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Car Forum / Saab Cars / February 2005Advice Request!
Hi all - great forum, makes very interesting reading. I'm currently the owner of a 52 plate Vectra turbo-diesel.....sorry, sending myself to sleep just typing that. It's perfectly competent, economical, goes well, in fact it ticks most of the boxes. However, it bores the hell out of me! I *love* the look of the Saabs, it reeks of individuality, and avoids the git-factor of the BMW brigade. I'm in a bit of a quandry however, as in order to switch to Saab, I'll lose sheds of cash and obviously I'm buying high. I'm looking at a 900 (9-3's are too expensive) 2.0 S cabriolet (mid life crisis?), 1996 on a 'P' plate. It's done 54,000 miles. It's an auto box - good or bad? Please, all - am I mad? Is my decision rational, logical, sensible? This car will essentially be the main family car, so reliability is an important factor.... The thought of moving from the balance of a 3 year manufacturer warranty to zilch leaves me in a bit of trepidation. Are my fears grounded, or am I panicking over nothing? Are Saab's as robust as I hear? are they expensive to maintain? And finally, (sorry for the barrage of questions) is it due a horrific service ~ 60k miles? Many thanks in advance, Chris > I'm currently the owner of a 52 plate Vectra turbo-diesel.....sorry, sending > myself to sleep just typing that. It's perfectly competent, economical, goes [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > life crisis?), 1996 on a 'P' plate. It's done 54,000 miles. It's an auto > box - good or bad? The irony is that the 1996 900 you're thinking of buying shares quite a lot with your current Vectra - same GM platform. I won't say too much about my feelings regarding NG900s (said it too many times), but I think most long time Saabers would tell you that as a car, it's probably the least representative of the Saab breed ever made.  SignatureGrunff >> I'm currently the owner of a 52 plate Vectra turbo-diesel.....sorry, >> sending myself to sleep just typing that. It's perfectly competent, [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > times), but I think most long time Saabers would tell you that as a car, > it's probably the least representative of the Saab breed ever made. Cheers but for the price (?5-7k) what would you recommend? Thanks Chris > but for the price (£5-7k) what would you recommend? I'm the last person you want to answer that question, believe me ;-) SignatureGrunff >> but for the price (?5-7k) what would you recommend? > > I'm the last person you want to answer that question, believe me ;-) As long as it aint a Vectra, please, help me out! > As long as it aint a Vectra, please, help me out! Ok, I'll tell you what I think - but first some background, to put things into context (you're new here, right?) I *love* Saabs. I've been a Saab nut since I drove my very first C900 (that's an old shape 900) in 1992. Back then I was a poor student, and needed a cheap, reliable but fun car. The 900 was perfect for this. Then I bought another 900, and another, and a 99, then a few more 900s, then a couple of 9000s. I drove them, I worked on them, I loved them all. I still kick myself for selling the 99. My current lineup of Saabs is made up of two 16vT 900s (a 1987 and a 1990), and a 16v NA (naturally aspirated) 16v 900 (1990). I'm very fond of them all. I've driven NG900s (that's the new shape; the one you're thinking of buying), 9^3s (its replacement) and 9^5s. NG900s I don't like at all. To me (I can't stress that enough - this is MY personal opinion), there is very little pleasure in the drive, and very little Saab in the car as a whole. 9^3s are a little better, but really not that good. 9^5s I like a lot more - good feel, and nice drive. A few weeks ago, I was in the market for a car, same kind of price range you're looking at. I looked at 9^3s, and I looked at 9^5s. Then I thought I's have a look at BMW 5 series for the same money. After looking at a number of cars of each type, it was pretty clear to me that the BMW is the better car, in terms of build quality, performance and value. I've ended up with a 1997 528i, which is a dream to drive. Before any stones come hurtling towards me - I still love my 3 C900s. So, vox, the best advice I can give you is to drive a whole range of cars (putting aside any brand prejudice you may have), then decide. SignatureGrunff >> As long as it aint a Vectra, please, help me out! > [quoted text clipped - 33 lines] > So, vox, the best advice I can give you is to drive a whole range of > cars (putting aside any brand prejudice you may have), then decide. Just one question for Grunff - how do you convince the spouse you "need" 3 C900s and a BMW? I can't convince mine I need another Saab because she says my 2 Saabs and a Volvo 245 turbo are enough. > Just one question for Grunff - how do you convince the spouse you "need" > 3 C900s and a BMW? I can't convince mine I need another Saab because she > says my 2 Saabs and a Volvo 245 turbo are enough. It's not so much skill in convincing, but having a spouse that appreciates Saabs and Volvos (or whatever floats your boat) as more than just tools to get from point A to point B. > Just one