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Car Forum / Saab Cars / June 2004Anyone seen brother Grunff lately?
Salutations: Hey - where's Grunff? Amid the recent spate of blue and 'safest car' thread I thought I'd simply missed his posts in the spaminator - but actually - no posts for a while. There are SU carbs and automatic transmissions going wanting! Rum SU carb membrane talk.. uummmmm.. membrane! .. :) .. -- J Dexter - webmaster - http://www.dexterdyne.org/ all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads no news no phone in - RealAudio 8+ Required - all the Time Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day The Razorbacks - Can't Keep my Baby in Shoes http://www.dexterdyne.org/888/195.RAM > Salutations: > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > There are SU carbs and automatic transmissions going wanting! Hi Dex. I've been around, and have answered the odd post, but have been away from my desk a lot lately (lots of on-site stuff). Must try harder!  SignatureGrunff Salutations: >> Salutations: >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Hi Dex. I've been around, and have answered the odd post, but have been > away from my desk a lot lately (lots of on-site stuff). Must try harder! Hey brother Grunff. I hadn't checked in for a while myself and was worried something was afoot. Cheers - hope the summer doesn't turn out to be too busy. SignatureJ Dexter - webmaster - http://www.dexterdyne.org/ all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads no news no phone in - RealAudio 8+ Required - all the Time Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day Joe Cocker - Feeling Alright http://www.dexterdyne.org/888/055.RAM > Hey brother Grunff. I hadn't checked in for a while myself and was > worried something was afoot. Cheers - hope the summer doesn't turn out > to be too busy. Too late - we're booked up until Oct. No holiday for me! SignatureGrunff >Too late - we're booked up until Oct. No holiday for me! Your wife is going to be really mad, unforgiving, and make your life an absolute hell if she doesn't get a vacation. Oh, wait... that would be my wife. Sorry. > Your wife is going to be really mad, unforgiving, and make your life > an absolute hell if she doesn't get a vacation. Oh, wait... that would > be my wife. Sorry. Hehe...you don't know half of it. We work together (same company), so she's in exactly the same boat! SignatureGrunff >Hehe...you don't know half of it. We work together (same company), so >she's in exactly the same boat! More power to you, Brother. My wife and I couldn't work together if the world was coming to an end. Come to think of it, we couldn't even stay married. Guess I shouldn't be giving advice :-) > >Hehe...you don't know half of it. We work together (same company), so > >she's in exactly the same boat! > > More power to you, Brother. How many siblings do you have? >> More power to you, Brother. > >How many siblings do you have? Ah... I view all of us "Saabers" here as Brethren of the Temple of Saab. Likewise all men are Brothers in the attempt to have a (any) relationship with a woman. So, Grunff is my Brother through two relations :-) >> Hey brother Grunff. I hadn't checked in for a while myself and was >> worried something was afoot. Cheers - hope the summer doesn't turn out >> to be too busy. > > Too late - we're booked up until Oct. No holiday for me! Great! :) Nah, really, you should take a break! Got a comment about my damn window? Where's the earth point "between the handbrake and the ignition"? Apart from the obvious - is that the right place? How's best to get at it? Can I ground the relay more effectively? What is the air speed velocity of a sparrow? Paul 1989 900 Turbo S http://saab.go.dyndns.org/ > Great! :) Nah, really, you should take a break! I'd really, really like to... > Got a comment about my damn window? Where's the earth point "between the > handbrake and the ignition"? Apart from the obvious - is that the right > place? How's best to get at it? Can I ground the relay more effectively? Just read the thread. Hmmm. So you're saying that you've put an ohmeter between the motor terminal (the one that isn't +ve) and the chassis, but you get significant resistance with the switch on? What's the resistance? Is there a good ground at the switch connector on the incoming line (basically the wire that connects the switch to ground permanently)? What about on the outgoing line (the wire from the switch to the motor terminal)? I wouldn't remove the centre console just yet (but that's not ahuge job anyway) - it could be the switch or the switch connector. > What is the air speed velocity of a sparrow? ? Can I have some of what you're having? SignatureGrunff >> Got a comment about my damn window? Where's the earth point "between the >> handbrake and the ignition"? Apart from the obvious - is that the right [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > between the motor terminal (the one that isn't +ve) and the chassis, but > you get significant resistance with the switch on? What's the resistance? What I found was that the two wires switch polarity depending upon the direction of the switch near the handbrake. That would appear to be a relay that does that. Going back to basics, if I spike the other wire and connect that to ground I can get the window to move in one direction. That would suggest a bad ground - either at the relay or the switch itself. The relay is a little too complicated to my simple understanding ... And I went through a few fuses testing some theories about the ground at that point. ... > Is there a good ground at the switch connector on the incoming line > (basically the wire that connects the switch to ground permanently)? > What about on the outgoing line (the wire from the switch to the motor > terminal)? According to the wiring diagram, there are three grounds. One must be permanent and the other two depending on the polarity, presumably. So, it must be the switch that is switching polarity, rather than the relay. I must say, since I've got the window up I've not looked at it again. I'll do some tests on the switch - I had hoped it was an easy "oh yeah, just re-do the ground here" kind of thing ... Grrr! As you say, I'm not keen to start pulling the car apart without asking a few people first :) > I wouldn't remove the