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Car Forum / Porsche / Porshe 911 / April 20091996 911 fuel problems
I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holdin it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel came out So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressur problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some hel here, thanks.......... don't know about 996, but if it were any of the earlier, including 993 I'd consider the following 1. you can hear fuel pump run when ignition first turned on 2. fuel pump relay and fuse - the relay frequently fails, costs $18 3. jumper battery to fuel pump and see if it runs 4. pump could fail, filter could clog, pressure sensor could indicate high pressure, etc 5. what does OBDII say? read the codes of course, I wouldn't mind a water cooled car for the wife - where is this located? >I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. I > pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holding > it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel came out. > So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressure > problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some help > here, thanks........... > Scorp wrote: > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. I pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holding it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel came out. So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressure problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some help here, thanks........... OK so scrap Step 2, made a mistake. What I thought was the fuel pump, was the fuel gauge sending unit. I know this from A: removing it and seeing no fuel lines, and B: I saw the fuel gauge in the car not reading.......DUH sorry... Ok back to step 1. Where would I find the fuel pump? and where is the fuel pump relay? I have looked at both the fuse boxes under the front hood (passenger side) and in the rear (driver side) > Scorp wrote > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holdin it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel cam out. So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressur problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some hel here, thanks.......... Ok so on to step 2 I pulled the connector off the fuel pump located in the front hoo (993), and put a meter on it to see that it read voltage when turned the ignition on, and that was ok, so I re-connected it an tried the ignition again, BUT I never heard the pump motor. So I wil try to remove it and investigate that further. I don't have a cod reader, so I don't know what or where to plug it into the car. Thank so far I will keep you posted. P.S. Car is located in south Florida View the attachments for this post at http://www.jlaforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=19637670#1963767 > Scorp wrote > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holdin it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel cam out. So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressur problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some hel here, thanks.......... Hurry!!! Ok so I found the fuel pump it's under the front car between the wheel under a splash guard. An the fuel relay is in the front passenger side fuse box, marked a "DME+MI". Have no idea what that means, anyhow I put m hand on the relay as my father turn the ignition key on and off, an I felt the relay click, so I take it, it not the fuel pump relay that it's the fuel pump? While doing this, I didn't hear the fue pump motor, and really not sure if I could hear it at all with th splash cover on > > Scorp wrote: > > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. I [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > pump motor, and really not sure if I could hear it at all with the > splash cover on. OK, you are getting somewhere DME = Digital Motor Electronics - wiggle the relay see if it helps. Take a voltmeter and see if you are getting 12V at the fuel pump power terminals - if no, use jumper wires to bring 12V and ground (observer polarity, I don't know if your car has a brushless motor for the fuel pump or not) to the fuel pump motor and see if it runs. Check the fuel pump fuse On my 993, the connector for OBD2 is on the right side panel next to where my feet go - it will be shown in your owner's manual - you did READ the owner's manual, right? You can buy an OBD II reader for about $15 to $1000 - suggest you get one and see if it reads a code of any kind - for $500 or more you can get ones that will read most of the dynamic parameters - my local Porsche dealer charges a relatively modest fee (around $100) to hook up to their fancy computer and tell you what's up - so for $30 for a car trailer and whatever your dealer charges you, you can get a printout of what ails the car. If it were mine, I'd be verifying that power gets to the pump - on a (non-porsche) car, I once found a failure inside the computer that would drop out the fuel pump relay at inopertune times - my solution was to add a simple bypass switch (it was a cheap and nearly worthless car) - but you need to figure out if the motor is getting power or not > Scorp wrote > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holdin it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel cam out. So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressur problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some hel here, thanks.......... FINALY.. I located ther fuel pump under the front of the car, NOT i between the wheels, as I was told from the Porsche Dealer, but rathe just infront of the passenger floor board to the center is anothe smaller splash guard At first I unbolted it so that it was hanging down so I ca work on it better. With my father helping, I gave it a few taps whil my father crank the engine, to see if it would start.....but nothing So then I put a