Frank Signatureplease replace spam-muelleimer with fk-newsgroups for e-mail contact Citroen - Made in Trance Good question! At least ...berg does not end with the guttural chhhh... DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- > "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng@nospam.co.uk> haute in die Tasten: > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > Frank > Why do you think that Merc needs a car in the EUR 250K bracket? To compete > on price with Bentley? [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > DAS I agree...sounds like a topic of conversation at an afternoon tea. > For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling > --- [quoted text clipped - 159 lines] > > > > Juergen PS. Let's see what the Americans will say. Maybe we should post the question on the Cadillac/GM NG...?... DAS SignatureFor direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling --- "Dori A Schmetterling" <ng@nospam.co.uk> wrote in message news:... > Good question! > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >> >> Frank |
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