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Car Forum / Saab Cars / June 2006

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'85 900 CV/axle replacement

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Dave Hinz - 02 Jun 2006 15:09 GMT
I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
that.  Any surprises in this process?  Seems like it'd be pretty
straightforward; pull the bottom ball joint, remove the castle nut &
caliper - pretty much all right there, or am  I missing something?

Dave Hinz
pidgeonpost - 02 Jun 2006 16:55 GMT
> I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
> only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Dave Hinz

Dave...I did one on my '83 900 some years ago. No real surprises, but I
remember having to wedge the wishbone in the compressed position, and
the hardwood wedges I used were not really hard enough!
Also have a look here....

http://www.thesaabsite.com/900old/C900driveshafts.htm

Be aware that when you whack the old joint off the drive shaft it may
fall on your tootsies. It is heavy.
Dave Hinz - 02 Jun 2006 17:31 GMT
>> Any surprises in this process?  Seems like it'd be pretty
>> straightforward; pull the bottom ball joint, remove the castle nut &
>> caliper - pretty much all right there, or am  I missing something?

> Dave...I did one on my '83 900 some years ago. No real surprises, but I
> remember having to wedge the wishbone in the compressed position, and
> the hardwood wedges I used were not really hard enough!

Ah, so the range of motion doesn't go past where I can re-attach it.
Got it.

> Also have a look here....
> http://www.thesaabsite.com/900old/C900driveshafts.htm

Thanks, that's well done by whoever did it.

> Be aware that when you whack the old joint off the drive shaft it may
> fall on your tootsies. It is heavy.

I always wear steel toed boots when working on heavy things, but thanks
for the reminder.  Been an EMT for a long time, seen lots of fun trauma
on folks who didn't use safety equipment.  (ask me about the guy with
the screwdriver through and through his hand...)
Fred W - 02 Jun 2006 23:17 GMT
>>>Any surprises in this process?  Seems like it'd be pretty
>>>straightforward; pull the bottom ball joint, remove the castle nut &
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> on folks who didn't use safety equipment.  (ask me about the guy with
> the screwdriver through and through his hand...)

Was it like this guy?

http://www.wimp.com/screwdriver/

Signature

-Fred W

Dave Hinz - 03 Jun 2006 16:53 GMT
>> I always wear steel toed boots when working on heavy things, but thanks
>> for the reminder.  Been an EMT for a long time, seen lots of fun trauma
>> on folks who didn't use safety equipment.  (ask me about the guy with
>> the screwdriver through and through his hand...)

> Was it like this guy?
> http://www.wimp.com/screwdriver/

Can't tell from here, not coming up for whatever reason.  The call in
quesiton, the guy was holding something in his hand, working hard on it
with a small straight-slot screwdriver.  Slipped out of the screw, and,
well, he was pushing pretty hard, y'see.  He did not enjoy the situation
and expressed to me that he would not suggest trying it to anyone else.
Well, not in so many words but the meaning was pretty clear.
Charles C. - 02 Jun 2006 22:39 GMT
> I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
> only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>
> Dave Hinz

You assume the CV joint is gone I take it.  Because all you need is a
boot if the rest is OK.

(Good Lord I could do a SAAB boot your vintage with my eyes closed)

Will the axle include the bearing (triangular gizzmo) at the gear box end?

Remember to loosen the big nut before you ramp up the car and before you
take the brake off.  It is torqued to 240ish feet/pounds pounds/feet (?)

:-D
Charles

PS.  If you decide to remove top and/or bottom ball joints ... remove
them from the wishbones, a lot easier and less destructive than trying
to remove them from the hub.

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Dave Hinz - 02 Jun 2006 23:05 GMT
>> I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
>> only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> (Good Lord I could do a SAAB boot your vintage with my eyes closed)

Well, let's talk about that.  Is that just lower ball joint, inner U
joint, get greasy as hell, and be done?  Or how do I get the driveshaft
out of that CV?

> Will the axle include the bearing (triangular gizzmo) at the gear box end?

Don't know yet.

> Remember to loosen the big nut before you ramp up the car and before you
> take the brake off.  It is torqued to 240ish feet/pounds pounds/feet (?)

Yes, I've made that particular mistake before.  More than once, in fact.  

> PS.  If you decide to remove top and/or bottom ball joints ... remove
> them from the wishbones, a lot easier and less destructive than trying
> to remove them from the hub.

Absolutely, those 2 bolts are the only way to do it.