question for Grunff - how do you convince the spouse you "need" > 3 C900s and a BMW? I can't convince mine I need another Saab because she > says my 2 Saabs and a Volvo 245 turbo are enough. <ahem> And a 1987 BMW 325i. The thing is, she has horses. Horses are the most useless, costly waste of space ever invented. Damn good bargaining tool. SignatureGrunff > Just one question for Grunff - how do you convince the spouse you > "need" 3 C900s and a BMW? I can't convince mine I need another Saab > because she says my 2 Saabs and a Volvo 245 turbo are enough. Just 3 SAABs and one BMW? Hell, for me it would mean getting rid of a few vehicles... ;-) 98 Jeep Wrangler Sport 97 SAAB 900seT 97 Ford Exploder XLT 5.0 97 BMW Z3 2.8 95 BMW 325i 94 BMW 540i 93 SAAB 9000cseT -Fred W It's a good thing car insurance is relatively cheap here... Salutations: >>> I'm currently the owner of a 52 plate Vectra turbo-diesel.....sorry, >>> sending myself to sleep just typing that. It's perfectly competent, [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > > Chris Hey brother Grunff - I followed that BMW thread of yours with some concern, but have to agree with your call in the end at the price. 5 series BMW are not 9000's - but they are not 9000's - and a very solid ride for the conditions and climate you are in. Interested in your long term experiences with it if you have a mind to pass them along as they happen. Chris - if you are looking for a 'statement' ride in a SAAB - you would be better at that cash to find a C900 Turbo that someone has tricked out a bit as it will be a lot more fun and generally more 'cool' than a NG900. However I must say, that despite the fact I've gone back to a '93 9000 Aero I have always coveted, my '94 900 NG900 NA is and has been a really reliable and fun ride. I tweeked up the suspension and clutch and turned the toe out a bit and it runs like it's on rails in pretty much all weather conditions. I would warn you strongly against an automatic in any Saab short of a 9^5 - and even then, you don't really get the smile factor out of any SAAB unless it's a 5 speed. They *luv* a little stick work and will reward your into 4000rpm+ with a kick in the backside that has to be experienced to be believed from a 2.3 liter NA or Turbo engine. If you google up "dexterdyne buying a used saab" - you will find my standing posted advice on buying used SAAB's and it stands for all models short of the 9^3 - which in honest truth really isn't serviceable outside the dealer chain just yet. I happen to be selling off my 94 NG900 for $4700 - that's like 2,300 quid these days? I don't know what they get over there - but that's about all I can hope for here even with a complete service round and mild performance uprate at a reputable local shop. Cheers and good hunting. -- Radio Free Dexterdyne Top Tune o'be-do-da-day Louis Prima - Angelina Zooma Zooma Zooma Live http://www.dexterdyne.org/888/159.RAM all tunes - no cookies no subscription no weather no ads no news no phone in - RealAudio 8+ Required - all the Time Dexter J's fab SAAB 900 for sale: http://www.dexterdyne.org/310.HTM > Salutations: Hi Dex, > Hey brother Grunff - I followed that BMW thread of yours with some > concern, but have to agree with your call in the end at the price. 5 > series BMW are not 9000's - but they are not 9000's - and a very solid > ride for the conditions and climate you are in. Interested in your long > term experiences with it if you have a mind to pass them along as they > happen. I ain't going anywhere, and am always happy to share experiences, good and bad. SignatureGrunff >> I'm currently the owner of a 52 plate Vectra turbo-diesel.....sorry, >> sending myself to sleep just typing that. It's perfectly competent, [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > many times), but I think most long time Saabers would tell you that as a > car, it's probably the least representative of the Saab breed ever made. At least it has the igntion key between the seats! As I have heard it this was a very late design change of the car ordered by top management when the car was almost to be put in production as it was one of _the_ key characteristics of a Saab (poor 9000 that doesn't have this feature). Signatureth Oh Geez, I'm not feeling over-confident here Any defenders of the 900 convertible here, or are they that bad? >>> I'm currently the owner of a 52 plate Vectra turbo-diesel.....sorry, >>> sending myself to sleep just typing that. It's perfectly competent, [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > the car was almost to be put in production as it was one of _the_ key > characteristics of a Saab (poor 9000 that doesn't have this feature). > Oh Geez, I'm not feeling over-confident here > > Any defenders of the 900 convertible here, or are they that bad? They are not that bad, just as Grunff wrote earlier, a classic 900 is a true Saab, everything that has appeared afterwards can be discussed. I now more and more regret changing my old C900 for a 9-5, although the latter is much more comfortable it is much less Saab, less reliable and doesn't differ that much from a Volvo, an Audi or any other car in that price/size range. I have been driving Saabs since late 70'ies and my