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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / RVs / July 2005Wally world batteries and charger question.....
Question- I replaced my Wal-Mart Exide 6 volt batteries today with four new of the same. We are using the coach starting next week for 8 days. My question is: Should I have the house battery charger charge the batteries (using the Magnetek 7300 charger - which I believe is NOT a multi stage charger and not using the RV until the specific gravity is "proper") for the first time or just use my Century multi-stage automobile charger/starter unit to charge the batteries for the first time and then put them back in the RV after done? (the auto charger I believe will charge then trickle charge when "full") Or just install the batteries and forget about it, they will charge automatically when cycled.... Which do you old timers recommend? After asking Chris Bryant a question - I am considering re-doing how the batteries get charged/used, and tossing the 4KW inverter for a new one like a Trace or similiar that can charge the house batteries the proper way. I would think that batteries - when properly maintained - would/should last longer than 16 months. I do maintain the fluid level in the battery, but the Magnetek boils them dry... Glass Mat batteries? Anyone ever use Nicads? (like we do on the airplanes) Thanks Ed I see where "The Airman" <airman@mn.rr.com> contributed: > I am considering re-doing how the >batteries get charged/used, and tossing the 4KW inverter for a new one like >a Trace or similiar that can charge the house batteries the proper way. Good plan. Our inverter/charger (Heart Freedom 1500w, now a Xantrex product) has the 3-stage charge feature and has maintained our 4 golf car batteries without trouble for 6 years. Will Sill The Curmudgeon of Sill Hill Hello- The same golf cart batteries for 6 years? - If so what brand are they? I have a hard time getting my car battery to last that long, let alone my coach batteries. Thanks. > Our inverter/charger (Heart Freedom 1500w, now a Xantrex product) has > the 3-stage charge feature and has maintained our 4 golf car batteries > without trouble for 6 years. > Hello- > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Thanks. You car Battery's for the most part are just the cheapest junk that will last long enough for the warranty coverage. However deep cycle battery's that are maintained with good quality 3 stage charger will last eight plus years, all of the ones I have had did. Wade I see where "The Airman" <airman@mn.rr.com> contributed: >The same golf cart batteries for 6 years? - If so what brand are they? Yes, since Nov '98 - Brand X - not W-M - Sam's club. >I have a hard time getting my car battery to last that long, let alone my >coach batteries. I'm sure it is dumb luck but I just last month replaced what appeared to be an OEM (MoPaR label) battery in our '98 Cherokee. I don't KNOW it's the original, since I bought the Jeep used, but . . . . very few people go to a new car dealer for a battery! Will Sill The Curmudgeon of Sill Hill > The same golf cart batteries for 6 years? - If so what brand are they? Our Trojan T-105s lasted that long. Key to long battery life is to NOT discharge them below 50% charge, and not boil them dry by leaving a converter that does not reduce voltage to a safe level plugged in all the time. A cheap way to keep them charged yet not dry them out in storage is to use a cheap timer on the converter and run it an hour a day. A more convenient way is to use a three stage converter. With our Progressive Dynamics PD 9155 we only add water annually. We use the RV 6 months of the year, with 4 months stored plugged in at home, and 2 months stored without electric connected, and battery cables REMOVED to prevent discharge. It works for us. HTH, Barrie B > Hello- > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Thanks. I just yesterday replaced my 2 Trojan T-105s after using them since I bought my motorhome new in April, 1997. They have been kept charged by a Hart Interface inverter, and occasionally equalized. I have also got a small solar charger that is mounted on top of one of the air conditioners, that provides a small trickle charge to the house batteries and starting batteries. Since I don't plan to keep this motorhome another 8 years, I opted to replace them with 2 6-volt batteries from Sam's club. Hope they last at least 4 years. L'l John Hi Ed, If they were my batteries, I would use the charger that will apply the battery manufacturer's recommended absorption voltage to the batteries until the current fell below 1% of the capacity rating of the batteries. Please see Section 9 in the FAQ on www.batteryfaq.org for more information on charging and chargers and Section 4 on testing. NiCads are typically not used for RV applications because they are too expensive when compared to wet lead-acid batteries. The reason NiCads are used in aircraft applications is because of their resistance to extremely cold temperatures. However, AGM batteries are starting to replace NiCads for aircraft applications and are becoming more popular for RV and marine applications. Kindest regards, BiLL........ >Question- > [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > >Ed Hi Bill I looked at the FAQ. Thanks for the info. Lots of it. I wondered about the NiCad batteries because I know the airplane I fly for a job has them in it. I also see a rack of them once in awhile when I am over in the hanger asking a wrench (mechanic) about an airplane mechanical problem. (I think they are also a refillable type NiCad)- I don't know about the cost, but it was a thought since they appear to be durable. They have a metal case- or it appears that way. They seem to work well to turn the APU over on a cold morning after a night being cold soaked at more than -60F. I have been told AGM batteries last longer - do they really? Are they worth the cost? I was thinking of building a slide out bracket to hold an additional 2 batteries and also put the generator start on it's own small 12v marine battery. I already have 2 starting batteries for the RV engine. After looking at some of my friends diesel pushers- it looks like (George Lowry) they have a "farm" of tall batteries for the coach and separate starting batteries for the motors. (No George, my wife has not made up her mind on which pusher to get- I want the stainless steel bus - remember? She wants a fiberglass pusher- I don't) I am amazed that some people have had their coach batteries last 8 years.... I have had to replace mine every 20 months. The Magnetek charger boils the acid out during the winter, or so it seems. A maintenance question - looking at the battery water level- do you keep the battery water level to the the bottom of the plastic fillers? or below the fillers? (the level of the fluid was about 1.5cm below the fillers, but the plates were covered) What is recommended, there are no instructions on the battery. Thanks Ed > Hi Ed, > [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > BiLL........ On Tue, 19 Jul 2005 19:24:25 GMT, "The Airman" <airman@mn.rr.com> wrote: >Hi Bill > [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] > >Ed Ed, First you don't want a "Marine" battery for your generator. Use a starting battery. The marine is a compromise that does nothing well.. I recently put Deka AGM in the Bluebird for house batteries - will let you know how they stand up. I used them in place of the Interstate junk that the dealer had put in to replace the Gel Cells. If your Magnetek is boiling your batteries, you need to make some changes. Get a smart charger that controls the charging current according to temperature. I normally try to keep the water level to the bottom of the indicators. Don't have to worry with that for the AGM and Gel Cells. And look for some pictures online of the fiberglass jobs AFTER they have been in a collision. That is the only reason I have the Bluebird. Other than body strength, their designers are just as bad as the rest of the industry. BTW, WE are departing Friday for full timing. Will be at the FMCA convention in Minot, ND, Aug 12 - 18th. Hope to see you guys there. George > First you don't want a "Marine" battery for your generator. Use a > starting battery. The marine is a compromise that does nothing well.. [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > George Hi George- I am looking at a few solutions, since Will Sill and gang use a "smart charger" and have had good luck with them (so they tell me) Hmmm.. Gel Cells? are they better? Do they last longer? I have seen the Chinese and Japanese batteries in the computer UPSs. This Magnetek 7300 "solid state" series is for the birds. After talking to Chris Bryant about the unit, I did some more research. A charger that uses temp and voltage is superior. I know what you are talking about regarding the Fiberglass jobs.. I saw one (a picture) after a collision up north (MN) with a dump truck. It was a Monaco. The dump truck darned near cut the front of the RV off. My nephew is a MN State Trooper up there and he said it was not pretty. I am thinking of just getting a shell like a Prevost or MCI and doing a conversion myself in a barn I have down south. I have a friend who is a cabinet maker and I would help him make the wood for the inside. A couple of guys from the company who have RV conversions (They are interior people in refurb) that I could pay to help, especially if they go on strike soon. Are you still near KSMF? Going back into the training department. Tired of the line for awhile. Minot hmm... I was there for a Spooky conference years and years ago. Other than seeing Buffs in that state, I have not seen much else. I am going on a 450 mile bicycle ride next week for charity (310+140 loop) been doing that all summer here and in the UK. Those fiberglass jobs are nice