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Car Forum / Driving, Maintenance, Tuning / RVs / July 2007Copper tubing for propane in new RV's (pros and cons ??)
Ive noticed that some 2008 Class C's are coming with copper tubing for Propane instead of steel lines. Do u feel this is a good idea ? Thanks. > Ive noticed that some 2008 Class C's are coming with copper tubing for > Propane instead of steel lines. Do u feel this is a good idea ? > Thanks. I've never seen anything but copper on every one of my trailers. Steel is too rigid and would crack when flexed in my opinion. Homes, BBQ's etc. almost always use copper as well. > > Ive noticed that some 2008 Class C's are coming with copper tubing for > > Propane instead of steel lines. Do u feel this is a good idea ? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > is too rigid and would crack when flexed in my opinion. Homes, BBQ's > etc. almost always use copper as well. It depends on the code in your state. California requires steel for most industrial applications including homes and BBQs > It depends on the code in your state. California requires steel for > most industrial applications including homes and BBQs Hmm...Haven't seen that myself in California. Always copper. Stop by a BBQ store such as BBQ's Galore or BBQ Hut that are found all over California. They're all plumbed with copper because of its flexibility. Stores such as Home Depot or Lowes sell propane plumbing kits and most include copper coil tubing. Wouldn't it be difficult to plumb with steel? With Copper you can run a single continuous length making only small bends. With steel you'd have to use multiple straight lengths with fittings to make the required turns. The more fittings, the more places to leak, especially when flexed. I'll have to ask a plumber I know that works with this stuff and see what his comments are. > > It depends on the code in your state. California requires steel for > > most industrial applications including homes and BBQs [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > I'll have to ask a plumber I know that works with this stuff and see > what his comments are. Check your own gas lines in your house. If its post 1992, it's not copper. Don't get it confused with the water lines. The BBQs I'm refering to are the natural (not propane tank) outdoor kitchens - there are no building codes for portables. js > Check your own gas lines in your house. If its post 1992, it's not > copper. Don't get it confused with the water lines. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > js Copper can Not be used for natural gas. I do agree that copper is more flexible and is widely used for applications where propane is involved. As far as I'm aware natural gas react with copper and is not a wise choice. My pup, a Rockwood Premier, has all copper tubing.  SignatureAll the Best Dale Miller Tennessee ASP since February 2005 stpatrick2spam@twlakes.net stpatrick3spam@twlakes.net stpatrick3spam@gmail.com (cut the spam to reply) VOTE TO REBUILD! www.twintowersalliance.com ---- > Copper can Not be used for natural gas. > I do agree that copper is more flexible and is widely used for > applications where propane is involved. > As far as I'm aware natural gas react with copper and is not a wise choice. > My pup, a Rockwood Premier, has all copper tubing. That could be. I was referring to propane. I had 2 natural gas fireplaces in my old house, both installed & INSPECTED with copper lines. YMMV!! >miles <nope@nopers.com> wrote: >> Ive noticed that some 2008 Class C's are coming with copper tubing for >> Propane instead of steel lines. Do u feel this is a good idea ? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >is too rigid and would crack when flexed in my opinion. Homes, BBQ's >etc. almost always use copper as well. In our Bulgemobile, it is mostly iron pipe, with flexible hose in the first few feet from the tank to the pipe and again in the galley slideout. I haven't seen any copper line. SignatureDD >> miles <nope@nopers.com> wrote: > [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > first few feet from the tank to the pipe and again in the galley > slideout. I haven't seen any copper line. Strange, My trailer has flex lines (corded rubber?) from the tanks to the regulator, same type flex line, except larger, from there to the iron pipe running down the center of the belly pan, and then 3/8 copper tubing running off iron tees to the stove, frig, furnace & water heater. I have changed out the rubber flex lines because the originals got brittle. It's been working fine for 22 years???? Now the house with natural gas. The iron pipe comes to the center of the basement where all the appliances that use gas are located within 4 feet of where the iron ends. 1 of the feeds is copper pipe to the water heater. It was copper when I moved in 40 years ago. The heater has been changed out 3 times, the 2nd time by the gas company and the third time by an installer ceterfied by the gas company. That copper pipe is still there. Another is an auxiliary vented gas heater that is used when we have a power failure. It is piped in with want appears to be a flex copper tubing. The central heating and air conditioning has a flex connection that is nickel or stainless looking. It sounds like, according to you guys, that I'm in danger of both my trailer and house blowing up from a gas leak!! Tom J Tom J wrote......It sounds like, according to you guys, that I'm in danger of both my