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Car Forum / Saab Cars / January 2005Traction control
In my 1992 9000 2,3l 16V Turbo the red traction control lamp was always on. I was quite happy about this, since the TCS is a pain and there is no way to switch it off in this model. A few days ago the engine suddenly lost performance and I had to jump hard on the acellerator to keep the engine running. This was very unlikely, since this model has got a drive by wire system which normaly doesn offer to much back force. For the next few days I took my other car and left the Saab untouched. Yesterday I started the engine again and it was perfectely ideling. It easely went up with the revs when touching the accellerator which now felt quite normal again. After 3 minutes of idling without moving the car the old troubles came back and the pedal was very hard going again. The engin was very reluctant in taking on speed. When the troubles started I noticed a white flashing TCS light in the odometer.( I never have seen this before, since the entire TCS was not working). It seems that the TCS detects a wheel spin and tries to reduce the engine power by closing the throttle. The only strange thing is, that at this moment the car was standing in front of my home, without any move!!!! Have you got any idea how to solve my problem. Is the TCS part of the ECU or is it a seperate black box? All I know is that TCS is great when it works, but expensive when it quits. Finding a knowledgable service person even at a dealer is difficult. Peruse these links. KeithG http://www.saabnet.com/tsn/bb/9000/search.html?query=TCS http://68.155.244.166/engine_folder/tcsserbullindex.htm http://68.155.244.166/electrical_system_folder/electrical_doc_folder.htm > In my 1992 9000 2,3l 16V Turbo the red traction control lamp was always on. > I was quite happy about this, since the TCS is a pain and there is no way to [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > Have you got any idea how to solve my problem. Is the TCS part of the ECU or > is it a seperate black box? Hi Keith Thanks a lot for the most interesting links. Its a pity that most of the precedures descibed therein need Saab specific test equippment. If I have a complete fix in a Saab workshop this will recover the entire TCS function and as already mentioned, I was happy to have it permanently switched off. TCS highly interferes with the car handling in fast corners (at least for me). Thus I am left on my own to fix it only to a degree which will restore the previous condition. I will keep the group informed about the outcome. > All I know is that TCS is great when it works, but expensive when it > quits. Finding a knowledgable service person even at a dealer is [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > http://68.155.244.166/engine_folder/tcsserbullindex.htm > http://68.155.244.166/electrical_system_folder/electrical_doc_folder.htm > In my 1992 9000 2,3l 16V Turbo the red traction control lamp was always > on. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > or > is it a seperate black box? What you are describing is called "limp home" mode. The TCS light flashes and the Throttle switches from fly-by-wire to a mechanical connection that no longer idles well. UNfortunately, I have seen this all too often on bith my '92 and '93 9000. The ECU will go into this mode (limp home) with any type of serious fault. The last time I had it, the cause turned out to be a bad spark plug. The mis-firing was detected. I've also seen it caused by a vacuum hose that got blown off and a bad MAP sensor. It is not at all likely that the ECU is the problem, but something else. Now comes the fun part. You can try to get the codes from your car's ECU. http://www.troublecodes.net/Saab/ This may be helpful. If not, you will probably have to bring it to a SAAB dealer for code retrieval as the tech2 scan tool is very expensive and is not likely to be found anywhere but the stealership. Even our local SAAB indy specialists don't have the ones for these cars. -Fred W > What you are describing is called "limp home" mode. The TCS light flashes > and the Throttle switches from fly-by-wire to a mechanical connection that > no longer idles well. UNfortunately, I have seen this all too often on bith > my '92 and '93 9000. Has`nt this car got a separate warning light for a failure in the engine management? Is it unlikely that a faulty throttle motor can cause this sort of troubles? > The ECU will go into this mode (limp home) with any type of serious fault. > The last time I had it, the cause turned out to be a bad spark plug. The [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > http://www.troublecodes.net/Saab/ THX , sounds rather complex. I guess I will rather connect a storage scope to the lamp instead of counting the beeps and their patterns. > This may be helpful. If not, you will probably have to bring it to a SAAB > dealer for code retrieval as the tech2 scan tool is very expensive and is > not likely to be found anywhere but the stealership. Even our local SAAB > indy specialists don't have the ones for these cars. Our RAC equivalent should have a general test tool that fits most of the actual cars. How ever my 92 Saab may be to old to meet this standard protocol. > Our RAC equivalent should have a general test tool that fits most of the > actual cars. How ever my 92 Saab may be to old to meet this standard > protocol. Yes, OBD2 cars can be read by more generic tools here too (US). The '92's are not OBD2. They are some proprietary SAAB protocol. -Fred W |
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