though.... Say hi to the wife... Ed >Hi George- > >I am looking at a few solutions, since Will Sill and gang use a "smart >charger" and have had good luck with them (so they tell me) Hmmm.. Gel >Cells? are they better? Do they last longer? I have seen the Chinese and >Japanese batteries in the computer UPSs. Supposedly the Gel Cells have a long life but they do not have near the capacity of the wet cells. The AGM's are someplace in between. Check out www.amplepower.com for his recommendations on batteries. And remember that EVERYTHING is a compromise. >This Magnetek 7300 "solid state" series is for the birds. After talking to >Chris Bryant about the unit, I did some more research. A charger that uses >temp and voltage is superior. Yep, Heart interface and now Trace, both owned now by Xantrex, have smart charging systems. There are some converters that have a smart system also. Do lots of research before making any decision. >I know what you are talking about regarding the Fiberglass jobs.. I saw one >(a picture) after a collision up north (MN) with a dump truck. It was a >Monaco. The dump truck darned near cut the front of the RV off. My nephew >is a MN State Trooper up there and he said it was not pretty. Did the wife see that picture? I am thinking >of just getting a shell like a Prevost or MCI and doing a conversion myself >in a barn I have down south. I have a friend who is a cabinet maker and I [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Are you still near KSMF? For about two more days. We are departing Friday. >Going back into the training department. Tired of the line for awhile. > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Ed George >I have been told AGM batteries last longer - do they really? Nope!! AGMs are much more vulnerable to pre-mature failure than flooded wet cells, when operated under less than ideal conditions. If you are experiencing problems with flooded wet cells, then AGMs are definitely not the answer! >I am amazed that some people have had their coach batteries last 8 years.... >I have had to replace mine every 20 months. The Magnetek charger boils the >acid out during the winter, or so it seems. There are a couple of critical pieces of info missing from your data: 1. Where does your rig spend most of it's time; and in what kind of temperatures? 2. What voltage is the Magnetek placing on fully charged batteries? As veteran boondockers, we have just returned from a 2 month trip from Toronto to Alaska with a pair of 12 volt Trojans which are still functioning quite well under such adverse conditions after 7 years; And we have a Magnetek 7400 converter which is the functional equivalent of your 7300. While the Magnetek works flawlessly in most environments, it's voltage is set to 13.8 volts, which is a compromise setting intended to cope reasonably well in most north American climates. And to that end, the 13.8 volt setting is optimal in 80F degree ambient temperatures. In the southwest, where temperatures often exceed 90F, and sometimes well over 100F, it's going to boil the batteries dry rather quickly. Not that the batteries will be damaged under those conditions, but you will have to top them up on a whole lot more frequent basis. Up here in Toronto, where I keep my Magnetek connected 24/7, it's only necessary to top up the batteries once a year; whereas in Texas during extremely hot weather, you might have to top them up every week or two. Nothwithstanding, that batteries will last a whole lot longer in cold than hot climates. For instance, the battery in our aged Lincoln Town Car is still up to 3/4 capacity after 11 years! It's also possible that your converter is out of whack. Magnetek sets their converters to 13.8 volts. If yours is running any higher, then the voltage adjustment may be out of whack, and will shorten the life of your batteries in hot climates. Otherwise you should be able to leave it plugged in 24/7 in moderate climates. If the voltage is off, it's possible to adjust it via an internal variable resistor. >A maintenance question - looking at the battery water level- do you keep the >battery water level to the the bottom of the plastic fillers? or below the >fillers? About 1/8" below. I am in Minnesota where the temp varies from -40F to -45F in the winter to over +100F sometimes in the summer (with the Minnesota State Bird, the mosquito and their cousins the deerfly to make sure your always moving in the summer sauna bath) We take the rig to mainly the Midwest and Manitoba/western Ontario most summer weekends and some weeks, about 4 to 5 months out of the year. I only had it out once in the middle of winter, and that was the last of that. I will have to measure the Magnetek output after a day or so of the batteries charging. >>I have been told AGM batteries last longer - do they really? > [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > > About 1/8" below. |
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