trailer and house blowing up from a gas leak!! About the only problem with copper is that it's soft and doesn't stand up to misuse as well as steel. SignatureJerryD(upstateNY) > About the only problem with copper is that it's soft and doesn't stand up to > misuse as well as steel. But copper doesn't rust; steel does. Just look at what happens to brake lines on older cars. The black pipe is fine but the smaller lines can rust and leak. SignatureJim Jim wrote: But copper doesn't rust; steel does. Just look at what happens to brake lines on older cars. The black pipe is fine but the smaller lines can rust and leak. Copper brake lines have been illegal for as long as I can remember so someone thinks they aren't suitable. I would assume stones, etc bouncing up off the road would put holes in the copper. SignatureJerryD(upstateNY) > Jim wrote: But copper doesn't rust; steel does. Just look at what happens > to brake lines on older cars. The black pipe is fine but the smaller lines [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > I would assume stones, etc bouncing up off the road would put holes in the > copper. Yup .. maybe the same people that believe that cell phones start fires at gas stations. I have had 3 cars blow steel brake lines and made more lines than you can count. It is hard to flare the ends properly. That might be what caused the law... or maybe not .. but this is about using copper for gas lines... been done for years... SignatureJim >Copper brake lines have been illegal for as long as I can remember so >someone thinks they aren't suitable. >I would assume stones, etc bouncing up off the road would put holes in the >copper. No-o-o-o! You don't use copper for brake lines, because brake lines must withstand PSI in the hundreds, whereas a propane line only has to withstand a half lb. PSI. Copper is never used on the high pressure side of the regulator. It's not as if a low pressure copper propane is ever going to rupture from internal pressure! > You don't use copper for brake lines, because brake lines must > withstand PSI in the hundreds A few 100 PSI isn't much and doesn't take very thick tubing to handle. Copper is never used on the high pressure > side of the regulator. It's not as if a low pressure copper propane is > ever going to rupture from internal pressure! Copper is used on the high pressure side of propane tanks (before the regulator) all the time. It's just not common on RVs. SignatureAll the Best Dale Miller Tennessee ASP since February 2005 stpatrick2spam@twlakes.net stpatrick3spam@twlakes.net stpatrick3spam@gmail.com (cut the spam to reply) VOTE TO REBUILD! www.twintowersalliance.com ---- On Jul 5, 10:41?am, stan.bi...@hotmail.com wrote: > You don't use copper for brake lines, because brake lines must > withstand PSI in the hundreds, whereas a propane line only has to > withstand a half lb. PSI. Copper is never used on the high pressure > side of the regulator. It's not as if a low pressure copper propane is > ever going to rupture from internal pressure! Copper can withstand very high pressures. Where I used to work, we would fill smaller O2 bottles from much larger bottles. Copper lines were what was used to get from the large bottle to the smaller bottles (before braided lines evolved). The bottles were filled to over 2200 psi. The larger bottles had approx. 4500 psi. We would have to bend the copper lines a small amount each time so that the fittings would line up. We did this for 20+ years without incident or repair. I would assume that copper brake lines would allow for a little more expansion (when under pressure and heat) which would cause the brakes to be spongy. As always, I could be wrong. Hank <~~~ hopes to put the brakes on this thread > About the only problem with copper is that it's soft and doesn't stand up to > misuse as well as steel. Being soft and flexible is a plus, not a minus. It can take a lot of abuse and not split open as easy as steel. Bend copper and it bends. Bend steel and it breaks. Copper wont corrode (rust) like steel will. miles wrote: Being soft and flexible is a plus, not a minus. It can take a lot of abuse and not split open as easy as steel. Bend copper and it bends. Bend steel and it breaks. Copper wont corrode (rust) like steel will. Our government disagrees. SignatureJerryD(upstateNY) > miles wrote: Being soft and flexible is a plus, not a minus. It can take a > lot of abuse and not split open as easy as steel. Bend copper and it bends. > Bend steel and it breaks. Copper wont corrode (rust) like steel will. > Our government disagrees. No they don't. I was replying to the thread topic, propane. Not Brake lines. >> About the only problem with copper is that it's soft and doesn't stand up >> to misuse as well as steel. > > Being soft and flexible is a plus, not a minus. It can take a lot of > abuse and not split open as easy as steel. Bend copper and it bends. Bend > steel and it breaks. Copper wont corrode (rust) like steel will. Copper may not 'corrode', but it develops small holes that get larger. May be an acidic reaction. I am not exactly sure what causes it. A couple of years back we replaced the copper line from our well to the house after holes appeared the second time. Nice little round holes, some the size of a BB. It took 20+ years for the holes to develop. Ron > Copper may not 'corrode', but it develops small holes that get larger. May > be an acidic reaction. I am not exactly sure what causes it. A couple of > years back we replaced