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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / RVs / November 2005Buying an RV
Some friends of mine are looking to buy an RV. They are looking at a new Class A made by Monaco. They have no trade-in, and are arranging their own financing. My question is: Since gas prices are high, summer is over and sales are down, how much can they expect the dealer to drop off MSRP? Is 30% off out of the question? Any other "buying tips" will be greatly appreciated. Hank <~~~thinks the new "employee discount" program is BS. > My question is: Since gas prices are high, summer is over and sales >are down, how much can they expect the dealer to drop off MSRP? Is 30% >off out of the question? No, 30% off is not out of the question. Hunter -- http://members.aol.com/hhamp5246/roadtrip2005.htm Life's journey is not to arrive at the grave safely in a well-preserved body, but rather to skid in sideways, totally worn out, shouting "...holy sh.t...what a ride!" >> My question is: Since gas prices are high, summer is over and sales >>are down, how much can they expect the dealer to drop off MSRP? Is 30% >>off out of the question? > >No, 30% off is not out of the question. It seems 30% off MSRP may or may not be a good deal depending on the markup. As with cars, isn't the key is knowing the dealer cost? Only then can you determine if the dealer applied a reasonable profit, and yes, the dealer deserves a profit. How does one go about finding the dealer cost? > It seems 30% off MSRP may or may not be a good deal depending on the > markup. As with cars, isn't the key is knowing the dealer cost? Only > then can you determine if the dealer applied a reasonable profit, and > yes, the dealer deserves a profit. How does one go about finding the > dealer cost? Easy. You buy a dealership. Why is it assumed that if you know the dealer cost that you improve your bargaining position? Why is it assumed that the dealer will somehow give you the unit at cost? Why is it assumed that the dealer will somehow give you this inside information out of the goodness of his heart? Steve, who believes the best way to buy a MH is to pay cash and put the interest money to work. > > It seems 30% off MSRP may or may not be a good deal depending on the > > markup. As with cars, isn't the key is knowing the dealer cost? Only [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Why is it assumed that if you know the dealer cost that you improve your > bargaining position? I don't assume that, but others do. Others assume that because some dealers advertise that they are selling at their cost. Of course we know that is bullshit. > Why is it assumed that the dealer will somehow give you the unit at cost? They MAY sell it at their original cost according to the original invoice (which they may show you). But, since then, the manufacturer is apparently giving the dealer a rebate, kickback, incentive and etc. that is unseen by/to the public. > Why is it assumed that the dealer will somehow give you this inside > information out of the goodness of his heart? Because of the rebates, kickbacks and etc. stated ealier. It is still not his "true" cost. If it were, he wouldn't be in business. > Steve, who believes the best way to buy a MH is to pay cash and put the > interest money to work. I agree that Interest is wasted money. For some, they can deduct the interest as a second home. So, it's not a total loss by paying interest, but none the less, a loss. The lending institutions want us to believe that financing is best.....more BS. Paying cash and taking the standard deduction is ALWAYS better. Hank Paying cash and taking > the standard deduction is ALWAYS better. > > Hank No, paying cash, and taking a larger deduction because you use the MH for "justified and proveable" business use is the BEST. Using the purchase during a year when you have substantial capital gains make it almost a wash, and that's even better yet. Steve > Paying cash and taking > > the standard deduction is ALWAYS better. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > Steve I was talking a personal use purchase. You are talking purchasing for a business. Apples and oranges. Hank >> Paying cash and taking >> > the standard deduction is ALWAYS better. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > Hank No, I was talking of ways to own an RV and have it cost less. No matter what the use. Steve >> It seems 30% off MSRP may or may not be a good deal depending on the >> markup. As with cars, isn't the key is knowing the dealer cost? Only [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Easy. You buy a dealership. I didn't have to buy a dealership to get my last truck at $100 over cost, including manufacturer holdbacks. >Why is it assumed that if you know the dealer cost that you improve your >bargaining position? This is self-explanatory. >Why is it assumed that the dealer will somehow give you the unit at cost? Why do car dealers give sell at cost - because they have stock they cannot sell any other way. >Why is it assumed that the dealer will somehow give you this inside >information out of the goodness of his heart? He won't, but he'll do it if competition forces him to. >>> It seems 30% off MSRP may or may not be a good deal depending on the >>> markup. As with cars, isn't the key is knowing the dealer cost? Only [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > He won't, but he'll do it if competition forces him to. You, sir, are a salesman's dream. COME ON DOWN. WE'RE PRACTICALLY GIVING THEM AWAY, AND WE ARE MAKING HARDLY ANY MONEY! Add up all the property, payroll, insurance, overhead, advertising, and then rethink your statements above. And if you can find out where the dealership's owner lives, drive by and have a look. That is, if they will let you past the security gate. Steve >I didn't have to buy a dealership to get my last truck at $100 over >cost, including manufacturer holdbacks. Of course you did. You just forgot to mention that cost included, contribution to overhead, sales commission and a nice profit for the owners of the business. $100 over cost means nothing until you know all of the costs that are included. THERE AIN'T NO FREE LUNCH. Phil >>I didn't have to buy a