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Car Forum / MINI / August 2004"Union" keys
Neither of my Mini's (1962 and 1964) have keys. One car has a key that works (but the key number doesn't match the lock number), and the other has none. Is there any supplier of keys? Preferably, I would like to find original "Union" brand keys, since that is what they had originally. They are "FS" type. Any ideas? Thanks :-) -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) In news:snlki0dndu3gpc90o7dgr4trhifabrmf92@4ax.com, Howard Rose <austinmini62NOSPAM@lycos.co.uk> decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant as follows > Neither of my Mini's (1962 and 1964) have keys. One car has a key > that works (but the key number doesn't match the lock number), and the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Any ideas? Thanks :-) somewhere.. I've got a full set of FS keys...  SignaturePete M Ford Capri (presently dead) - Sierra XR4x4x2 COSOC #5 Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain >somewhere.. I've got a full set of FS keys... Would you like to sell/lend me any? :-) -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) > Neither of my Mini's (1962 and 1964) have keys. One car has a key > that works (but the key number doesn't match the lock number), and the > other has none. > Is there any supplier of keys? Preferably, I would like to find > original "Union" brand keys, since that is what they had originally. > They are "FS" type. At pretty well any decent sized autojumble you'll find someone selling new ones. Signature*Virtual reality is its own reward* Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. >At pretty well any decent sized autojumble you'll find someone selling new >ones. I should keep my eyes open more (or go to more autojumbles!). Anyone know if a March 1964 Austin Mini SuperDeluxe should have FS keys? By 1964 BMC had stopped stamping the key code on the ignition barrel. The codes written on the door lock shafts don't have the prefix, just the number. I assume it would be FS, since that is what my January '62 Mini is? -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) In news:lerki01gre2hg7st1rkska4p6t0k1o6enb@4ax.com, Howard Rose <austinmini62NOSPAM@lycos.co.uk> decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant as follows >> At pretty well any decent sized autojumble you'll find someone >> selling new ones. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > prefix, just the number. I assume it would be FS, since that is what > my January '62 Mini is? I'll dig them out. I suspect they're rusting away in the garage. I think the shape of the head is the giveaway. IIRC the FS were rectangular, and there was another series that had a round head. I'll try and remember where they are. SignaturePete M Ford Capri (presently dead) - Sierra XR4x4x2 COSOC #5 Scouse Git extraordinaire. Liverpool, Great Britain > In news:lerki01gre2hg7st1rkska4p6t0k1o6enb@4ax.com, > Howard Rose <austinmini62NOSPAM@lycos.co.uk> decided to enlighten our [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > IIRC the FS were rectangular, and there was another series that had a round > head. I'll try and remember where they are. Hey Pete wouldn't mind if I could get a couple for my old MGB - I've looked and the particular numbers those keys have been used up. : IIRC the FS were rectangular, and there was another series that had a round : head. I'll try and remember where they are. I think the head shape varies. I have some original Wilmot Breedon FS keys here with round and rectangular heads. The other series which seems to turn up on classic cars is the FP: I think the difference is simply in the cross-section. It's quite easy to modify locks to fit a different key. Just take out the barrel, insert the key and very carefully file any proud tumblers flush with a small file. Yes, you lose a few tumblers when it's locked, but these are hardly the world's most secure locks in the first place... Ian > I think the head shape varies. I have some original Wilmot Breedon FS > keys here with round and rectangular heads. The other series which > seems to turn up on classic cars is the FP: I think the difference is > simply in the cross-section. Checking the FP and FS on my keyring confirms this. ISTR that I have a selection of MRN keys from somewhere too. Hillman perhaps? > It's quite easy to modify locks to fit a different key. Just take out > the barrel, insert the key and very carefully file any proud tumblers > flush with a small file. Yes, you lose a few tumblers when it's > locked, but these are hardly the world's most secure locks in the > first place... I've always found that a selection of 20 or so FS keys is sufficient to find one or two that fit, despite what the numbers say! >> I think the head shape varies. I have some original Wilmot Breedon FS >> keys here with round and rectangular heads. The other series which [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >ISTR that I have a selection of MRN keys from somewhere too. Hillman >perhaps? Don't know if it's original, but my Dad's 1947 MGTC has an MRN series ignition. -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) > : IIRC the FS were rectangular, and there was another series that had a > : round head. I'll try and remember where they are. > I think the head shape varies. I have some original Wilmot Breedon FS > keys here with round and rectangular heads Yes - to identify different keys, say for ignition and boot. Signature*Arkansas State Motto: Don't Ask, Don't Tell, Don't Laugh. Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. : > : IIRC the FS were rectangular, and there was another series that had a : > : round head. I'll try and remember where they are. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] : : Yes - to identify different keys, say for ignition and boot. What's wrong with the jiggle-and-twist routine? Useful fact: most BL cars from the 80's could be opened easily with most petrol filler cap keys. I suppose they just - and rightly - didn't think anyone would want to steal 'em ... Ian > Useful fact: most BL cars from the 80's could be opened easily with > most petrol filler cap keys. I suppose they just - and rightly - > didn't think anyone would want to steal 'em ... Fords were the same. Plenty of stories about people getting into the wrong car in a carpark and driving off. Signature*Life is hard; then you nap Dave Plowman dave@davenoise.co.uk London SW To e-mail, change noise into sound. > I think the head shape varies. I have some original Wilmot Breedon FS > keys here with round and rectangular heads. Wilmot Breedon got bought out by Rockwell Light Vehicle Systems, which changed it's name in 1997 to Meritor Light Vehicle Systems. I found some old Wilmot Breedon key blanks in a storeroom at RLVS in Australia many years ago, but I