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Car Forum / Peugeot Cars / August 2005407 sw 136hp fuel consumption
Dear All Any consensus on what I might expect? I was a bit alarmed by the average of what I saw the test vehicle was doing - mid 30s mpg. I was hoping for at least 40mpg average. Thanks m > Dear All > > Any consensus on what I might expect? You can expect to get whatever your driving style multiplied by your journey types, results in. > I was a bit alarmed by the > average of what I saw the test vehicle was doing - mid 30s mpg. > > I was hoping for at least 40mpg average. If you drive like an old lady, you'll see 40mpg. If you drive like an old lady on the motorway, you might see nearer 50mpg. If you drive it like you stole it, you might see 30mpg. If you drive it like you stole it on the motorway, you might see 40mpg. See ? The figures are totally meaningless. Suffice to say that modern engines of similar power outputs, all offer very similar efficiency - you would gain nothing in economy by choosing a different car (of the same power and class, obviously). My wife's Merc C220 CDI averages 41mpg combined mileage - roughly 60% motorway and 40% Town & Country roads. I would hope for something equivalent or better - perhaps people taking the demonstrator for spins around the block do not reflect average driving conditions. What I really want a 407 SW or Saloon 136 HDi owner to confirm is that the fuel consumption in the real world is not massively below what Peugeot state. >What I really want a 407 SW or Saloon 136 HDi owner to confirm is that >the fuel consumption in the real world is not massively below what >Peugeot state. If my 307 HDi (and 306 before that) is anything to go by, it will be. The 307 has an average of less than 40mpg on a mix of urban and motorway; the 306 HDi had an average of 44mpg on urban/m-way/rural. A far cry from the combined figure of around 54mpg.  SignatureHugo Nebula "If no-one on the internet wants a piece of this, just how far from the pack have you strayed?" > My wife's Merc C220 CDI averages 41mpg combined mileage - roughly 60% > motorway and 40% Town & Country roads. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the fuel consumption in the real world is not massively below what > Peugeot state. The problem is that a demonstration run isn't, as you have suspected, typical. People will try out the cars acceleration so you'll get lower figures. I think you'll find that you can achieve Peugeot's figures but probably only under fairly specialised circumstances. I had a Daewoo Nexia briefly. I couldn't get anywhere near the official figures initially and I'm not a boy racer. I had to radically modify my driving style from the BX diesel style (stick it in top and leave it there) to a much higher reving style to put the engine into its best consumption/power point. SignatureMalc > My wife's Merc C220 CDI averages 41mpg combined mileage - roughly 60% > motorway and 40% Town & Country roads. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the fuel consumption in the real world is not massively below what > Peugeot state. OK, I have done around 3000 miles in my 136 Hdi 407 saloon now. Eveny tank seems to get better than the previous one. When I first had the car i too was disappointed with the fuel consumption (but not with anything else about the car). However, a couple of weeks ago I managed a 52mpg average on a journey from the oustskirts of Leicester to the outskirts of Peterborough, a distance of nearly 40 miles along mostly single carriageway A road (it is mostly downhill though). Having driven around Peterborough a bit, then made the reuturn journey including driving thought Leicester with its plague of traffic lights, I still ended up with 44mpg over 100 miles. On that road there are, I think, five roundabouts, a village with a 40 limit and a couple of 50s, and I was able to drive at a steady 60 most of the way, but did touch 80 a cuple of times when overtaking. I had a bad weekend a week ago then..I made a succession of journeys of less than a mile, in blazing heat with the climate control on full cooling and around traffic light infested Leicester. I don't think I even got 30mpg! The 407 is not a town car! But as always it depends on how you drive it. Keep the revs below 2000 (not difficult - this is 70mph in 6th) and you will get good economy. Keep flooring the throttle and braking and it will drink diesel. I find this car has done wonders for my anticipation though. In 6th gear you can lift of the throttle long before you need to stop, say half a mile before a roundabout for example and still arrive there with most of you speed. And you have used no fuel for half a mile. It was driving like that that got me 52mpg! I also found that it is thirsty at high speed on motorways, ie 90 to 100, but it seems to be getting better at that as the engine frees off. Martin SignatureCreated on the Iyonix PC - the world's fastest RISC OS computer. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/m.dixon4/ Thanks Martin Living in Devon I expect to encounter a few hills but I am reassured by what you say. M > My wife's Merc C220 CDI averages 41mpg combined mileage - roughly 60% > motorway and 40% Town & Country roads. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the fuel consumption in the real world is not massively below what > Peugeot state. All fuel consumption figures are massively below what the manufacturers state ! They test them under optimal conditions, for obvious reasons. Unless you drive like a nun, and never go up hills, and always sit in the optimum gears at all times, and never drive into the wind, then you can't expect to get close to their figures. Forget about miles per gallon - it's a constant between classes these days. If you chose a 136bhp Diesel Mondeo instead, you should expect very similar economy to that which the 407 offers. The actual figure, isn't relevent. >> My wife's Merc C220 CDI averages 41mpg combined mileage - roughly 60% >> motorway and 40% Town & Country roads. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > If you chose a 136bhp Diesel Mondeo instead, you should expect very similar > economy to that which the 407 offers. The actual figure, isn't relevent. Economy is one of the main reasons for the popularity of diesels, and if you buy one of course you are interested! When I first had the 407 it almost became an obsession. Things that hit fuel consumption are hard acceleration, warming up the engine from cold, sitting in jams, and perhaps high speed driving (90 mph plus). Probably worse if you combine warming up the engine with cooling the interior with the aircon. But all cars are not the same. My experience with the 407 is very different from that of a friend with a diesel Passat. The Passat seems to be a lot less sensitive to driving style than the 407 for one thing. The 407 is a heavy car, at its best when driving at a constant speed. It is also very aerodynamic, and in 6th gear there is very little engine braking. It is not uncommon to be able to drive for half a mile or so with your feet off the pedals on even a slight downslope, without losing much if any speed. It takes a bit of getting used to, but my fuel consumtion now is fairly similar to my old 1.9 TD 306, despite the 407 being a much bigger car. But it needs a very different driving style to the 306 to achieve that Part of my improvment in fuel consumption I am sure is due to my learning how to drive it. For example, you need to learn to use a six speed gearbox. But the 407's 6th gear is very usable, above 50mph, and I even manage to overtake on single carriageway roads without changing down, I guess the overboost helps. There is plenty of accceleration there when you need it, but if you use it too often it will cost. Going to work and back today, covering 45 miles I averaged 44mpg. This is a bit better than I usually get, since I used a route on good single carriageway roads rather than my usual route on the M1. I usually get low 40s on the M1 journey, probably because I tend to cruise at 80 - 90 mph on the motorway where I can, rather than 60 as on the single carriageway. But overall I am very pleased with the car. I am not comvinced I would have preferred any of the alternatives I looked at. Even if Jeremy Clarkson did say of it "it will probably fall to peices in a coule of years and after all, who wants a car made by people who eat onions". Perhaps he should drive one! Martin SignatureCreated on the Iyonix PC - the world's fastest RISC OS computer. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/m.dixon4/ Thanks for this Martin. I'm getting a 407 SW 136 HDi with a 4 speed Auto Box and Cruise. This is basically the equivalent of what the missus has, except her 52reg Merc C220CDI chucks out a few more horse power. The Benz has a good trip computer and logs an average of 41mpg over the long term and has varied from 35mpg to 60mpg for individual trips. When she drives it the consumption is very good as she potters along - my lifestyle and diary can demand more speed > Thanks for this Martin. I'm getting a 407 SW 136 HDi with a 4 speed > Auto Box and Cruise. This is basically the equivalent of what the [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > trips. When she drives it the consumption is very good as she potters > along - my lifestyle and diary can demand more speed Very nice! I thought about the SW. Don't know about the auto box, but I'm sure it's fine. I think cruise might be a good idea, if I was choosing my car again I think I would go for it. My main requirement is to transport 4 big blokes to work, 20 miles away, 30 if i pick them all up from home) and