dealership to get my last truck at $100 over >>cost, including manufacturer holdbacks. They let you in the back office and showed you all THOSE books? Wow, dude. You DO have some influence. Steve >>I didn't have to buy a dealership to get my last truck at $100 over >>cost, including manufacturer holdbacks. [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > >Phil There are websites like edmunds.com that list vehicles including every available option along with the dealer cost and MSRP for each item. The dealer invoice shows the line items for local costs not reflected at edmunds.com, including so-called garbage fees. I took the edmunds.com printout to the dealer who, upon being asked, showed me the invoice of the truck I wanted and even provided to me a copy for the truck I eventually purchased. With vehicles, at least in the Northeast, this is common practice in many areas. I made him an offer which subtracted the factory holdback (2%) and garbage fees but included regional advertising + $100.00. The dealer accepted. What did he make? He unloaded a leftover truck from his lot on which he was paying hefty finance charges (it was early December), he made room for the new models which were beginning to stack up, and he added to his sales numbers for the year - something very important to small dealers who wish to stay in business. I am of the opinion that knowledge is power, and while knowing dealer costs for something certainly may not help you negotiate a lower price, it also certainly cannot hurt you either. Regards... > >>I didn't have to buy a dealership to get my last truck at $100 over > >>cost, including manufacturer holdbacks. [quoted text clipped - 34 lines] > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups > ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =--- You know the business well! Lou >"SteveB" <deserttraveler@cox.net> wrote: >Steve, who believes the best way to buy a MH is to pay cash and put the >interest money to work. We financed our last two rigs because we were able to get 5% financing. If my (tax-deferred) investments aren't doing better the 5%, I will be sorely disappointed. (We don't have enough deductions to itemize.) In our case, paying cash wouldn't make sense anyway. We are in the unenviable position of paying ordinary income tax plus a 10% penalty on almost every cent we spend, since it comes from early withdrawals from IRAs. Withdrawing the price of a new RV would result in one hellacious tax bill. I guess we could have continued working for another five years and avoided the early withdrawal penalties. <g> Not likely!  SignatureDD not that it is any of my business but you might be able to avoid the 10% tax by following the regs on how to annuitize IRA withdrawls before 59 1/2. >In our case, paying cash wouldn't make sense anyway. We are in the >unenviable position of paying ordinary income tax plus a 10% penalty on >almost every cent we spend, since it comes from early withdrawals from >IRAs. > not that it is any of my business but you might be able to avoid the > 10% tax by following the regs on how to annuitize IRA withdrawls before > 59 1/2. The IRS allows penalty free early withdrawals from an IRA if it's in "Substantially Equal Periodic Payments" or SEPP. This is outlined in IRS rule 72(t). This wouldn't avoid the ordinary income tax but would eliminate the 10% penalty. There are numerous sites explaining the rule. Here's a start: http://www.401krolloveradvisors.com/distributions2.html http://www.72t.net/ >>In our case, paying cash wouldn't make sense anyway. We are in the >>unenviable position of paying ordinary income tax plus a 10% penalty on >>almost every cent we spend, since it comes from early withdrawals from >>IRAs. >"mstick@gmail.com" <mstick@gmail.com> wrote: >>In our case, paying cash wouldn't make sense anyway. We are in the >>unenviable position of paying ordinary income tax plus a 10% penalty on >>almost every cent we spend, since it comes from early withdrawals from >>IRAs. >not that it is any of my business but you might be able to avoid the >10% tax by following the regs on how to annuitize IRA withdrawls before >59 1/2. Thanks for the suggestion. We researched that with a CPA before we retired, but about two weeks before we put the plan into place, the IRS changed the rules about the interest rates that one could use as a basis for substantially equal periodic payments. The new rules would have restricted our withdrawals to an unacceptably low amount. It made more sense to pay the 10% penalty for the 4-5 years that we would be making early withdrawals. SignatureDD I see where ninebal310@aol.com contributed: > Some friends of mine are looking to buy an RV. They are looking at a >new Class A made by Monaco. They have no trade-in, and are arranging >their own financing. Why buy new? If they have no trade in it suggests no prior experience, in which case buying new is a mistake, IMO. I have a friend who is trying to find a buyer for his deceased father's 38' Monaco Diplomat - last I knew he was asking only $75k and would consider lower offers. If your friends have a genuine interest, have them write me at will@epix.net and I'll put them in touch. Will Sill The Curmudgeon of Sill Hill >ninebal310@aol.com wrote: > Some friends of mine are looking to buy an RV. They are looking at a >new Class A made by Monaco. They have no trade-in, and are arranging [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > >Hank <~~~thinks the new "employee discount" program is BS. We have purchased two Monaco Class A motor homes. We paid 75% of MSRP on one and 74% on the other. Those were essentially the prices the dealer offered us. I have never seen any evidence of seasonal variations in pricing, but you can get the best deals by buying a new rig left over from the previous model year. 30% off MSRP has certainly be doable on those rigs in the past. FWIW, Monaco is currently restructuring its franchise arrangements with its dealers. One consequence of the new arrangements is rumored to be a smaller discount from the manufacturer to the dealer, which would imply a smaller discount off MSRP available to the buyer. SignatureDD How about 93,000.00 off 247,000.00 MSRP? |
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