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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / RVs / December 2006pop up question
I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... I need to find a good used pop up. I have tried the green sheet and the rv trader. I would worry about bidding on something that expensive on ebay motors. Got any ideas..... Cindy My 6 cly mini van has almost 200,000 miles on it so I want somthing with a 10 foot or smaller box I think. I have never towed anything except a u haul a few years ago. >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but >not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >with a 10 foot or smaller box I think. >I have never towed anything except a u haul a few years ago. Hi, Mini vans are not good tow vehicles, so you are smart to find the smallest lightest you can. Look in the Yellow Pages under Recreational Vehicle dealers in your area. Call them up and see if they sell pop ups new and used. Then go look at them. RVtraderonline.com will usually have a bunch listed too. If it's just you by yourself going to use it or you and one other look at Aliner's they are small, lightweight and easily towable and can be had with most of the goodies of the bigger pop ups. A new one will be as cheap as some of the larger pop ups used. If its for a family then the Aliner is most likely to small. Take care and Happy Campin...  SignatureRichA "We Get Too Soon Olde and Too Late Smart" >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but > not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > with a 10 foot or smaller box I think. > I have never towed anything except a u haul a few years ago. What you are looking for is not going to be found easily. Pop-ups that light and small are either very old or very expensive. You will have to shop hard. Look at auto auctions in the area - see if ADESA has any in your area. Buy every Sunday paper and every auto trader/trading post the morning it comes out. You might have something by spring. A four pin hitch will be no problem, it's just splicing wires. However, you are asking a piece of machinery (your van) that is nearing the end of it's useful life to perform tasks it was not suited to when it was new. Be prepared to get another vehicle. Once you get another vehicle, you'll probably want to change your pop-up....so, you might consider the vehicle first. That would give you more options when looking for a camper. You won't need a big V-8 or super sized truck....but a big six or a big V-6 might be nice. You'll probably find one that has a tow package which would give you heavy suspension and a tranny cooler factory installed.... maybe even a hitch. Some of the newer minis would be a lot better than what you have now. john <snip> > > My 6 cly mini van has almost 200,000 miles on it so I want somthing > > with a 10 foot or smaller box I think. [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > even a hitch. Some of the newer minis would be a lot better than what you > have now. I have to agree. We tow with a Chevy Astro (similar to GMC Safari), which is one of the most capable ninivans (some call it a mid-size van). But it's coming up on 200,000 miles (more than 28,000 miles towing) and is starting to demonstrate it's age (a/c issues, electronic ignition module replaced, charging system issues, burns more oil, differential seals leaking, needs new shocks, etc.). I don't expect to be able to tow with it too much longer. Austin > <snip> > [quoted text clipped - 32 lines] > > Austin And they don't make them anymore. GM has a small diesel in their cargo van. (I have one in a truck). Wonder why they don't offer it in the passenger version. However, with the price of fuel I question if it is worth it. <snip> > > I have to agree. We tow with a Chevy Astro (similar to GMC Safari), > > which is one of the most capable ninivans (some call it a mid-size [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > Wonder why they don't offer it in the passenger version. However, with > the price of fuel I question if it is worth it. In our case, it won't matter. Our youngest is a Junior in High School, and won't be camping with us much longer. Our oldest daughter recently turned us into grandparents ;-) and younger daughter gets maried in the spring. So we will soon be in the market for a smaller pop-up and a smallish pickup truck. It makes no sense to haul a trailer for 6 with a van made for 7 when there's only the two of us. Austin > <snip> > [quoted text clipped - 22 lines] > > Austin But now is the time when you start looking at those big 5th wheels and began to think about spending a few months in AZ each winter:-). >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but > not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > with a 10 foot or smaller box I think. > I have never towed anything except a u haul a few years ago. OK, Cindy, I will offer a different perspective than the other folks so far because I actually have been towing a decent sized popup since we bought our 98 Toyota Sienna. We have 187K miles on it now and it has performed rather well for us. All we did was put a hitch and a wiring harness on it (no trans cooler) and we have used it that way since. A big question here is what kind of mini-van do you have? If it is an American one it will likely be less capable than if you have a Toyota, for example. By this I mean that the Toyota at least seems to be built to be more drivable and more durable in my personal experience of driving this for this many miles and also driving other brands. Our first popup was a Coleman Destiny Rio Grande. Not a small one, but not a big one either. It trailed well (back roads and highway) once I put better tires (higher load rating) on it, and it did not wag the Sienna unless I went too fast (at which point I let off of the gas and let it glide back down to under the safe speed). We trailed that for many trips each year until the end of last year when it was rear-ended. Now we have a slightly heavier Coachmen Clipper model (has A/C