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Car Forum / Toyota / Camry / March 2007Six speed transmission revisited
Have been in the buying mode for about a year, but was put off by the new 6 speed transmission dissatisfaction. Just called Yokem Toyota to see what they had to say about the current status of the situation and the story is as follows...They had a couple of early Camrys, and one recently, which gave problems. Apparently, they brought them in, and had them repaired and back out in a couple of days. Apparently all the trannies do not have problems ...Just some. AND some or all have an unsatisfying upshift which, I guess, is just part of the design. Nothing to be done about it. The Avalon has a 5 speed tranny and none of these problems apply. Concensus, please. Is this the way it is, or is this the way the salesman wants it to be? I don't think all 6 speeds A/T have issues. The 07 Camry had flawless reviews from a third party. There have been so many unhappy customer reviews though. Its funny none of these shown up on the auto reviews. They released the 07 sometime April of 06 and may have already around 100,000 out there. I think that the common A/T transmission in the "old days" are 4 speeds. You would feel that they shift differently from a 6 speed. Engineers designed the close gear ratios such that the engine speed is constant and the result is the shifting is more than the usual 4 speeds. A small change in speed will have a resulting gear shift. This close gear ratio will also affect optimum MPG, power, torque. Owners may find driving it odd but actually its the new technology. You have more gears equals more down shifts As for the 5 speed A/T, I have it on my 4cyl 07. I'm not sure if the Avalon and 4cyl Camry (or the highlander, Rav4) use exactly the same tranny. But I asked Toyota to upgrade my Engine Control Module just this month. On Jan 24, 2:07 pm, <H...@nospam.nix> wrote: > Have been in the buying mode for about a year, but was put off by the new 6 > speed [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Concensus, please. Is this the way it is, or is this the way the salesman > wants it to be? > I don't think all 6 speeds A/T have issues. The 07 Camry had flawless > reviews from a third party. There have been so many unhappy customer [quoted text clipped - 39 lines] > > Concensus, please. Is this the way it is, or is this the way the salesman > > wants it to be? I've had a 08/06 produced 2007 Camry SE V6 6 speed since mid October 2006. It definitely does have a problem, that's not just my not being used to a 6 speed. It started at about 1200 miles on the car. My car when cold, the transaxle will slip and rev up several hundred RPM the first time it shifts from 3rd to 4th gear. After that first 3rd to 4th shift, the transaxle works normally. The common denominator seems to be that one shift. Also, if I have to pull out into traffic, make a right turn, and accelerate before it's done it's first 3rd to 4th shift, the transmission will feel like it's in Neutral, and rev up several hundred RPM while sitting there barely moving. I was almost rear ended in early January when this happened. A new TSB (TC007-02) was issued on 1/19/2007 describing this problem. My car's VIN # falls within the range of Camrys this applies to, but I've held off having it done because reports from people having it done on 2007 Camry V6 and Lexus ES350 (which have the same drivetrain) report the vast majority of the time, that the problem isn't fixed. Since a transaxle replacement is a very major disassembly and reassembly of the car, I don't want to go through that until I'm sure it has a good chance of fixing the problem. I tell everybody who asks about my new Camry V6 SE, that I love the car, but hold off on considering buying one until Toyota has a reliable long term fix for this problem. Which by the followup reports I'm reading, hasn't happened yet. I do have faith they'll figure it out eventually. > I tell everybody who asks about my new Camry V6 SE, that I love the > car, but hold off on considering buying one until Toyota has a > reliable long term fix for this problem. Which by the followup > reports I'm reading, hasn't happened yet. > I do have faith they'll figure it out eventually. Probably they will eventually get it straight. We just dropped plans to buy a Camry for this exact reason. We have ordered an Avalon instead, which still comes with the older 5 speed tranny. With the potential of a transmission going into neutral when you need to car to move is dangerous. Just how are you going to know which trannys will go bad? Toyota certainly doesn't, otherwise they would have pulled them off the market. Some owners have reported that problems got worse after repairs. Some owners got new transmissions after repeated failed repairs. And Toyota shipped those swapped out transmissions back to Japan for analysis. This tells me they haven't got a grip on the problem yet. So I think you are getting the run around from the sales department. I say show me proven reliability first and none of those "give us ~$20K and you won't have problems type of crap). The older Aisin transmissions (A-series vs the current lowest bidder U-series), while dirty and like to plug up boost valves and strainers, were more reliable. On Jan 24, 2:07 pm, <H...@nospam.nix> wrote: > Have been in the buying mode for about a year, but was put off by the new 6 > speed [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > Concensus, please. Is this the way it is, or is this the way the salesman > wants it to be? > Some owners have reported that problems got worse after repairs. Some > owners got new transmissions after repeated failed repairs. And Toyota > shipped those swapped out transmissions back to Japan for analysis. > This tells me they haven't got a grip on the problem yet. ============= It appears, however, that some (all?) of those replacement transmissions work just fine. And replaced with the same kind of transmission with no other change except the date code of the transmission.(?) > johngd...