Thanks
Dave
Charles C. - 03 Jun 2006 00:24 GMT
>>> I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
>>> only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>>
>> (Good Lord I could do a SAAB boot your vintage with my eyes closed)

Hi,

I did not mean to sound I am cleverer than you.  It just brings back
memories ... :-)

> Well, let's talk about that.  Is that just lower ball joint, inner U
> joint, get greasy as hell, and be done?  Or how do I get the driveshaft
> out of that CV?

I assume you only need to change the boot.  In the following procedure
you remove the complete drive shaft and hub assembly.

Disclaimer ... don't drop the car on yourself, it hurts.

Jam up the upper wishbone using SAAB clever part or piece of wood or ...
as long as you don't collapse the inner wing.  I always used a piece of
wood *and* a pair of spring compressors (so the pressure on the inner
wing was not at the full strength of the spring) whilst I had two spare
spring compressors in case things went wrong.

Remove brake caliper etc and suspend from spring above etc.

Remove the two bolts from upper and lower ball joint to wishbone
connections.  Note that in both a 1979 and a 1983 cars I had the bolts
had a fine thread which after that many years has probably gone south.
I got replacement bolts for my 1983 car (a few years ago mind you) which
had the same oversize shoulder but a normal metric thread.  Also note
that the heads of the bolts (i.e. the stronger part of the bolt, go in a
particular direction ... uhmmm I have to think about this .. they have
to counteract the rotational direction ... uhmm maybe).

Separate steering knuckle ball joint (is it called track rod end ?).

Undo circlip of inner cv joint boot where it connects to the transmission.

Unless I am forgetting something important (?) you should be able to
pull out of the car the complete drive shaft + CV joint + hub.

To separate drive shaft (half axle another name) from CV joint there is
a circlip.  The circlip is like a capital "O" with a bit missing (may
not be called a circlip).  If you wipe the grease off the top of the CV
joint you will see it.  The idea is ... you need a pair of circlip
pliers (when you compress the handles the points open ...) try to open
the circlip when you manage it ... tap the cv joint away from the shaft
using a soft hammer.  Half a dozen attempts (you will only get one hit
at a time as the pliers will move off the circlip) and you will move the
CV a bit away ... the rest is straight forward.

The only catch with refitting always was trying to align the holes of
the ball joints with those of the wishbones to put the bolts through.  I
remember me using a jack to push the hub assembly up against the car to
give me room or similar improvisations.

If all you need is a boot it is probably less work to do what I am
suggesting than replace the shaft/CV joint.

If you choose to remove the CV joint from the hub you will need a torque
wrench capable of more than 200 ft/lb to refit, and technically a new
nut as you have to hammer a notch on it against the protruding drive
shaft.  To remove you may need to compress the CV joint off the inner
bits of the wheel bearing to remove it ... hammering is not advised as
you may end up needing a new bearing.

If in doubt as to what you may need ... take big nut off first and
remove drive shaft + cv joint.  You can separate them as above.  You can
wash the cv joint to remove all its dirt (sand usually that got in
because of the split boot).  If it has not run for long with a split
boot ... you will probably be ok if you repack it with grease (is it
molybdenum something or other ... black stuff).

Having done many boots ... eventually I came to the conclusion (when I
got a new (it was only 10-12 yo at the time) 900, it had SAAB boots.
The after market replacements I fitted did not last the 6 or so years I
had the car.

Go on replace just the boot.  Once you done it a few times it is easy.

:-)
Charles

PS.  Now you probably knew all this and I fell for a wind up :-D

>> Will the axle include the bearing (triangular gizzmo) at the gear box end?
>
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
> Thanks
> Dave

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Dave Hinz - 03 Jun 2006 13:41 GMT
>>> (Good Lord I could do a SAAB boot your vintage with my eyes closed)
> I did not mean to sound I am cleverer than you.  It just brings back
> memories ... :-)

It wasn't read that way, no worries at all!

>> Well, let's talk about that.  Is that just lower ball joint, inner U
>> joint, get greasy as hell, and be done?  Or how do I get the driveshaft
>> out of that CV?
>
> I assume you only need to change the boot.  In the following procedure
> you remove the complete drive shaft and hub assembly.

> Disclaimer ... don't drop the car on yourself, it hurts.

Noted.

> Remove the two bolts from upper and lower ball joint to wishbone
> connections.  Note that in both a 1979 and a 1983 cars I had the bolts
> had a fine thread which after that many years has probably gone south.
> I got replacement bolts for my 1983 car (a few years ago mind you) which
> had the same oversize shoulder but a normal metric thread.  

I've got this cool machine in the basement that can put whatever thread
I want on pieces of metal, so no worries there.

