Well, we got the Allegiance out of the garage and popped it up in the
driveway earlier this week. Thus far, we had only camped in it once, and
regular readers will recall the problems we (and Jim Redelfs) found in our
brand new "little house", and how glad we were we had purchased from the
dealership we had, given Fleetwood's response.
The new section of canvas came in a couple of months ago. Before accepting
delivery, the dealership had found a small leak (more of a seep) in the
tip-out, and had already ordered a new section before we came to get it.
It took four months to get here, but only a couple of hours for them to put
it in, and we had not had it out of the garage since.
Now, the bad news. When I took it to the dealership I hooked the battery up
so the brakes would have power in event of a break-away. I know, maybe
over kill for towing 10 miles, but it was there, why not? When I brought
it back home, I reverted into the mind set of being a Taos owner, and never
thought of unhooking the battery. I didn't have to with the Taos, as it
when popped down, the only thing that could tap the battery was the porch
light, and that was easy to see if on.
The Allegiance of course is equipped with a propane detector, and ran the
brand spanking new battery down to almost nothing. (sigh) You could see,
if you looked closely, the filament glow in a light bulb.
OK, it's got a smart charger/converter, just plug it in, right? Great!
Where the &^#@ is the adapter for the extension cord? Went through all the
cupboards and storage areas, couldn't find it. Ran down to Ace hardware,
bought a new one, and on the way home thought I should have checked in the
cubby in the back of the TV. Yup, got it home, but now have a spare
adapter.
Plug in the camper, and hear what I think is the charger running. Angela
and I talk for a bit, then come to think that this sound is *not* the
charger. Check it out, and sure enough, somehow, either we, or the dealer
when they worked on it had flipped the rocker switch on that turns on the
water pump. (second sigh) Thinking of installing a guard on the switch
now.
The pump had only run for a matter of a few minutes, and had not made any
untoward sounds before discovery and being turned off so we don't believe
(or maybe hope is a better word) that there was no damage. I guess this is
a drawback to how the dealership remounted our water pump last fall. If it
had still been installed as it was originally, there would have been *no*
doubt that it was the pump running - it had been that loud.
Other than just an airing out, Angela's main goal of getting the camper
popped up was doing a little inventory and actually weighing all of what we
had in it. She had a bathroom scale out, and had now weighed every thing
we have in the camper (except the contents of one last cabinet) before
loading up bedding, clothes and perishables.
I think she is more concerned about weight distribution than I am. :) She
was also wondering how close to the load limit we were - again, with it's
specs, something I wasn't concerned about at all. There were T'storms
forecast the next day, so we got it in before she got completely done - one
cupboard left to weigh. Our having company slowed down her progress.
She now want me to take the camper to a set of scales next time we get it
out, and see what the total weight is. This is something we intended to do
when we got it, but were anxious to camp, and then the problems with the
pump/gas line were discovered, so it was something we didn't get to last
fall.
Overall, I was pleasantly surprised by the weight we had in there. Given
she loves to cook when we camp, there is considerably more cooking "stuff"
than I would have in if I were to do this solo, including cast iron frying
pan, and two cast iron dutch ovens. I am *not* complaining here at all!
We eat as well, or better camping than we do at home!
Total weight of "stock" items in our camper? 225lbs.
We plan/hope to camp next month at least once, twice if we can. Once
locally to do our annual "shakedown", and then to go visit kids/grandkids
in Illinois.

Signature
Karl & Angela
`02 Durango
`05 Fleetwood Allegiance
Jim Redelfs - 10 Mar 2006 00:23 GMT
> Well, we got the Allegiance out of the garage and popped it up in the
> driveway earlier this week.
Yeah. It looks GREAT and made me want to GO CAMPING!!! :)
> When I took it to the dealership I hooked the battery up so the
> brakes would have power in event of a break-away. I know,
> maybe over kill for towing 10 miles, but it was there, why not?
You did the right thing. In the event of a breakaway, you would have KICKED
yourself had you NOT hooked-up the battery. Better safe than sorry...
> When I brought it back home, I...never
> thought of unhooking the battery.
Oops. :(
> propane detector...ran the brand spanking new
> battery down to almost nothing. (sigh)
Oops2. (Ain't RVing grand?) :\
> now have a spare adapter.
That's a guarantee that you'll never need more than the one. Hehehehe!
> water pump [ran dry]
For the relatively short time it ran "dry" (antifreeze in the system), I'll
bet it is undamaged. There's only one way to tell, however: Use it.
> Thinking of installing a guard on the switch now.
Where is the switch located? Is it easily bumped? If yes, a guard would be a
good idea. A better idea would be a battery disconnect, or simply remember to
manually disconnect the battery between outings.
> If it had still been installed as it was originally, there would have
> been *no* doubt that it was the pump running - it had been that loud.
Amen to that. Fortunately, we weren't camped near a cemetery as it would
surely have been the night/day of the living dead. (huh?) :)
> She had a bathroom scale out, and had...weighed every thing
> we have in the camper
I almost freaked when I saw the scale. Now THAT's an RVing woman! :)
> Our having company slowed down her progress.
Yeah? Well, her making fabulous suppers doesn't help! (Thenk-kew!)
> We eat as well, or better camping than we do at home!
Same here. That's one of the reasons I LOVE TO CAMP!! :)
See ya soon!
:)
JR