on top and a heater, but otherwise basically the same design with the cargo box in the front, one Queen and one King size bed). It does not trail quite as well as it sits up much higher and has meek tires, but it still does fine. We bought both of our popups used for about $2500 each, not new, and neither one of them had anything wrong with them. It sounds like you are going the route of fixing up your van and then matching a trailer up with its capabilities. Whichever one you consider purchasing, I suggest that you actually hook it up to the van and trail it around a bit, and especially take it out on the highway. The type of harness you will need to install will depend upon what the trailer has. I had to change from my original 4 prong plug to a 7 prong one because my second camper has brakes. If your purchase has brakes you will need to install a brake controller for about $300+ unless you do it yourself. Tell us more of your thoughts, Cindy and we can help talk this through for you. Tomes > >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but > > not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > purchasing, I suggest that you actually hook it up to the van and trail it > around a bit, and especially take it out on the highway. Part of the reason why I got the hitch installed...but no harness yet. I wanted to "test tow." > The type of harness you will need to install will depend upon what the > trailer has. I had to change from my original 4 prong plug to a 7 prong one [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Tell us more of your thoughts, Cindy and we can help talk this through for I do renaissance festivals so I will be living in this for a few months at time...as in 5 weeks here and 8 there...and 4 elsewhere.... thus it needs to be big enough for me to BUILD stock in. My mechanic checked over the van and he thinks it will be capable for towwing a good size pop up. I have only towed a small u haul and it wasnt with this van. The van is a GMC safari 6 cly..No leaks in oil...I check oil often because I had a van that had a real real leaky rear main seal so it ate oil as fast as gas. Most of the people I know who tow popups have mini vans...stock and booth go in van..living stuff in camper. I think my clothes will go in van as well as most camping gear except sheets, cooking gear, dishes,towels and dishes and the small tv if I get one. Houston has a lot of used car dealers but few rv dealers used or new... my busness partner uses a dodge grand caravan with a 4 cly so I dont think the 6 will have a problem..she tows a 10 foot box and has less wieght then I do off stuff in the van...She drives at 70mph or faster. My van will be well loaded with stuff and the pop up will have bulky items but not heavy...as in not carrying water,I can get water at the camps,but will have propane tanks. My big concern is the fact that I am going long distance cross country, and want to know should I look for something that has brake assist or not? Should I load with wieght in back or front...I load my van with most of the wieght in the middle. I plan on getting the bigger rear view mirrors for visibility and doing the tape and flag thing in the rear window for hitching up. Thanks for all your help so far.. Cindy > you. > Tomes >> >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but >> > not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 100 lines] >> you. >> Tomes For your use, I would look at a used, low mileage Class C motor home. If you need a trailer for your supplies, just get a Wells Cargo or other small enclosed trailer. For extended living, more room, and you could have your work room inside. Probably the same overall cost as a van and pop-up. > For your use, I would look at a used, low mileage Class C motor home. If > you need a trailer for your supplies, just get a Wells Cargo or other > small enclosed trailer. For extended living, more room, and you could > have your work room inside. Probably the same overall cost as a van and > pop-up. Not a bad idea at all, but she already has the tow vehicle. >>> I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but >>> not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 85 lines] >> you. >> Tomes That van will handle up to 4000 pounds without much trouble. Just be very certain that you have a good transmission cooler. That is one weak point with that vehicle. And go ahead with the 7 pin connector. I think it is getting to where most trailers come with them. You can always use an adapter to go to 4 pin or whatever. It most likely will already have a trailer harness in the spare tire area. If you are lucky it will even have the blue brake wire. Cindy - I inserted a few responses into your test - hunt for them :D Tomes >> >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but >> > not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 73 lines] > oil as fast as gas. Most of the people I know who tow popups have mini > vans...stock and booth go in van..living stuff in camper. You have a lot more van than I thought you had from your first post. These vans (these are not mini-vans, but real vans) have towing capacities of about 5000 pounds or so (I did a quick googling...), and that would be a lot of popup. The big differences here are that it is bigger and outweighs the trailer by more, and that it is rear-wheel drive, which helps a lot. I do not think that you are very tow vehicle-limited here. > I think my > clothes will go in van as well as most camping gear except sheets, > cooking gear, dishes,towels and dishes and the small tv if I get one. We are weekend or weekly campers. We leave all our camping stuff in the camper all of the time, so we never need to pack up to go, just load into the Sienna clothes and musical instruments and food. Having that storage compartment at the front of the camper (it looks like a bit of a nose with a flap on top) helps us greatly in this. We, however, open that compartment up before we slide the beds out and take out what we want as getting in there is a bit more tedious once