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Car Forum / Antique and Collectibles / Studebaker / December 2005

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Serial Number Stamping

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Michael - Roseland FL - 07 Dec 2005 17:33 GMT
When I purchased my 1958 Golden Hawk the correct serial plate was
missing.  Someone had put a body number tag on the door post with the
serial number engraved on it.  I was concerned about this but I did
find the serial number stamped on the rear cross memeber and it does
match the title so know the car is right for the title.

I purchased a repro serial plate on EBAY and tried to punch the 3/8th
tall numbers myself.  This did not turn out good at all.  It is a lot
harder than you would think.  Then I contacted a company that
specializes in serial number tax resoration etc and they said they can
not help me.

I wish I knew where the stamping numbers went that Studebaker used.
Surely someone out there must have them.
N8N - 07 Dec 2005 17:42 GMT
> When I purchased my 1958 Golden Hawk the correct serial plate was
> missing.  Someone had put a body number tag on the door post with the
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> I wish I knew where the stamping numbers went that Studebaker used.
> Surely someone out there must have them.

I would think that one of the more graphically inclined people on this
newsgroup (Bondo?  Rick?) might have the font for the numbers, then you
could just print them out appropriately scaled, take the serial tag to
your local mall (yuck) and have your friendly engraved kitsch kiosk
associate engrave the numbers, tracing the letters with his
pantograph...

just a thought

nate
Michael - Roseland FL - 07 Dec 2005 18:26 GMT
I was wondering if an engraver could get the look of a stamped number
right.  This is who I tried that could not help me:

http://www.datatags.com/

He was very prompt and pleasant though.
Rick Courtier - 07 Dec 2005 19:03 GMT
Either Bondo or I can help you with the water decal and if the serial number
looks the same as the 56 Hawk then I can take a picture of mine for you
reference to take aorund to tool & dye people or an engraver. Do this first
since this is the hardest part. Then after you put the stainless steel piece
on the car the water decal can go on. . . then just mask off around the
plate and spray with a clear Krylon to protect the water decal and the
plate.

Rick

>I was wondering if an engraver could get the look of a stamped number
> right.  This is who I tried that could not help me:
>
> http://www.datatags.com/
>
> He was very prompt and pleasant though.
bill@bondobilly.com - 08 Dec 2005 14:20 GMT
>Either Bondo or I can help you with the water decal and if the serial number
>looks the same as the 56 Hawk then I can take a picture of mine for you
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>plate and spray with a clear Krylon to protect the water decal and the
>plate.

I still have some water slide decals left. Iff the number is still on
the tag, addimg the decal makes it look real. Without the decal or
printing, it is still a valid ID plate
Gary Ash - 08 Dec 2005 19:45 GMT
It's tough to stamp the numbers by hand and get them to look right.  Of
course, Studebaker and everyone else used a press-type machine to do this.
To get the numbers aligned and perpendicular to the tag surface, you may
need a holder for the multiple number markers.  The problem with this is
that the force required to get an indentation goes up as the number of stamp
dies increases.

Check this site for Columbia Marking Tools:
http://www.columbiamt.com/default.htm
They have number stamps and holders.  Look at the page on Marking 101.  It
has a table that shows how much force is required for various number sizes.
As their data is only for numbers up to 1/4 inch, I did a few calculations
to see what it takes for 3/8 numbers in soft brass, probably close to an
aluminum plate.  The 1/4" numbers take 3150 lbs, but a 3/8" number may need
5700 pounds and a 1/2" number about 8700 pounds.  [approximate equation is
FORCE(pounds) = 23807 x (height^1.456) ]  The force goes up faster than just
the character height because each character also gets wider and the stroke
width is wider.    It will also depend on the style of type that is used.

The Columbia chart shows that an average machinist with a 1-1/2 lb hammer
can strike with about 3 tons force.  However, in order to transfer the force
from the hammer to the stamp to the plate, the plate has to be backed up
with a strong, heavy steel block.  Laying the plate on a 2x4 or a workbench
top won't do it - too much bounce and give.  A brass hammer helps.  If you
try to do 6-8 digits at once, you had better have a very big hammer and
really heavy block!  If you are stamping the numbers into mild steel, you'll
need twice as much force.  If you hit it too hard, the number die will just
cut all the way through.

I started looking at this when I was going to make a new body serial number
plate for the firewall of my M5 and for the chassis numbers.  The numbers on
the body tag are tall, fat, and indented in reverse from the back side of
the plate.  I gave it up!

Somebody out there must have some old machines that can do the body tags.
It's more likely that you can find some company to re-do the serial numbers
stamped from the front side.

Signature

Gary Ash
Dartmouth MA
'48 M5
'63 Wagonaire
'65 Wagonaire
www.studegarage.com

midlant@earthlink.net - 09 Dec 2005 00:40 GMT
Each number punch would have to be the same length to impress them as a
set, too.
That might be even more of a problem.

The force needed on individual characters also depends on the contact
area of each character ("8" needing nearly twice the force of a "3")

Karl

> It's tough to stamp the numbers by hand and get them to look right.  Of
> course, Studebaker and everyone else used a press-type machine to do this.
[quoted text clipped - 41 lines]
> '65 Wagonaire
> www.studegarage.com
 
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