Signature
:)
JR
miles - 10 Mar 2006 00:40 GMT
> The Allegiance of course is equipped with a propane detector, and ran the
> brand spanking new battery down to almost nothing. (sigh) You could see,
> if you looked closely, the filament glow in a light bulb.
That happens with most trailers. I installed a battery disconnect
switch and just flip it off when storing.
> Plug in the camper, and hear what I think is the charger running. Angela
> and I talk for a bit, then come to think that this sound is *not* the
> charger. Check it out, and sure enough, somehow, either we, or the dealer
> when they worked on it had flipped the rocker switch on that turns on the
> water pump. (second sigh) Thinking of installing a guard on the switch
> now.
Most water pumps turn themselves on and off per demand for water. My
trailers have never had an on/off switch for the pump. Consider adding
an inline auto-switch to your pump so this sorta thing can't happen.
Jim Redelfs - 10 Mar 2006 03:14 GMT
> Most water pumps turn themselves on and off per demand for water.
Hence, its name: Demand water pump.
> My trailers have never had an on/off switch for the pump.
Really? That's extremely unusual.
My (bought new) 1987 Starcraft Galaxy popup had an on/off switch for the
demand pump as does my 2000 Skamper travel trailer. In fact, I'd be amazed to
see a demand water system WITHOUT an on/off switch.
> Consider adding an inline auto-switch
Too late. It already has one.
> to your pump so this sorta thing can't happen.
That was the problem. The on/off switch got bumped ON. Without adequate
fluid (antifreeze or water) to pressurize the system, the pump ran
continuously.

Signature
:)
JR
2000 Skamper Ultra 249 TT
2002 Chevrolet Silverado 2500HD
Vortec 8100 - Allison 1000
miles - 10 Mar 2006 03:41 GMT
>> My trailers have never had an on/off switch for the pump.
>
> Really? That's extremely unusual.
Maybe there is a switch somewhere but I've never used it. If dry it
won't run. Maybe it's got a water sensor in addition to a pressure
sensor which is a pretty easy cheap thing to do.
My first trailer had only a manual pump sink so that explains that one! lol
Karl & Angela - 10 Mar 2006 14:47 GMT
>> The Allegiance of course is equipped with a propane detector, and ran the
>> brand spanking new battery down to almost nothing. (sigh) You could see,
>> if you looked closely, the filament glow in a light bulb.
>
> That happens with most trailers. I installed a battery disconnect
> switch and just flip it off when storing.
That would make it a little easier to do, but no easier to remember. I knew
when I connected it, I would have to disconnect, I simply forgot to.
>> Plug in the camper, and hear what I think is the charger running. Angela
>> and I talk for a bit, then come to think that this sound is *not* the
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> trailers have never had an on/off switch for the pump. Consider adding
> an inline auto-switch to your pump so this sorta thing can't happen.
The pump *was* running to try to pressurize the system, and would have shut
off if there had been any water to bring up to system pressure. The
factory installed rocker switch is to kill power to the pump for those
times when the pump is not needed/wanted (i.e. on city water, or it's too
cold to use the UF tank). It's just the rocker switch is too easy to flip
on without meaning to.

Signature
Karl & Angela
`02 Durango
`05 Fleetwood Allegiance
Bill Toth - 10 Mar 2006 22:35 GMT
> The pump *was* running to try to pressurize the system, and would have shut
> off if there had been any water to bring up to system pressure. The
> factory installed rocker switch is to kill power to the pump for those
> times when the pump is not needed/wanted (i.e. on city water, or it's too
> cold to use the UF tank). It's just the rocker switch is too easy to flip
> on without meaning to.
It not clear to me if the trailer was up or down. If down, the galley
kill switch should have killed the 12v feed to the interior.
Karl & Angela - 11 Mar 2006 03:47 GMT
>> The pump *was* running to try to pressurize the system, and would have
>> shut
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> It not clear to me if the trailer was up or down. If down, the galley
> kill switch should have killed the 12v feed to the interior.
Doesn't that kind of answer your own question? You might re-read the first
line of the original post. (Sorry if that sounds snotty, but I thought the
answer was obvious) The rocker switch I am referring to is beside the sink
cabinet.
I have a hard time believing that other campers don't have some type of
additional switch for the water pump like ours does. They *have* to!
Since the pump *will* run when it senses a loss of pressure, and since the
system does not have pressure when first setup, if there were no on/off
switch, why wouldn't it run whenever there is power, regardless of whether
there is water in the tank?

Signature
Karl & Angela
`02 Durango
`05 Fleetwood Allegiance
Korey Atterberry - 11 Mar 2006 14:23 GMT
> It not clear to me if the trailer was up or down. If down, the galley
> kill switch should have killed the 12v feed to the interior.
For what it's worth, on my Jayco popup, we do have a kill switch
(attached to the roof) but the pump is still operable when the roof is
down. We have an external shower, so I guess the thought is that you
might want to use that when folded up. There is a rocker switch inside
that shuts it off.
Korey
Jim Redelfs - 11 Mar 2006 16:30 GMT
> For what it's worth, on my Jayco popup, we do have a kill switch
> (attached to the roof) but the pump is still operable when the roof is
> down. We have an external shower, so I guess the thought is that you
> might want to use that when folded up. There is a rocker switch inside
> that shuts it off.
This sounds right. I believe the folded-down kill switch is to ensure that
the ceiling lights, if left on, turn off so they won't damage the canvas or
fabric they are touching when folded.
Killing the entire interior when folded would disable the propane detector.
I'm not sure that would be be BAD if it happened, but it's another possible
reason that the kill switch disables only the ceiling lights. Since it was
the propane detector that drained the battery to begin with (battery left
connected while folded and in storage), perhaps it would be a good idea to
wire the pump BEHIND the kill switch.
In any case, whether it made it clear to begin with, Karl's camper was
popped-UP for this little pump SNAFU.
The guy can fly a 747 but can he run a popup? Nooooooo... Sheesh! <vbg>

Signature
:)
JR