voltmeter on it and when the iginition is turn on do ge voltage so far 8.5 volts, only because I need to charge the batter from cranking the engine over so much So the next thing I did, was to attaching my battery charger t the fuel pump terminals (-+) and when I did that I felt and fuel pum vibrating, but no normal fuel pump sound. With the battery charge attached I then turn the key, and still no starting of the motor, S I wanna say that it is the fuel pump. I have not removed it yet, bu still feel it's the fuel pump > > Scorp wrote: > > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. I [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > I wanna say that it is the fuel pump. I have not removed it yet, but > still feel it's the fuel pump. This is where you need to look at the manual - if the fuel pump isn't getting voltage, then something else (at least) is wrong. I'm not convinced you found the fuel pump - if you are persistant you can find a manual at less than retail - I don't have one for 996, only 993 - you need to read up on the starting sequence, verify why the pump (if it is the pump) isn't getting power, and so on. Charge your battery. get some ether (starting fluid). Once battery is charged, squirt some into air cleaner and start car - if it fires and runs for a moment, you know you have a fuel problem - you still don't know what problem but you know it's fuel. if it doesn't fire, you have an ignition problem (at least). The vibrating fuel pump is probably a result of using the battery charger to power it - if you are lucky you didn't destroy it. You need to figure out why it wasn't getting power. When I told you to jumper power to it, I didn't say "using your battery charger" - I would guess that if you jumpered from the battery it would run properly, but it is a cheap test. If your battery is down to 8.5V that by itself might be enough to keep the car from starting > Scorp wrote > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holdin it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel cam out. So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressur problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some hel here, thanks.......... Taking all your advice and calling th dealer, I did find the fuel pump. I metered my battery and it wa fully charged with 12.3 volts. when I placed my meter on the fue pump I got a reading of only 8.5 volts with the key on, thats why thought I had a half charged battery. So when you said to jumper th pump with the battery with 12 volts, I metered my charger and had th same output of 12.3 volts, so thats why I use it. So unless the fue pump only take 8.5 volts and not 12 volts, that's maybe why it show that I also read on the PDF below from clark's garage that I can chec the DME relay, and/or bypass it. So I made a jumper and bypassed th socket using 87, 87b and 30, and when I did that I still did not hea or feel the fuel pump going, nor did the car start. So having don this tells me that the DME is not effected, so it must be the pump unless the 8.5 volts is the issue. 561 642-0832 thanks View the attachments for this post at http://www.jlaforums.com/viewtopic.php?p=19753893#1975389 > Scorp wrote > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. pulled the fuel line off the fuel rail, and with someone else holdin it, I crank the motor over for atleast a minute, and no fuel cam out. So either the fuel filter is clogged, or I have a fuel pressur problem, or a fuel pump problem. So I hope anyone can voice some hel here, thanks.......... Ok, so I finally pulled the fuel pum out from under the car. It is a Bosch 12V electric pump. I placed 1 volts to the terminals, and again it sparked as I touched it and th pump started to hum, but not buzz like a normal pump, and a suspected, it seems to be jams or locked up. I called a Bosc rebuilder, and the tech was asking me if I can see in the top wher the fuel inlet is if the fuel was spinning or feel it spinning and said no, he then said from what I explained to him, that the pump wa locked up with some kind of debris. So, I think I have found th problem..............BUT. When I was under the car removing the fue pump, I notice the fuel lines coming from the gas tank. But I did no see any "fuel filter" to the fuel pump. I know there is filter in the back of the car up inside the passenger's side, bu what filter the fuel to the pump? So lets assume I get a new pum replace it, car start and everything is okie dokie. I go to a ga station fill up and get some bad gas and something in the fuel ge stuck in the new fuel pump again??? Then what ??? > > Scorp wrote: > > I have a 911 that won't start. It cranks over but will not start. I [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > station fill up and get some bad gas and something in the fuel get > stuck in the new fuel pump again??? Then what ???? I don't know your car, but there is probably at least a screen there - ask the dealer if there is a filter betwen the tank and the pump - if no, drain some gas out through the hose to the pump to get any additional debris out. And, I'd change the fuel filter > I don't know your car, but there is probably at least a screen there - ask > the dealer if there is a filter betwen the tank and the pump - if no, drain > some gas out through the hose to the pump to get any additional debris out. > And, I'd change the fuel filter Isn't this a 1996 911 (993)? I am following this without much to contribute. Sorry, Scorp. But when my pump goes out, I'll know what to do, so thanks for that. Where was it, btw? DS 95 993 Coupe >> I don't know your car, but there is probably at least a screen there - >> ask the dealer if there is a filter betwen the tank and the pump - if no, [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > DS > 95 993 Coupe I thought it was a 996 - if it is a 993, I have the manuals and can look it up (if I ever have time to think straight) |
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