Home | Contact Us | FAQ | Search & Site Map | Link to Us
Sign In | Join | Other 45 Sites in Network
HomeAnnouncements
Discussion Groups
By Brand
BMWChevroletDodgeFordGMHondaLexusMercedes-BenzNissanPeugeotToyotaVolkswagenOther Brands
By Topic
4x4 CarsRVsDrivingMaintenance & RepairCar AudioCollectible Cars
Country Specific
Australian ForumsUK Forums
ArticlesAuto InsuranceBuyingCars & TechnologyMaintenanceMiscellaneousSafety
DMV Resources
Related Topics
MotorcyclesBoatsMore Topics ...

Car Forum / Mercedes-Benz Cars / December 2004

Tip: Looking for answers? Try searching our database.

Ben the 1980 300SD Lives!!!

Thread view: 
Enable EMail Alerts  Start New Thread
Thread rating: 
Q - 25 Dec 2004 22:17 GMT
Gentleman Ben, the beloved 300SD, has now recovered from the unpleasant
3-piece camshaft episode (change out your vacuum pump before this happens
to you!).  After almost 2 years in the home hospital, a good used engine,
rebuilt transmission from Adsitco, a double buff & wax, and a lot of TLC
it now ticks over like a sewing machine and is ready for daily driving.

Questions to the group to aid final recovery:

The heat now doesn't want to shut off.  Without doing a lot of
troubleshooting I am thinking that something in the heater servo valve or
the control unit may have gotten stuck or corroded during the extended
idle spell.  I've already corrected some electrical glitches caused by
corroded contacts in the lighting.  Are there any typical failure modes
in the climate control system?  I am about to go through the CD to gain
familiarity.

Does anyone out there rebuild the servo valve and control unit for
reasonable prices?  The options I see at Rusty's and Performance Products
and Adsitco seem pretty high for these parts ($250-$1400).

Thanks again to Mr. Lambert and other frequent contributers for the
advice I've gleaned over the years.

Next in the emergency room is the 1986 300SDL with the possible cracked
head.
marlin - 25 Dec 2004 23:54 GMT
the cutlets,
  top with parsley, lemon slices and cracked pepper.
Serve with spinach salad, macaroni and cheese (homemade) and iced tea...

Spaghetti with Real Italian Meatballs

If you don?t have an expendable bambino on hand,
you can use a pound of ground pork instead.
The secret to great meatballs, is to use very lean meat.

1 lb. ground flesh; human or pork
3 lb. ground beef
1 cup finely chopped onions
7 - 12 cloves garlic
1 cup seasoned bread crumbs
? cup milk, 2 eggs
Oregano
basil
salt
pepper
Italian seasoning, etc.
Tomato gravy (see index)
Fresh or at least freshly cooked spaghetti or other pasta

Mix the ground meats together in a large bowl,
  then mix each of the other ingredients.
Make balls about the size of a baby?s fist
  (there should be one lying around for reference).
Bake at 400?for about 25 minutes -
  or you could fry them in olive oil.
Place the meatballs in the tomato gravy, and simmer for several hours.
Serve on spaghetti.
Accompany with green salad, garlic bread and red wine.

Newborn Parmesan
Q - 26 Dec 2004 01:07 GMT
for a smooth consistency, then mix again.
Form the sausage mixture into patties or stuff into natural casings.

Stillborn Stew

By definition, this meat cannot be had altogether fresh,
but have the lifeless unfortunate available immediately after delivery,
or use high quality beef or pork roasts (it is cheaper and better to
cut up a whole roast than to buy stew meat).

1 stillbirth, de-boned and cubed
? cup vegetable oil
2 large onions
bell pepper
celery
garlic
? cup red wine
3 Irish potatoes
2 large carrots

This is a simple classic stew that makes natural gravy,
thus it does not have to be thickened.
Brown the meat quickly in very hot oil, remove and set aside.
Brown the onions, celery, pepper and garlic.
De-glaze with wine, return meat to the pan and season well.
Stew on low fire adding small amounts of water and
  seasoning as necessary.
After at least half an hour, add the carrots and potatoes,
  and simmer till root vegetables break with a fork.
Cook a fresh pot of long grained white rice.

Pre-mie Pot Pie

When working with prematurely delivered newborns (or chicken) use sherry;
red wine with beef (buy steak or roast, do not pre-boil).