we cannot open the top flap. There are doors on the side and another door for access from inside the camper, but at least the big stuff needs to be out of there. > Houston has a lot of used car dealers but few rv dealers used or > new... We bought our first popup at a garage sale. I happenned to drive by it and stopped in to look at stuff (specifically at the time looking for washtubs to make washtub basses out of) and in the back they had it set up with a sign on it. This was soon after we got the Sienna in 98. It was in great shape and looked really cool to me as we had been camping in the 10x16 tent and really wanted to get up off of the ground finally. So I ask about it and the lady says that there was another lady with kids that were just looking at it and went home to get the dad so if I wanted it, there was competition. So I went home to get the wife to bring her to look at it and it turns out that she was the one who was looking at it! We bought it 10 minutes later. The second and current one was bought from someone in this newsgroup, who happenned to casually mention in a conversation that he was selling his. It turned out that he lived a couple of hours away, but right near my parents-in-law. So we went for a visit to them with a side trip to look at the popup and came home with it. My point to this is that you never know where one will be found. Always keep your eye out and expect the unexpected. Going to a dealer who wants to make his profit would have been a last resort for us, but that is just me, I like buying from real folks who want to see their stuff go to a good home. > my busness partner uses a dodge grand caravan with a 4 cly so I dont > think the 6 will have a problem..she tows a 10 foot box and has less > wieght then I do off stuff in the van...She drives at 70mph or faster. Me too. How you load up the trailer (about 10% of the weight on the tongue, weight centered as best you can and not able to slide around) and the tires that are on it make a lot of difference in this in my experience. > My van will be well loaded with stuff and the pop up will have bulky > items but not heavy...as in not carrying water,I can get water at the > camps,but will have propane tanks. The propane tanks will be mounted on at the front of the popup by the battery. > My big concern is the fact that I am going long distance cross > country, and want to know should I look for something that has brake > assist or not? Whether or not is has brakes will depend upon the nature of the popup. If it is big enough it will have brakes; if it is smaller it will not. The manufacturer knew if it needed them when it built them. You have a lot of van here, so I would not make this a citerion. If you had a minivan or smaller, like the Rav4's that Eksak's neighbors use then the brakes would be more critical in relation to their tow vehicle. I only have brakes because that popup came with them. I would have been OK with it if it did not. > Should I load with wieght in back or front...I load my > van with most of the wieght in the middle. You want about 10% of the weight to be on the tongue. Having a wheel at the front that cranks up and down is essential in my opinion. You don't want weight to be loaded on one side over one wheel, in the middle is best. Your way of loading the Safari between the axles is excellent thinking - continue to do that. > I plan on getting the > bigger rear view mirrors for visibility With my first popup it was pretty low and I was able to see over it using my rearview mirror just fine. I did not get wide mirrors for that. With this one now it sits up much higher and also has that A/C unit ((I recommend A/C for your use by the way as you will be plugged in ususally) is directly in my line of vision. I will be getting some sort of side mirror extenders for this season as I now need them. For you in the Safari, I would expect that you will likely not even need them as you sit so far up. I would suggest that you drive it around a bit after you own it and then decide. > and doing the tape and flag > thing in the rear window for hitching up. I have never done this but hear that it is a good thing. I have just become pretty good at lining it up and normally have someone guiding me. I open up the wayback door and can see pretty well, putting my eye between the seats and using the wayback door latch as a sight. > Thanks for all your help so far.. > > Cindy No problem! This is fun. Tomes > > >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but > > > not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... <snip> > > It sounds like you are going the route of fixing up your van and then > > matching a trailer up with its capabilities. Whichever one you consider [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Part of the reason why I got the hitch installed...but no harness > yet. I wanted to "test tow." <snip> > > Tell us more of your thoughts, Cindy and we can help talk this through for > > I do renaissance festivals so I will be living in this for a few > months at time...as in 5 weeks here and 8 there...and 4 elsewhere.... > thus it needs to be big enough for me to BUILD stock in. Our family (3 adults, 1 teen) lived in our Coleman Bayside for 5 weeks while we were between homes in 2003. This is not an unreasonable expectation for a pop-up. A Class C might be more comfortable (but not necessarily). I am picturing something like dressmaking, with significant amounts of fabric, a couple sewing machines, a serger, a layout/cutting table...that much stuff could be made to work more easily in a pop-up with a slideout than in many Class C's. Things like woodworking, forging, or firing pottery would be too much. Look at models with slide-outs - they have more floor space, but at a price (both money and weight). > My mechanic > checked over the van and he thinks it will be capable for towwing a > good size pop up. I have only towed a small u haul and it wasnt with > this van. > The van is a GMC safari 6 cly. Ah. That is a very capable tow vehicle. We tow with a Chevy Astro, which is the