@hotmail.com wrote: > > Some owners have reported that problems got worse after repairs. Some [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > It appears, however, that some (all?) of those replacement > transmissions work just fine. So it takes a new transmission to solve the problem and not on-vehicle repairs? And you are sure there are no revisions made to the parts of the new trannys, which are in service for a few months at the most (the gear skipping problem was discovered in May 06)? > It appears, however, that some (all?) of those replacement > transmissions work just fine. > Have been in the buying mode for about a year, > but was put off by the new 6 speed > transmission dissatisfaction. Maybe you should check nissan altima or honda accord instead ? > > Have been in the buying mode for about a year, > > but was put off by the new 6 speed > > transmission dissatisfaction. > > Maybe you should check nissan altima or honda accord instead ? I have driven the Honda, and dont like it. The salesman made the mistake of taking us over a route that has some railroad tracks, potholes, etc and the Honda was rough as hell. The impact was excessive when we went over a railway. I dont like mushy rides, but this was too much like a gokart. Nissan doesnt have the reputation for reliability that Toyota has, but is attractive. Maybe I should drive it. Drove the Passat and loved it, but there is also a question of reliability similar to Nissan. (The turbocharged motor is one heck of a horse, but requires premium 'oats') The TSB on my 4cyl 5spd was to upgrade the program on the ECM. It works good. But I do wish to know if this is related to DRIVE BY WIRE (DBW), and have read some grounding wire techniques on the SCION for DBW delay. > The TSB on my 4cyl 5spd was to upgrade the program on the ECM. It > works good. But I do wish to know if this is related to DRIVE BY WIRE > (DBW), and have read some grounding wire techniques on the SCION for > DBW delay. I dont know, honestly. I found out that the specific issue on the six speed that I posted about does not relate to the five speed. For that, you can be grateful. > I have driven the Honda, and dont like it. The salesman made the mistake > of taking us over a route that has some railroad tracks, potholes, etc and > the Honda was rough as hell. The impact was excessive when we went over a > railway. I dont like mushy rides, but this was too much like a gokart. Yeah, the sportier suspension system tend to be firm for most people. But they need to be for stability. But Honda now has the Accord LX with the GM-like MacPherson struts for the GM boat ride, and at a lower price too. The KYB struts (aka Keep Your Bilsteins) used in many Toyotas are harsh as well. They wimp out in clover ramp turns and too much damping sends all the pavement cracks and paint stripes up your spine. KYBs just don't have the multi-stage inertial-sensitive valving system like the Gabriel Ultras. > Nissan doesnt have the reputation for reliability that Toyota has, but is > attractive. Maybe I should drive it. Yeah, I guess not all Japanese cars are reliable. But I heard their 3.5L V6 is great. The Monroe Reflex struts used on previous generation (->2006) Altimas gave a needed improvement to the otherwise unimpressive suspension system . > Drove the Passat and loved it, but there is also a question of reliability > similar to Nissan. (The turbocharged motor is one heck of a horse, but > requires premium 'oats') You think these come with Bilsteins? > > Drove the Passat and loved it, but there is also a question of reliability > > similar to Nissan. (The turbocharged motor is one heck of a horse, but > > requires premium 'oats') > > You think these come with Bilsteins? Gosh, I dont know. I, like you apparently, am a fan of Bilsteins. I have a Dodge custom van which was a wicked bitch to drive when I first got it. A set of Bilsteins and a rear antisway bar tamed this devil impressively. Volkswagen seems to get some negative press about the electrics. This is something that VW could cure overnight if it had management with any cojones. Looked up the Nissan, and they only offer a freaking CVT transmission. Dont know about Nissan, but CVTs are reputed to be more fragile than a shared condom. I am confused and disappointed. > Looked up the Nissan, and they only offer a freaking CVT transmission. > > Dont know about Nissan, but CVTs are reputed to be more fragile than > a shared condom. > > I am confused and disappointed. How long CVTs are on the market ? What cars were featuring such transmissions in the past ? How similar is nissan transmission to other types known ? I wouldn't touch the Nissan's belt drive Xtronic CVT like I wouldn't touch 2007 Camry's new U-series transmission. Jatco, who made their traditional autos, has made some junk transmissions before. The only CVT I would try would be the ones made by ZF Friedrichshafen. On Jan 28, 2:22 pm, <H...@nospam.nix> wrote: > Looked up the Nissan, and they only offer a freaking CVT transmission. > > Dont know about Nissan, but CVTs are reputed to be more fragile than > a shared condom. > > I am confused and disappointed. > I wouldn't touch the Nissan's belt drive Xtronic CVT like I wouldn't > touch 2007 Camry's new U-series transmission. Jatco, who made their > traditional autos, has made some junk transmissions before. > > The only CVT I would try would be the ones made by ZF > Friedrichshafen. I posted the question on the nissan newsgroup, and was surprised to find that mechanics and owners alike rave about the CVT. They claim it to be bulletproof. Is Aisin making the new 6 speed tranny for Toyota, or somebody else? I know ZF Friedrichshafen makes CVTs for Ford and others and ZFs use a steel chains. The Xtronic is said to use a "belt" in web searches. Don't know if it's a "rubber" belt or a "steel" belt. But walk away from a rubber belt CVT purely from the maintenance asepcts not from the CVT technical advantage side over the conventional tranny. Other posts suggest Toyota dumped Aisin for a low cost tranny manufacturer for the 2007 Camry's U-series. But I do not know which company. Aisin's clutch material is soft, wears fast and likes to plug up the strainer, but at least these old A-series don't skip gears (but they whine however). On Feb 1, 8:13 am, <H...@nospam.nix> wrote: > <johngd...@hotmail.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Is Aisin making the new 6 speed tranny for Toyota, or somebody else? > I know ZF Friedrichshafen makes CVTs for Ford and others and ZFs use a > steel chains. The Xtronic is said to use a "belt" in web searches. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > up the strainer, but at least these old A-series don't skip gears (but > they whine however). Apparently the Nissan uses a steel belt system. JATCO Transmission probably have gone steel for the higher torque versions of the CVT. I had read some references to rubber and V-belts. But those were probably low torque versions. Yeah, would be nicer if there are more details on the internals. > Apparently the Nissan uses a steel belt system. |
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