centre console just yet (but that's not ahuge job > anyway) - it could be the switch or the switch connector. >> What is the air speed velocity of a sparrow? > ? Can I have some of what you're having? It's called Akvavit :) Sweden drew tonight with Denmark, so I celebrated with both nations' national drink :) This one is Danish, but I'm about to hit the Swedish variety in a minute ... Mmm! Roll on 1AM so I can watch the game! Thanks for your reply - much appreciated (as always). Paul > What I found was that the two wires switch polarity depending upon the > direction of the switch near the handbrake. That would appear to be a relay > that does that. Why a relay? I've yet to see a 900 which uses relays. The later ones which have 'one touch' down have a relay built into the switch pack. But no separate relays. > Going back to basics, if I spike the other wire and connect > that to ground I can get the window to move in one direction. That would > suggest a bad ground - either at the relay or the switch itself. The relay > is a little too complicated to my simple understanding ... And I went > through a few fuses testing some theories about the ground at that point. Ok, so far so good, you diagnosis is spot on. > According to the wiring diagram, there are three grounds. One must be > permanent and the other two depending on the polarity, presumably. So, it [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > ground here" kind of thing ... Grrr! As you say, I'm not keen to start > pulling the car apart without asking a few people first :) I reckon the incoming ground on the switch is bad. Have you tries swapping the switches? > It's called Akvavit :) Sweden drew tonight with Denmark, so I celebrated > with both nations' national drink :) This one is Danish, but I'm about to > hit the Swedish variety in a minute ... Mmm! Roll on 1AM so I can watch the > game! lol > Thanks for your reply - much appreciated (as always). Anytime Paul. SignatureGrunff >> What I found was that the two wires switch polarity depending upon the >> direction of the switch near the handbrake. That would appear to be a relay [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > which have 'one touch' down have a relay built into the switch pack. But > no separate relays. Okay. I do have the one touch down on the driver's side and when that function engages, I hear a click under the rear seat. Upon investigation, there are two relays there. In the Haynes wiring diagram, under "later 900 models", I can find the relay but the diagrams do not show the operation of the switch itself. One of the relays under the rear seat is the same layout and would appear to pertain to this function. >> Going back to basics, if I spike the other wire and connect >> that to ground I can get the window to move in one direction. That would [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Ok, so far so good, you diagnosis is spot on. Having established that the motor is functional, next step is to find the ground and trace from there. First to the switch and the from the switch to the motor, whichever route that takes. I'll pop the switch out tonight and have another go with the multimeter. >> According to the wiring diagram, there are three grounds. One must be >> permanent and the other two depending on the polarity, presumably. So, it [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I reckon the incoming ground on the switch is bad. Have you tries > swapping the switches? The switches would appear to push into the connectors only one way - I'll certainly have a go though. If that's the case, where is the ground point? I've pulled the switch panel out and removed the rear ashtray, but the looms seem to run off somewhere that I can't immediately see. Hmm. More investigations ... Thanks pal. Paul > Okay. I do have the one touch down on the driver's side and when that > function engages, I hear a click under the rear seat. Ah, that's interesting. I think you may have a relay under the back seat :-) > Upon investigation, > there are two relays there. In the Haynes wiring diagram, under "later 900 > models", I can find the relay but the diagrams do not show the operation of > the switch itself. One of the relays under the rear seat is the same layout > and would appear to pertain to this function. > Having established that the motor is functional, next step is to find the > ground and trace from there. First to the switch and the from the switch to > the motor I don't think the latter (switch to motor) is the problem. The two wires going to the motor reverse polarity depending on whether you're going up or down. If one was damaged, you'd only see a missing ground at the motor when the switch is one way, not the other. > The switches would appear to push into the connectors only one way - I'll > certainly have a go though. If that's the case, where is the ground point? > I've pulled the switch panel out and removed the rear ashtray, but the looms > seem to run off somewhere that I can't immediately see. Not sure where it is on your car - I've never had a 900 with a window relay under the back seat. On my later 900s, there is a ground point under the carpet between the seats. You get to it by first removing the centre console. > Hmm. More investigations ... Thanks pal. Good luck. SignatureGrunff [...] > It's called Akvavit :) Sweden drew tonight with Denmark, so I celebrated > with both nations' national drink :) This one is Danish, but I'm about to > hit the Swedish variety in a minute ... Mmm! Roll on 1AM so I can watch the > game! Oh memories. Downing Akvavit is usually followerd by an ahhhhhhhhhhhhh and the an bruuurrrurbrurbrrrrr. Then keep your breath away from naked flames for a while. > [...] >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > the an bruuurrrurbrurbrrrrr. Then keep your breath away from naked flames > for a while. I had a sore head this morning ... Not to mention when I stretched, my muscles kind of shuddered! I think I poisoned myself on that evil Scandinavian stuff :) It really was a stunning game (Sweden vs Denmark) - very passionate and some excellent football. I'm talking about the Euro 2004 tournament, in case our non-European friends are thinking "WTF?". http://www.euro2004.com/ Good luck to all remaining nations. Paul |
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