back as part of a car sharing scheme. I have a motor caravan that is useful for carting anything big, so I went for the saloon. My car is the Hdi 136 SE Luxury Pack. The leather seats are nice, but I think the reversing sensor is essential, and I would suggest you go for it if you haven't already. You simply can't see the back (or front) of the car from the driving seat (but don't know if this is true of the SW). I can take or leave electrically adjustable seats (Peugeot's idea of "electric seats" is subtly different from Ford's - and also come to think of it of the US Prison service). but they came with the package. Another thing I might have found useful but haven't got is the "memory" function that can memorise driving seat, steering wheel and mirror positions for two different drivers. Since my wife sometimes drives the car (although she has her own as well) it would save a bit of fiddling around. Martin SignatureCreated on the Iyonix PC - the world's fastest RISC OS computer. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/m.dixon4/ The SW is an SE Lux Pack which I'm buying as a pre-reg with 3700 miles on the clock. Therefore the bells and whistles are pre-ordained. I understand that cruise is now standard across the range, but appears to have been included with all autos. It does have reversing aids (which I have noticed encourages false confidence and accompanying scrapes in other cars) but which should help the wife in the local Waitrose car park. Interestingly, the dealership in Leicestershire is charging just £50 to deliver to Devon on a low loader - don't think I could have travelled up and driven it back for less! > The SW is an SE Lux Pack which I'm buying as a pre-reg with 3700 miles > on the clock. Therefore the bells and whistles are pre-ordained. I [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > to deliver to Devon on a low loader - don't think I could have > travelled up and driven it back for less! Funnily enough I live in Leicestershire and bought my 407 SE Lux Pack from Yorkshire through a broker! I tried two local dealers and none could match the price. Martin SignatureCreated on the Iyonix PC - the world's fastest RISC OS computer. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/m.dixon4/ >> The SW is an SE Lux Pack which I'm buying as a pre-reg with 3700 miles >> on the clock. Therefore the bells and whistles are pre-ordained. I [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Martin And to get back to the original topic (and reply to my own post), today I did a bit of an experiment, clocking the fuel consumtion of my 407 HDI 136 through the roadworks at J21 on the M1, which has a 40mph speed limit enforced by SPECS (speed averaging) cameras. I chugged along at about 1200 RPM in 6th gear a steady 40mph, When I pressed the button to check the fuel consumption over the distance I nearly fell out of the car. Over 72 MPG! Now that is impressive! I think it might have impressed my (petrol powered Passat driving) passenger too! Martin SignatureCreated on the Iyonix PC - the world's fastest RISC OS computer. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/m.dixon4/ It turns out I have been missold by Research Garage in Hinckley - the Car they described as an SE (Luxury) on the Peugeot website and in their leaflet is in fact a plain SE with one or two extra like reverse aids - the Sales Director of Research gave a good impression of Bill Clinton wriggling about sex with Lewinsky as to why he had used the 'Luxury' in the car's spec level description. Caveat Emptor I guess - I should have driven from Devon to Leics to check it out before buying. So now I'm taking it to the local Peugeot dealership to have the fuel consumption checked out as its returning 30mpg on average on trips that I would get 40mpg + in the wife's Merc. If anyone's interested I may market the car for £15,700 if Peugeot in Launceston can't produce a substantial improvement. Funnily enough I met someone with a 307SW HDi who is similarly disappointed with the fuel consumption he is getting and is disposing of the car. > It turns out I have been missold by Research Garage in Hinckley - the > Car they described as an SE (Luxury) on the Peugeot website and in [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > If anyone's interested I may market the car for £15,700 if Peugeot in > Launceston can't produce a substantial improvement. I find this thread absolutely amazing :) Let's say you're paying 90p per litre for your fuel at the moment, so £4.10 a gallon. 