same thing with a Chevy label instead of the GMC label. We've towed our 3250 lb. Coleman Bayside 28,000 miles with it, including at least eight times over 8,000 feet (and at least once over 9,500 feet). We took one trip in the Bayside that lasted 8 weeks and covered 10,000 miles. It's fun to tell people we went on a vacation where we had to change the oil three times during the trip, and again right after returning. We don't typically call our Astro a minivan, it's more like a mid-size van. t doesn't really belong in the minivan class. > No leaks in oil...I check oil often > because I had a van that had a real real leaky rear main seal so it ate > oil as fast as gas. Most of the people I know who tow popups have mini > vans...stock and booth go in van..living stuff in camper. I think my > clothes will go in van as well as most camping gear except sheets, > cooking gear, dishes,towels and dishes and the small tv if I get one. Remember this - the weight of stuff and people in the van comes off what the van can tow. So if you put nothing but you and gas in the van, you can tow 5-6000 lbs (depends on model year & some other details). If you put 1200 pounds of stuff in the van, the tow rating drops to 3800-4800 lbs. > my busness partner uses a dodge grand caravan with a 4 cly so I dont > think the 6 will have a problem..she tows a 10 foot box and has less > wieght then I do off stuff in the van...She drives at 70mph or faster. 70 MPH is asking for trouble for someone who is inexperienced at towing. Faster than 70 MPH is always asking for trouble. Between my wife and I, we have towed a handful of different trailers over 40,000 miles on all kinds of roads in about 30 states from Maine to California. I think a grand total of five minutes of that was over 70 MPH. On three occasions, I've seen trailers go whizzing past us, only to see the same trailer on the side of the road later with a shredded tire. One time, I actually said to PJ, "I think we'll see him again, hopefully with just a tire problem." It took about three hours, but there he was, with one shredded tire and a flat spare. He would have arrived sooner - many hours sooner - if he had checked his tire pressure and slowed down. > My van will be well loaded with stuff and the pop up will have bulky > items but not heavy...as in not carrying water,I can get water at the > camps,but will have propane tanks. > My big concern is the fact that I am going long distance cross > country, and want to know should I look for something that has brake > assist or not? Yes. Get a trailer with brakes. They are not only safer, but save wear and tear on the van's brakes. In my opinion, electric brakes are better, but hydraulic surge brakes are adequate if the trailer is right otherwise, and don't require a controller. If you do get a trailer with surge brakes, make sure they are working. > Should I load with wieght in back or front...I load my > van with most of the wieght in the middle. Load the van with the weight in the middle. Load the trailer with the weight in the front, but don't overdo it. You want 10%-15% of the trailer's actual weight to be on the tongue. So if the trailer weighs 2,000 lbs, the tongue should weigh 200-300 lbs. Going over 300 lbs or under 200 lbs can make things unstable. All else being equal, it's better to go over. > I plan on getting the > bigger rear view mirrors for visibility and doing the tape and flag > thing in the rear window for hitching up. With the Safari, you should be able to see through the rearview over any pop-up without A/C. But in Houston, there aren't many pop-ups without A/C, and you will probably regret not having it. But if you live there, you already know that. ;-) Austin HI again, > > > >I just got the transmission cooler mounted in my van, a tow hitch but > > > > not a 4 or 7 point electical harness ... [quoted text clipped - 60 lines] > details). If you put 1200 pounds of stuff in the van, the tow rating > drops to 3800-4800 lbs. I figured that. I have about 1500 pounds of stuff to sclep including stock. Plus there would be household stuff in camper such as dishes and other stuff. > > my busness partner uses a dodge grand caravan with a 4 cly so I dont > > think the 6 will have a problem..she tows a 10 foot box and has less [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > arrived sooner - many hours sooner - if he had checked his tire > pressure and slowed down. So far she has done ok and there isnt a brake assist on her set up. > > My van will be well loaded with stuff and the pop up will have bulky > > items but not heavy...as in not carrying water,I can get water at the [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > otherwise, and don't require a controller. If you do get a trailer > with surge brakes, make sure they are working. Dumb question but how do you know the surge brakes are working. I would assume I would feel a pull from the rear? > > Should I load with wieght in back or front...I load my > > van with most of the wieght in the middle. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > without A/C, and you will probably regret not having it. But if you > live there, you already know that. ;-) Gotta have AC... > Austin If there is one thing that I really enjoy about this newsgroup is the diversity of popups and tow vehicles, but the love of the popup remains the high point. My tow vehicle is a 97 Isuzu Rodeo, and I tow an 84 coleman sun valley. Its great, especially here in Alaska. My neighbors bought their popup from craigslist. That might be an alternative location for getting your popup. And they tow with a RAV4 and also a KIA Sedona (with brakes on the popup) in your internet browser, just type in craigslist and they are usually in the RV section. Now I will say that my neighbor took the popup to our local RV dealer and had the bearings re-packed and the dealer did an inspection of all the connections, i.e. propane, electric and water& sewer. rember on craigslist, you get what you pay for. but they were lucked out. |
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