> Also note
> that the heads of the bolts (i.e. the stronger part of the bolt, go in a
> particular direction ... uhmmm I have to think about this .. they have
> to counteract the rotational direction ... uhmm maybe).

Hm, never noticed that, but I do put those back in the way I found 'em.
Check.

> To separate drive shaft (half axle another name) from CV joint there is
> a circlip.  

Ah, so it's not like the 95/96/97 with the groove in the shaft and the
snapring.  I'm glad we had this little talk or that could have been a
bad confusion to have.

> Half a dozen attempts (you will only get one hit
> at a time as the pliers will move off the circlip) and you will move the
> CV a bit away ... the rest is straight forward.

> If you choose to remove the CV joint from the hub you will need a torque
> wrench capable of more than 200 ft/lb to refit, and technically a new
> nut as you have to hammer a notch on it against the protruding drive
> shaft.  

Well, I'm also OK with 200 pounds of me, at a foot from the nut on the
wrench acting as a torque wrench.  But pretty sure I've got one that
goes that high.  I also have a calibrated kid who would be just right on
the end of a 3' pipe.

> Having done many boots ... eventually I came to the conclusion (when I
> got a new (it was only 10-12 yo at the time) 900, it had SAAB boots.
> The after market replacements I fitted did not last the 6 or so years I
> had the car.
>
> Go on replace just the boot.  Once you done it a few times it is easy.

Great, thanks for your time!

Dave
Charles C. - 03 Jun 2006 15:03 GMT
>> Remove the two bolts from upper and lower ball joint to wishbone
>> connections.  Note that in both a 1979 and a 1983 cars I had the bolts
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
> snapring.  I'm glad we had this little talk or that could have been a
> bad confusion to have.

Maybe that is what I mean ... a groove in the shaft and a ring that goes
round it.  But I used circlip pliers to open the ring and then get one
tap on the cv joint.  Doable ... I always managed to separate them with
no other person helping.

>> Half a dozen attempts (you will only get one hit
>> at a time as the pliers will move off the circlip) and you will move the
>> CV a bit away ... the rest is straight forward.

Enjoy.

Charles
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Richard Sutherland-Smith - 03 Jun 2006 21:32 GMT
>>> To separate drive shaft (half axle another name) from CV joint there is
>>> a circlip.
>>
>> Ah, so it's not like the 95/96/97 with the groove in the shaft and the
>> snapring.  I'm glad we had this little talk or that could have been a
>> bad confusion to have.
No not like the 96. There is a circlip in the CV joint which is
captive in the joint, ie once you open it, it stays in the joint.

Signature

Richard & Mary Sutherland-Smith
 19 Webb Road, Wanganui 5001, NZ

Craig's Saab C900 Site - 03 Jun 2006 21:56 GMT
>>>> I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
>>>> only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>>>
>>> (Good Lord I could do a SAAB boot your vintage with my eyes closed)

>Hi,

>I did not mean to sound I am cleverer than you.  It just brings back
>memories ... :-)

>> Well, let's talk about that.  Is that just lower ball joint, inner U
>> joint, get greasy as hell, and be done?  Or how do I get the driveshaft
>> out of that CV?

>I assume you only need to change the boot.  In the following procedure
>you remove the complete drive shaft and hub assembly.

>Disclaimer ... don't drop the car on yourself, it hurts.

I had the back right side of my white 900S fall off a jack once. When I was
'green' and had not figured out when the front 'lip' of the jack point was
for I just lifted with the car in a very slight slope to do something at the
back. Oh well just as well I'd not taken the wheel off yet.. Car slid down
on the pad of the back because I hadn't engaged the lip first. Oops. Did a
little bit of damage to the join between some body sections but I learnt a
lesson from that. 8-)

Craig.
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Craig's Saab C900 Page at      | Craig's Classic Saab Workshop - Sydney .au
http://lios.apana.org.au/~c900 | http://www.classicsaab.net and other URL's
Email: c900@lios.apana.org.au  | For Saab 99/C900/9000 Enthusiasts World-Wide!
Alternate: saabonaut@gmail.com | Web-forums, galleries, library, links, etc.

Craig's Saab C900 Site - 03 Jun 2006 21:51 GMT
>I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
>only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
>that.  Any surprises in this process?  Seems like it'd be pretty
>straightforward; pull the bottom ball joint, remove the castle nut &
>caliper - pretty much all right there, or am  I missing something?