doubt they'd have anything left today. >I'll dig them out. I suspect they're rusting away in the garage. I think the >shape of the head is the giveaway. > >IIRC the FS were rectangular, and there was another series that had a round >head. I'll try and remember where they are. Yep, FS is the key with the slightly squarey oblong head. I have one key with a round head, that has FP as the key code. Actually, I've just checked the key codes again - my '64 Mini has FS keys, whereas my '62 should have FP... Pete, please let me know if/when you find the keys, and I will send you the numbers of the keys I am after. Cheers! -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) Could it have been Howard Rose who typed: || On Mon, 23 Aug 2004 23:17:55 GMT, "Pete M" || <pete.murray@blue-nopressedmeat-yonder.co.uk> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] || || Cheers! I have FS keys had lost one for my Caravan ( now found!) and just got a new one from my local Caravan dealer, he had a wall display full of them, Lucky I remembered the number! Des Des > >At pretty well any decent sized autojumble you'll find someone selling new > >ones. > > I should keep my eyes open more (or go to more autojumbles!). In case you don't know (I didn't till someone told me recently), there's a bit steam fair/ car thing at Blandford this week. Don't know what the jumble is like, or really what the even is like, but might be worth a visit? It's 13 quid on the door though :( >In case you don't know (I didn't till someone told me recently), there's a >bit steam fair/ car thing at Blandford this week. Don't know what the jumble >is like, or really what the even is like, but might be worth a visit? > >It's 13 quid on the door though :( Yup, the Dorset Steam Fair.. hopefully going but 12 quid?!? That's more than last year! I hope they take student discount :-P The autojumble is absolutely massive, but it's mostly piles of crap... you always go with hope though. -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) > >In case you don't know (I didn't till someone told me recently), there's a > >bit steam fair/ car thing at Blandford this week. Don't know what the jumble [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > I hope they take student discount :-P I'm keeping my fingers crossed someone I know's going to give me one of their passes for a day :) Otherwise double figures would seem a bit high, but then it could be worth it, don't know till I've been. > The autojumble is absolutely massive, but it's mostly piles of crap... > you always go with hope though. I lost track of the dates, otherwise one of those piles of crap might have been mine ;) > Is there any supplier of keys? Preferably, I would like to find > original "Union" brand keys, since that is what they had originally. > > They are "FS" type. http://www.oldlockandkeyco.co.uk I've not used them, and the web site does not inspire confidence (never trust anyone who accords himself the courtesy title "Mr"), but they've advertised for a while in the Octagon Car Club Bulletin. Or it's Beaulieu in a couple of weeks - there will be one or two there, I imagine. SignatureKevin Poole **Use current month and year to reply (e.g. jul2004@mainbeam.co.uk)*** Car Transport by Tiltbed Trailer - based near Derby I managed to get replacement "FS" keys for my Herald from Canly Classics at a cost of ?1.00 each. ISTR that they had several racks of keys, presumably "FP" etc. Although the ones I got were not UNION they were a much better fit than the very worn originals and did not fall out of the ignition whilst driving along. > Neither of my Mini's (1962 and 1964) have keys. One car has a key > that works (but the key number doesn't match the lock number), and the [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe > http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) > Neither of my Mini's (1962 and 1964) have keys. One car has a key > that works (but the key number doesn't match the lock number), and the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Any ideas? Thanks :-) Wilmott Breeden/Union locks are now made by Weston Body Hardware and the keys come with the WBH logo. If you want original Union keys go along to a classic car show and check out the trade stands. SignatureRichard Porter Mail to username ricp at domain minijem.plus.com "You can't have Windows without pains." >Neither of my Mini's (1962 and 1964) have keys. One car has a key >that works (but the key number doesn't match the lock number), and the [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >They are "FS" type. FS/FP series keys are commonly available, they were used widely on 60's motors, including Landrovers. A good locksmith would be able to get you a key made for the locks. If you have the lock numbers for both cars, then you may be able to buy a key pre-cut, or at least get one cut from the number. The series were later used on filing cabinets/office desks in the 70's and 80's as this was considered about the right level of security, rather than for automotive application. As for a genuine Union key, I'm not 100% sure Union still supply branded blanks for these series of locks, (if indeed they made them in the first place. It may well have been Yale or someone else) I expect they are too long out of production by now, and you'll probably have to put up with pattern blanks. Again, a locksmith would be able to inform you if it's possible to get genuine ones. Alex > Neither of my Mini's (1962 and 1964) have keys. One car has a key > that works (but the key number doesn't match the lock number), and the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > Any ideas? Thanks :-) I have cobbled together a page with illustrations of the most common vehicle ignition keys used throughout the 50's and 60's. The page also has a list of original FP, FS, & FT and a few others which I have available for sale. http://planefacts.co.uk/keys/ >I have cobbled together a page with illustrations of the most common >vehicle ignition keys used throughout the 50's and 60's. The page also >has a list of original FP, FS, & FT and a few others which I have >available for sale. > >http://planefacts.co.uk/keys/ Thanks, Richard - you have two of the three keys I need! I just need to confirm if my '64 Mini is an FS or FP series, and I'll send you an email... I'm getting some contradicting theories on another board! Anyone with a floor-start "dry" 1964 car care to tell me if their key is an FS or FP? My '64 was made in March or April 1964. Thank you :-) -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website) >Thanks, Richard - you have two of the three keys I need! Richard, you have mail! -- Howard Rose 1966 VW Beetle 1300 Deluxe 1962 Austin Mini Deluxe 1964 Austin Mini Super Deluxe http://www.howard81.co.uk/ (cars on website)
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