the copper line from our well to the house after > holes appeared the second time. Nice little round holes, some the size of a > BB. It took 20+ years for the holes to develop. Steel will develop lots of holes much quicker! >> Copper may not 'corrode', but it develops small holes that get larger. >> May be an acidic reaction. I am not exactly sure what causes it. A [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Steel will develop lots of holes much quicker! I don't doubt that at all, my point was that copper deteriorates also. Ron >> About the only problem with copper is that it's soft and doesn't stand up to >> misuse as well as steel. > >Being soft and flexible is a plus, not a minus. It can take a lot of >abuse and not split open as easy as steel. Bend copper and it bends. >Bend steel and it breaks. Copper wont corrode (rust) like steel will. But copper "work hardens". Every time it gets bent it get harder at that point. TRy it. Jon Signature==================================================== Jon Griffin Yuma,AZ Olds, AB http://www.om-im.org ==================================================== > In our Bulgemobile, it is mostly iron pipe, with flexible hose in the > first few feet from the tank to the pipe and again in the galley > slideout. I haven't seen any copper line. I used to see iron pipe years ago. Now all I see is copper tubing and reinforced rubber hose. >miles <nope@nopers.com> wrote: >> In our Bulgemobile, it is mostly iron pipe, with flexible hose in the >> first few feet from the tank to the pipe and again in the galley >> slideout. I haven't seen any copper line. > >I used to see iron pipe years ago. Now all I see is copper tubing and >reinforced rubber hose. We have owned two deisel pushers, a 2003 model and a 2004 model, with iron pipe for propane. SignatureDD > Ive noticed that some 2008 Class C's are coming with copper tubing for > Propane instead of steel lines. Do u feel this is a good idea ? > Thanks. No matter the material, Copper or Steel it doesn't matter. Propane is just too dangerous. RVs are blowing up all the time because of propane. Start using safe, clean electricity instead. Harry Harris. SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com I see where "Harry Harris" <harris@thehilltopcafe.notagoodaddy> contributed: >No matter the material, Copper or Steel it doesn't matter. Propane is >just too dangerous. RVs are blowing up all the time because of propane. >Start using safe, clean electricity instead. I tried the usual 10-day plonk on this moron, thinking he would surely go away by now. Sadly, he is as persistent as Shad and just as clueless. PLONK Will "If you think health care is expensive now, wait until you see what it costs when it's free." P.J. O'Rourke > No matter the material, Copper or Steel it doesn't matter. Propane is > just too dangerous. RVs are blowing up all the time because of propane. > Start using safe, clean electricity instead. And how do you do that when no electricity is available? >> No matter the material, Copper or Steel it doesn't matter. Propane is >> just too dangerous. RVs are blowing up all the time because of propane. >> Start using safe, clean electricity instead. > > And how do you do that when no electricity is available? You blow the trailer up using the gasoline for the generator. "Harry Harris" <harris@thehilltopcafe.notagoodaddy> wrote ... > No matter the material, Copper or Steel it doesn't matter. Propane is > just too dangerous. RVs are blowing up all the time because of > propane. > Start using safe, clean electricity instead. And how do you do that when no electricity is available? You have a generator, don't you? A gasoline generator is much safer than propane. Propane is there and can leak 24/7 while the generator can only potentially start a fire when it's running and you're there when it's running to put the fire out if one does start. But, a propane tank can cause an explosion 24/7 even while you're sleeping or when you're out of the RV. Not much fun to return to your campsite and find a smoldering pile of rubble and bits and pieces of your erstwhile RV covering the neighboring campsites. Harry Harris SignaturePosted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com >And how do you do that when no electricity is available? > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >Harry Harris You insist on this reiterating totally stupid comment. Would you PLEASE provide ONE documented instance of this menace? End of discussion. Back under your rock, troll! More crap. Have you flogged your POS RV to some poor sod who you can rip off yet Dimwit? I notice you're even spamming JLA Forums with it. Nobody wants to buy a rusty heap full of stains with a reputation for light relief and gay liasons at car rallies. >Ive noticed that some 2008 Class C's are coming with copper tubing for >Propane instead of steel lines. Do u feel this is a good idea ? >Thanks. > > The standard for non motorized RVs is, iron pipe in all places practical and primarily from the tank to the component where copper in short lengths connect to the appliance, ie. water heater, furnace, stove and refrigerator. In most units iron pipe runs all the way from the regulator area and between both tanks. Tanks have flex high pressure hoses as well as from regulator to pipe, including the iron pipe running between tanks. SignatureBILL P. Just Me & DOG -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
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