Very first thing is to loosen the big 32 mm nut securing the outer CV to the
steering member. That has to be done with the car on the ground before the
wheel nuts are undone. I use half of the handle off my trolley jack on the
end of my 1/2" socket extension bar, and when I put my whole body weight on
it, perhaps with a bit of bouncing up and down, it'll overcome the very high
torque to loosen the nut. Sometimes it's not that hard but my white 900S had
me springing up and down quite a bit before all that reverse torque got the
front CV nuts to loosen!

You might need to undo the lower shock mounting but generally that should
only be needed if you're going to fully remove the steering member.

If you don't want to do that, what you suggested will work but make sure
that before you take any of the suspension parts off you put spacers under
the lower control arm to relieve the coil spring tension off the control
arm. And remember to undo the big nut before lifting the car off the ground.
8-)

If you want to go 'whole hog' you can actually take the brake caliper off
the steering member, undo the steering tie-rod (good time to replace them
too if they have broken boots and the grease is oozing out), undo the top
ball joint as well as as the bottom one, then remove the entire steering
member off the CV and that way you can look at the back of the main bearing
to check it's condition and see if the big circlip is still good. In fact
any time you do that sort of work, replacing other parts that need it can
save you in the future. Tie-rod ends and ball joints are simple jobs - make
sure you don't re-use self-locking nuts unless as a last resort you can't
get replacements.

The bottom balljoint main nut can be a pig to undo because there is not much
clearance between it and the bottom of the bearing housing of the steering
member. You'll need an open-ended spanner, or a very shallow ring-spanner,
and probably some WD-40/RP-7 type fluid and possibly a hammer to 'enhance'
the spanner's mechanical advantage if the nut it very unwilling to release.

When you replace the steering member onto the splined shaft of the CV, put
some engine oil on the CV's shaft and that'll make it easier to slide it
into the bearing as it's a snug fit.

The Bentley manual is very good at covering all this. I've done CV
replacement, etc. and there are a couple of sections on my ~c900 site which
cover CV, etc. work but they're not really complete. More works in progress
with bits of coverage of the processes not added in yet. I need to do
driveshaft swaps on my 1983 turbo c900 because it's got inner CV boots
broken. With all the work required to get the inner driver accessible,
pulling out the whole shaft and replacing with a good one saves time. I've
got two good shafts on my donor car still. 8-)

Regards,

Craig.
Signature

Craig's Saab C900 Page at      | Craig's Classic Saab Workshop - Sydney .au
http://lios.apana.org.au/~c900 | http://www.classicsaab.net and other URL's
Email: c900@lios.apana.org.au  | For Saab 99/C900/9000 Enthusiasts World-Wide!
Alternate: saabonaut@gmail.com | Web-forums, galleries, library, links, etc.

Dave Hinz - 04 Jun 2006 17:09 GMT
>>I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
>>only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
>>that.  Any surprises in this process?  

> Very first thing is to loosen the big 32 mm nut securing the outer CV to the
> steering member. That has to be done with the car on the ground before the
> wheel nuts are undone. I use half of the handle off my trolley jack on the
> end of my 1/2" socket extension bar, and when I put my whole body weight on
> it, perhaps with a bit of bouncing up and down, it'll overcome the very high
> torque to loosen the nut.

I assume swearing will be needed?  I'm not going to get to it this
weekend, was out of town for a wedding.  The CV isn't making noise, so
I'm probably fine for now, but I know once the boot splits it's just a
matter of time.  A boot is 20 bucks, the whole axle with a new CV and
new boot is 66, and is only slightly more work from the looks of it, so
there ya go.

> Sometimes it's not that hard but my white 900S had
> me springing up and down quite a bit before all that reverse torque got the
> front CV nuts to loosen!

Well I have an impact wrench but I don't think I want to do that with it
coupled to the differential.

> If you don't want to do that, what you suggested will work but make sure
> that before you take any of the suspension parts off you put spacers under
> the lower control arm to relieve the coil spring tension off the control
> arm. And remember to undo the big nut before lifting the car off the ground.
> 8-)

I keep hearing a recurring theme here in the advice.  I made that
particular mistake years and years ago with my Sonett and understand the
purpose intimately now ;)  probably the same reason others know it...

(snip remainder of good advice)

Thanks for the time & info, Craig.

Dave
Charles - 08 Jun 2006 03:50 GMT
> >>I've got a split CV boot on the left side, on my '85 900.  A new axle is
> >>only 66 bucks, cheaper than just the CV, so I'll probably be going with
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> > it, perhaps with a bit of bouncing up and down, it'll overcome the very high
> > torque to loosen the nut.

Dave,

Just loosen the nut while the car is on the ground and the wheel is
still on. Trust me.

Charles
 
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