Pie crust (see index)
Whole fresh pre-mie; eviscerated, head, hands and feet removed
Onions, bell pepper, celery
? cup wine
Root vegetables of choice (turnips, carrots, potatoes, etc) cubed

Make a crust from scratch - or go shamefully to the frozen food section
  of your favorite grocery and select 2 high quality pie crusts (you
  will need one for the top also).
Boil the prepared delicacy until the meat starts to come off the bones.
Remove, de-bone and cube; continue to reduce the broth.
Brown the onions, peppers and celery.
Add the meat then season, continue browning.
De-glaze with
marlin - 26 Dec 2004 02:39 GMT
AFAIK the climate control system is designed so that when the control unit
fails, it won't do anything other than give heat, so I think that's your
culprit on that front. If you want better prices on parts and don't mind
going used, check pgauto.com. They have a storefront not too far from me and
as my car ages it has quite a few parts from them in it, the oldest being an
8 year old heater blower, which means the used unit has lasted almost as
long as the original and shows no signs of impending failure.
Richard
> Gentleman Ben, the beloved 300SD, has now recovered from the unpleasant
> 3-piece camshaft episode (change out your vacuum pump before this happens
[quoted text clipped - 21 lines]
> Next in the emergency room is the 1986 300SDL with the possible cracked
> head.
VCopelan - 26 Dec 2004 03:08 GMT
> Q noton@the.net
>Date: 12/25/04 2:17 PM Pacific Writes:

>Gentleman Ben, the beloved 300SD, has now recovered from the unpleasant
>3-piece camshaft episode (change out your vacuum pump before this happens
>to you!)

What happened to your vacuum pump?  How did it fail?  Was it a diaphram pump?
trader4@optonline.net - 26 Dec 2004 12:46 GMT
The most common failure mechanism is for the climate control servo to
go bad.  This controls the heater core water flow, vacuum flaps for the
heat/ac system, compressor, fans speeds, etc.   One failure mechanism
is for the lower plastic case to crack and leak water into the
motor/grear train and destroy it.  If you see coolant dripping from it,
it's shot.  It also has a feedback potentiometer in it that's part of
the resistor chain that maintainst the set temp.  Like all pots, it is
subject to dirt/bad spot's developing, particularly if it hasn't been
worked in awhile.  That's why it's advisable to cycle the system from
max heat to max cool about once a month.

Another common failure is the amp module that drives the servo.  The
servo is located in the engine compartment, pass side, near the
firewall.  The amp is directly behind the glove compartment.  These are
easily replaced and go for about $100

If you get to the point where you want to try to directly drive the
servo, you can do that with a 9V household battery.  You need to locate
the two connectors on the servo that run the motor inside the servo.
They can be found on the service diagram.  Disconnect the two wiring
harnesses from the servo  Applying the battery in one direction will
wind the motor all the way to full cool, reverse the polarity for full
heat.  And only apply it for a short period, if it's working, you will
hear the motor whir.  When it stops, its at the end of its travel,
(full heat or cool) so dont leave the battery connected or it will burn
out the motor.   If it's an issue with the pot, cycling it back and
forth a few times may restore it.

You can also measure the resistance of the pot through the terminals to
verify it that's the problem.  If it is, it's possible to remove the
top of the servo and spray cleaner into the pot.  Beyond that, the rest
of the servo is beyond the servicing of mere mortals.

If you need a new one, George Murphy at Performance Analysis, in TN
sells rebuilt ones.  He replaces the lower plastic housing with an
aluminum one.  I think he charges $5-600 for one.  However, beyond the
one yr warranty, he offers lifetime repair for $100, which I think
makes it a good deal.   I've had one for about 2 yrs now and it's been
working fine.  Also, T.G. said he was putting one of the new digital
ones, that replaces the whole craptacular system of servo and amp, so
you might want to check with him if it turns out you need one.  I think
those were a few hundred $$$ more.

Good luck!
Q - 29 Dec 2004 00:13 GMT
>> Q noton@the.net
>>Date: 12/25/04 2:17 PM Pacific Writes:
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
> What happened to your vacuum pump?  How did it fail?  Was it a
> diaphram pump?

Thanks to all for your advice.  The unit has fortunately broken loose and
is working OK now (the AC still needs to be recharged / converted).