10,000 miles @ 40mpg = 250 gallons = £1025 10,000 miles @ 30mpg = 333 gallons = £1366 The difference between 40mpg and 30mpg is absolutely *nothing*, when compared with your tax/servicing/MOT/insurance/depreciation costs ! Let's say they work out at somewhere around £3000 a year (£500 tax and insurance, £2000 depreciation, a few hundred quid servicing), because you're choosing to run a brand new car. The £341 difference in fuel costs, is such a small proportion (somewhere around 10% of the total yearly including-fuel costs), that it may as well not exist. > Funnily enough I met someone with a 307SW HDi who is similarly > disappointed with the fuel consumption he is getting and is disposing > of the car. He's changing his car for the sake of £341 a year !!!! Does he realise how much depreciation is costing him ? If yearly costs are such an important issue, then he must be an absolute mentallist to run a new car !!!! Forget about fuel consumption. If you want to lower your running costs, the first place to look is at the depreciation. It's by *far* the biggest expense. Agreed, which is why fuel consumption is the straw that breaks the camels back. Compare the Peugeot with, say, a Volkswagen Golf Mk5 and the numbers look bleak. BTW I could do a lot of things with £341 - don't know about you!! > Agreed, which is why fuel consumption is the straw that breaks the > camels back. Compare the Peugeot with, say, a Volkswagen Golf Mk5 and > the numbers look bleak. > > BTW I could do a lot of things with £341 - don't know about you!! The VW pumpe duse engine is known to be a bit more efficient than the HDi. but the HDi is still pretty good if you drive it sensibly. Compared to a diesel Passat the 407 HDi is much more sensitive to driving style. With the VW, (and with my old 306 XUD) it seems to make little difference. With the 407, it seems to be everything. Yet if you take the trouble to learn to get the best out of the 407, i think you will find that it makes you a better driver. BTW, I was so impressed with the England cricket team's score against the Aussies ysterday, that their run total is written all over my car! Martin SignatureCreated on the Iyonix PC - the world's fastest RISC OS computer. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/m.dixon4/ > It turns out I have been missold by Research Garage in Hinckley - the > Car they described as an SE (Luxury) on the Peugeot website and in [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > disappointed with the fuel consumption he is getting and is disposing > of the car. I should hang on a bit if I were you. When I bought my 407 SE 136 Lux Pack earlier this year i felt the same way, disappointed with the fuel consumption. At the time I though I may have made a mistake, but I am now quite happy with the fuel consumption. Having now done 4000 miles it is much better, I look like achieivng my first 600 miles from a tank of fuel before my next fill up. Every tank of fuel does a bit better than the last one. Part of this is learning how to drive the car, but I also think the engine is getting more frugal as it runs in. Last week, I drove for a few miles at a steady 40mph in 6th gear through the speed limited roadworks on the motorway and achieved over 72 mpg on the trip computer. I regularly achive around 44mpg on journeys now, (mixed motorway and trunk road) and it is still improving. But part of it is driving style. If you lift off the throttle in 6th gear on even a slight downslope, you don't lose speed. Meanwhile you are not using any fuel. Also, it you accelerate hard, the car will go well but will drink fuel, so reserve the use of hard acceleration for times when you really need it. Also, try to avoid braking as much as possible. Doing so will not only save fuel, but improve your anticipation (and hence driving skills) too. Smooth driving will lead to better fuel consumption. At all times use the highest gear you can. The engine will pull from 1000rpm if necessary (but usually I won't change into 6th until around 50mph. it pulls better above 1500rpm). The car seems most efficient at low revs in 6th. I already mentioned 72mpg at a steady 40, at about 55 in sixth I still get over 50mpg. But this falls rapidly as speed increases, at 70mph probably about 45mpg and less at higher speeds. I have found that to get the best fuel consumption I have had to adapt my driving style, I think for the better. The 407 seems more sensitive to how you drive it than many other cars, perhaps because it is a heavy car. It is not a city car though, and it finds stop start driving thirsty work. But even then, smooth driving will help. The SE luxury is an SE with reversing sensot and half leather electically adjustable seats. BTW you can get a new one for around 15,700 UKP if you shop around. Mine was less than 16K new with metallic paint! Oh, and BTW somebodty drove a 407 136 HDi across Australia the other week at an average of 73mpg. But I think they had the aircon turned off! Martin SignatureCreated on the Iyonix PC - the world's fastest RISC OS computer. http://homepage.ntlworld.com/m.dixon4/ |
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