father since the 50'ies but I'm no longer feeling any unique feature of Saab as more and more manufacturers have FWD cars with good winter driving properties. Signatureth > > Oh Geez, I'm not feeling over-confident here > > [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > Saab as more and more manufacturers have FWD cars with good winter > driving properties. The thing is, it's not so much a matter of whether the newer Saabs are good cars or not, but the fact is the very unique design, most noteably under the hood as well as the interior, the feel, the overall driving experience of Saab was defined with the 99 and the classic 900 that followed. They're unique cars in so many ways, mostly ways that everything that came later lacked. The Saab signature key between the seats does not make it a true Saab any more than the badge on the hood, they're just the corporate branding so treasured by the marketing folks at GM. If the NG900's, the 9000's, the 93's and 95's have what you're looking for in a car, I won't recommend against them, but if you want a Saab for the reasons people rave about, all the fine points that made the brand famous as a quirky and wonderfully unique car then a classic is the only way to go. > I won't say too much about my feelings regarding NG900s (said it too > many times), but I think most long time Saabers would tell you that as a > car, it's probably the least representative of the Saab breed ever made. The NG900s may not be "true" Saabs, but I love my 1997 900SE. Wonderful car. Love driving it. For the price they sell for, it's a steal. Hello vox and Laura, I'm sorry but I believe that Saabs fetch much more in the Europe than in the US. In the US they come really cheap. I came in the US 5 years ago. I believe the Saabs in the US are the right choice. But I break everytime in tears when I see Alfa Romeos. They left the US in 1995. Alfas are pretty good cars. You can probably get some for a good price. 147 might be a good pick for you. The problem is that there is no big difference in the price of used 147 and 156. I believe 147 is more popular as a hatch. I would recommend late 156, MY2000 and up with Twin Spark or JTD petrol. Just make sure that it was properly maintained and does not have Selespeed or early JTS engine. Quick look at autotrader.co.uk around Bristol: http://atsearch.autotrader.co.uk/www/cars_search.asp?page=4&modelexact=1&lid=sea rch_used_cars_full&make=ALFA+ROMEO&model=156&variant=&keywords=&min_pr=75&max_pr =7000&mileage=&agerange=&postcode=BS32+4NF&miles=40&max_records=50&source=0&sort =3&ukcarsearch_full=SEARCH Oh, I wish I would be in your situation. :-) Just my 2 cents. Radek -- Walnut Creek, CA, USA '99 SAAB 9-5 Wagon 2.3 lpt > The NG900s may not be "true" Saabs, but I love my 1997 900SE. Wonderful car. > Love driving it. For the price they sell for, it's a steal. >>I won't say too much about my feelings regarding NG900s (said it too >>many times), but I think most long time Saabers would tell you that as a >>car, it's probably the least representative of the Saab breed ever made. > > The NG900s may not be "true" Saabs, but I love my 1997 900SE. Wonderful car. > Love driving it. For the price they sell for, it's a steal. I own both an NG and a Classic 900. I can tell you there is a world of difference between the Classic and the NG. Most of the differences are functional, like visibility, cargo capacity etc. The body shape of the Classic is unique and I can easily find my Classic in a parking lot. The NG900 looks like so many other cars I put bumper stickers on it to make it easier to locate. The reason I bought a NG900 - my daughter is going to be driving soon. No way is she going to learn in a Classic and bang up the body and transmission. A Classic 900 in good condition is getting harder to find these days. There are many NG900s on the market for little money. They are reasonably good cars for the price. > Hi all - great forum, makes very interesting reading. > [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Chris My opinion (seems to be shared by many others) is that manual gearbox is the *only* way to go with a Saab. My own recommendation would be a late 80's-'93 Saab 900 S or Turbo, fantastic cars, loads of fun. > Please, all - am I mad? Is my decision rational, logical, sensible? This > car will essentially be the main family car, so reliability is an [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > hear? are they expensive to maintain? And finally, (sorry for the barrage > of questions) is it due a horrific service ~ 60k miles? Well, I bought a 2001 9*3 HOT convertible about six months ago...and I love driving it. It's an Auto (who needs a bloody manual in city traffic?) and, after changing form a 4WD (Isuzu Trooper) the fun factor is most definitely there for me ;-) Whenever the sun comes out (not as often as I would like..bloody Melbourne weather) the top comes down, and it never fails to get admiring glances from drivers of any other car (except maybe the sneers of Boxster owners). Go for it...you only live once! If you get fed up after a year...who cares...at least you will have owned a bloody nice convertible once in your life! |
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