The vacuum pump that failed was a piston type.  It might have been the
original with 250M miles.  The spring and lever are missing (probably in
the sump or out the exhaust pipe) and the pivot bracket was broken.  I
had just had the timing chain changed a month before, but the parts got
tangled in the chain and it jumped time.  My son, who was driving it,
said it had chugged for about 20 seconds as he tried to turn around and
head for home.  Then there was a frighteningly loud crack followed by
silence as he coasted to a stop.  The autopsy found that the timing chain
was broken, the camshaft was in three equal length pieces, and the front
three aluminum cam bearing towers were broken. No 2 cylinder top shows
just a light scratch corresponding to the valve that it met.  I think
that the cam towers are probably engineered to fail first to save the
bottom end.  I will further tear the block down to be ready for a
complete overhaul if the replacement 'used' engine shows signs of
eventual weakness.
VCopelan - 29 Dec 2004 02:57 GMT
> Q not@onthe.net Writes:

>The vacuum pump that failed was a piston type.  It might have been the
>original with 250M miles.  The spring and lever are missing (probably in
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>complete overhaul if the replacement 'used' engine shows signs of
>eventual weakness.

I have a 1980 300CD which snapped a timing chain at 208,000 miles.  My diaphram
type vacuum pump did not contribute to the failure but I never did determine
the actual cause of the failure.  I broke my timing chain in two places.
Several camshaft towers also snapped. The timing chain cut a hole in the upper
oil pan.  However, the force of the chain stopping also broke off the
crankshaft wood drift key and welded the crankshaft gear to the crank.  My
machinist welded the wood drift keyway back into shape.  About $2,500 later I
rebuilt my engine with new Mahle pistons, a new head, oil pump, oil pump
intermediate gears, chain tensioner and exhaust valves.  I'm still using my
original vacuum pump at 273,000 miles because I couldn't find anything wrong
with it upon diassembly.  Do the vacuum pumps often fail?  Should I change
mine?
R - 30 Dec 2004 03:29 GMT
>> Q not@onthe.net Writes:
>
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> wrong with it upon diassembly.  Do the vacuum pumps often fail?
> Should I change mine?

I had read here and been told by a Mercedes mechanic (after my incident)
that the vacuum pumps last up to 200M miles and should be preventatively
changed out.  My offending piston type was frozen in the  sleeve when I
disassembled it.  I went with back with a new one from Rusty on the
replacement 'used' engine.  Due to a parts ordering mixup I have rebuild
kits for both a piston and diaphragm type that could be let go for a
fraction of the original cost.
VCopelan - 30 Dec 2004 05:36 GMT
>R not@goingto.net Writes:

>I had read here and been told by a Mercedes mechanic (after my incident)
>that the vacuum pumps last up to 200M miles and should be preventatively
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>kits for both a piston and diaphragm type that could be let go for a
>fraction of the original cost.

I'll have to speak to my mechanic about vacuum pump replacement.  I have
friends who have driven their 240D's to over 400,000 on the original vacuum
pump with only diaphram replacement. The diaphram pump is so simple, it's hard
to believe that much could fail.  I guess the bearing on the cam follower could
go?
Tiger - 26 Dec 2004 13:41 GMT
It is like you said... stuck servo. Take the hoses off and see if you can
somehow free the valve... Once freed, I think it will be fine... try this
before you decided to replace the entire servo.
T.G. Lambach - 28 Dec 2004 00:44 GMT
Congratulations on your restoration job, many others would have give up.

The climate control system has two troublesome components: the
"amplifier: (logic board} which is located behind the glove box - remove
the glove box to access it - look for a cigarette size perforated black
box on the fire wall with a multi wire connector on its bottom side. The
logic board's solder connections crack and its logic becomes erratic and
illogical.

These are sold rebuilt for about $100.

Then there's the servo, that cursed monster under the hood. These are
sold rebuilt for $400 to $500 - I'm told that 20% of the rebuilt units
fail in the first month so you may want to keep your old "core" until
the rebuilt has proven itself.

I would normally say the amplifier is suspect but since the servo hasn't
operated in two years it may be the offender.

There's a new alternative which I'm going to try. Performance Products
sells a digital servo replacement kit for $700 that does away with the
amplifier and the servo. It uses modern components. Its inventor
reverse engineered the old "system" and figured out how to replicate its
functions using modern parts.
R & K - 29 Dec 2004 06:04 GMT
> Gentleman Ben, the beloved 300SD, has now recovered from the unpleasant
> 3-piece camshaft episode (change out your vacuum pump before this happens
> to you!).

Not having heard this one, what happened with the vacuum pump?

Rochelle
1979 Frankenbenz (240D with 300SD engine)
 
Sign In
Join
My Latest Posts
My Monitored Threads
My Blog
My Photo Gallery
My Profile
My Homepage

Start New Thread
Enable EMail Alerts
Rate this Thread



©2008 Advenet LLC   Privacy Policy - Terms of Use
This website includes both content owned or controlled by Advenet as well as content owned or controlled by third parties.