VG33 Pinging

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Rob Munach - 20 Jun 2005 11:47 GMT

I have a 2004 Frontier CC/long bed, 5 speed, 4wd (normally aspirated) w/
13k miles. I was towing a 1000lb trailer this weekend with the A/C on
and about 95 degrees outside. The engine was pinging severely when I
tried to accelerate at highway speeds or go up a long hill . This is the
first time I have noticed it ping. I run 87 octane, but I thought the
knock sensor would have taken care of any potential pinging. Do I have a
bad knock sensor or do I just need to run higher octane fuel when this
thing is loaded down?

Thanks,

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Rob Munach, PE
Excel Engineering
PO Box 1264
Carrboro, NC 27510

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Professor - 20 Jun 2005 13:15 GMT

This pinging may be normal.... considering the weight you had on there.
I would boost the octane when towing to reduce that problem.

Professor
Check out FlashAlert at www.telstar-electronics.com

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JimV - 20 Jun 2005 23:30 GMT

> I have a 2004 Frontier CC/long bed, 5 speed, 4wd (normally aspirated) w/
> 13k miles. I was towing a 1000lb trailer this weekend with the A/C on
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>
> Thanks,

The knock sensor can only retard the timing so far. You were probably at
the limit.

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Richard Tomkins - 21 Jun 2005 00:25 GMT

Pulling a heavy load in hot weather requires higher Octane fuel.

When the engine is pinging, what is actually happening inside is the fuel is
detonating and not burning.

The engine is designed to burn fuel, and the design of the combustion
chamber is such that a controlled burning wavefront proceeds from where the
spark occurs to get a clean burn.

A ping is in fact the fuel detonating in an uncontrolled fashion and this
means that you are sending more pollutants out the exhaust.

> > I have a 2004 Frontier CC/long bed, 5 speed, 4wd (normally aspirated) w/
> > 13k miles. I was towing a 1000lb trailer this weekend with the A/C on
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> The knock sensor can only retard the timing so far. You were probably at
> the limit.

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Steve T - 21 Jun 2005 03:22 GMT

> A ping is in fact the fuel detonating in an uncontrolled fashion and this
> means that you are sending more pollutants out the exhaust.

This is also like dynamite going off inside the engine which pounds the rod
bearings and can easily break piston rings and piston ring lands on the
psiton as well as other MAJOR damage (blown head gaskets etc). Also the
retarded spark from the knock sensor (even if there is no audiable pinging)
cause exhaust gas overheating resulting in burned exhaust valves and
crakced manifolds/studs etc. The poor fuel milage resulting from this
results in false economy thinking you are saving money buying cheapo gas.
There is a reason the recomend using higher octane fuel, this sensor is
ONLY there in case higher octane fuel isn't avalible in an emergency.

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Steve

http://www.atlantaracing.com

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Codifus - 30 Jun 2005 16:04 GMT

>>A ping is in fact the fuel detonating in an uncontrolled fashion and this
>>means that you are sending more pollutants out the exhaust.
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
> There is a reason the recomend using higher octane fuel, this sensor is
> ONLY there in case higher octane fuel isn't avalible in an emergency.

. . .but the VG33E, as in the 99 Quest I recently acquired, is
designed to run with 87 and maybe lower octane in high altitude
climates. Would putting a higher octane still be beneficial even though
the engine was not designed for it? I guess the pinging may go away, but
feul economy and such won't be optimum, I gather.

CD

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Richard Tomkins - 30 Jun 2005 16:21 GMT

From what I've been told by my dealer, if you are pulling a trailer of any
significant weight in hot weather and you get pinging, then for that period
of time that you pull the trailer, use a higher octane fuel and the pinging
should cease.
Change back when not pulling the trailer.

From what I have read, any time that the engine is pinging, your fuel
mileage suffers, and pollutant levels increase. I have not actually seen or
directly heard of a damaged engine yet.

rtt

> >>A ping is in fact the fuel detonating in an uncontrolled fashion and this
> >>means that you are sending more pollutants out the exhaust.
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> CD

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Rob Munach - 30 Jun 2005 18:54 GMT

> From what I've been told by my dealer, if you are pulling a trailer of any
> significant weight in hot weather and you get pinging, then for that period
[quoted text clipped - 44 lines]
> http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups
> ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----

I have also noticed mine pinging in hot weather w/o a trailer while
accelerating thru certain RPM's and when going up hills. I will try some
higher octane in the Summer and see what happens. I have noticed
recently when I drive with my windows down, how many OTHER cars are
pinging badly.

Signature

Rob Munach, PE
Excel Engineering
PO Box 1264
Carrboro, NC 27510

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Steve T - 21 Jun 2005 03:17 GMT

> I have a 2004 Frontier CC/long bed, 5 speed, 4wd (normally aspirated) w/
> 13k miles. I was towing a 1000lb trailer this weekend with the A/C on
> and about 95 degrees outside. The engine was pinging severely when I
> tried to accelerate at highway speeds or go up a long hill . This is the
> first time I have noticed it ping. I run 87 octane,

Towing 1000lbs, 95 degrees with A/C cranking and using cheap gas? Did you
ever READ the manual? It RECOMENDS higher octane than this and basically
has this sensor so you can use 87 if there is -no other choice-, not that
it's YOUR choice which to use..

Do you have any idea how much engine damage pinging does? I hope you've
invested the $0.10 a gallon you saved into something that has a VERY high
return! :-) You'll need to go ~1,600,000 miles to save enough to pay for
that engine.

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Steve

http://www.atlantaracing.com

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Rob Munach - 21 Jun 2005 09:15 GMT

>>I have a 2004 Frontier CC/long bed, 5 speed, 4wd (normally aspirated) w/
>>13k miles. I was towing a 1000lb trailer this weekend with the A/C on
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> return! :-) You'll need to go ~1,600,000 miles to save enough to pay for
> that engine.

Chill out, Steve. Maybe you should read the owner's manual! It says to
use 87 for non supercharged engines. This truck has never pinged before
nor did my '95 Hardbody pulling the same trailer on cheap gas. I have
never needed to use 89 or 93 but will now when I am pulling the trailer.
I am well versed in the engine damage that detonation does. When I heard
the pinging, I backed off.

Having a bad day?

Regards,

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Rob Munach, PE
Excel Engineering
PO Box 1264
Carrboro, NC 27510

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