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Car Forum / Toyota / Camry / April 2007

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ECT sensor questions

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mrdarrett@gmail.com - 18 Mar 2007 09:06 GMT
So, following the directions in my Haynes for my '96 Camry, I checked
the resistance and voltage of my ECT temperature sensor (the one just
upstream of the upper radiator hose).  On a warm car, the resistance
was about 100 ohms.  Seemed a bit low.

Voltage was 10 volts.  (Haynes said it should be 5V.)

I looked into this because the car stalled again, one week after
changing the tranny fluid.  (I was pretty sure that it was a stuck
torque converter lock, too...)

So, what do I do now...?  10V seems kind of high, ya?

By the way, the Toyota dealer had no idea what an ECT temperature
sensor was.  Anyone have a part number for this one for my car ('96, 4-
banger)?

Thanks

Michael
jan siepelstad - 18 Mar 2007 12:54 GMT
> So, following the directions in my Haynes for my '96 Camry, I checked
> the resistance and voltage of my ECT temperature sensor (the one just
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Michael

Strange.
According to the maintenance manual I have (a chapter of 72 pages just about
the cooling system). The ECT is a switch, mounted in the bottom of the
radiator and is just switching on and off the cooling fan.

Jan.
mrdarrett@gmail.com - 20 Mar 2007 17:09 GMT
> <mrdarr...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
[quoted text clipped - 29 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

I saw that one (bottom of the radiator) too.  The Toyota dealership
said that's the only ECT they could find  - and it's $110 at the
dealership for that part.

Oh well...

Michael
johngdole@hotmail.com - 23 Mar 2007 00:50 GMT
The ECT you mentioned is a variable resistor, not the ECT switch
(Toyota could better differentiate them like the latter a "fan switch"
everybody else calls.)

The variable resistor (near 0 hot, near infinity when cold). But it's
on the water outlet like you described. It doesn't need voltage to
operate.

100ohms is about the low end of the permitted range at around 210deg.
Why do you think it's low or bad?

rockauto.com has one for as low as $23.99 (verify your application).
The "fan switch" 36549  is about $50.

STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS Part # TX40T {TRU-TECH}
    $23.99    $0.00    $23.99

STANDARD MOTOR PRODUCTS Part # TX40 More Info
    $27.79    $0.00    $27.79

AIRTEX Part # 5S1517 More Info
    $28.79    $0.00    $28.79

BECK/ARNLEY Part # 1580421 More Info
    $31.79    $0.00    $31.79

ACDELCO Part # D583 More Info {#19022018} SENSOR,ENG COOL T/GA
    $37.79    $0.00    $37.79

FOUR SEASONS Part # 36424 More Info For AC
    $54.79    $0.00    $54.79

> So, following the directions in my Haynes for my '96 Camry, I checked
> the resistance and voltage of my ECT temperature sensor (the one just
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
>
> Michael
mrdarrett@gmail.com - 26 Mar 2007 16:46 GMT
On Mar 22, 4:50 pm, johngd...@hotmail.com wrote:
> The ECT you mentioned is a variable resistor, not the ECT switch
> (Toyota could better differentiate them like the latter a "fan switch"
> everybody else calls.)

Yep, I'm playing with the one on the water outlet.  Is its operation
critical?  Does it provide information to the onboard computer, which
controls other stuff?

It sure doesn't help that Toyota calls two different parts ECT.  (This
ECT?  Oh. THAT ECT!)

> The variable resistor (near 0 hot, near infinity when cold). But it's
> on the water outlet like you described. It doesn't need voltage to
> operate.
>
> 100ohms is about the low end of the permitted range at around 210deg.
> Why do you think it's low or bad?

I'm trying to track down my stalling problem on my '96 4-banger
(stalls only when warm, when slowing to a stoplight).  So far tried
cleaning the IAC, changed spark plugs (which were clean, by the way -
no carbon buildup, as I was suspecting), replaced the leaking
distributor O-ring (but the electrical contacts inside the distributor
were squeaky clean), even changing tranny fluid in case of a stuck
torque converter lock.  Still stalling.

Next suspects:  sensors, EGR, possibly onboard computer...?

I don't think it's the coils, since they work just fine on startup,
and on the freeway.  Changed fuel filter ~ 5 years ago.

10V instead of 5V really does seem kind of weird.

Thanks for the prices...

By the way - I changed the single-spark Pt. Bosch plugs my dad put in
the '96 to dual Pt. Bosch plugs.  What a difference in power!  Even
when the car stalled on the usual hill in Vallejo, the engine didn't
quite completely die - just hovered between, oh, 200 and 600 rpm.
Must be the new plugs...?  ;-)

Michael

> rockauto.com has one for as low as $23.99 (verify your application).
> The "fan switch" 36549  is about $50.
[quoted text clipped - 40 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -
mrdarrett@gmail.com - 27 Mar 2007 20:38 GMT
On Mar 22, 4:50 pm, johngd...@hotmail.com wrote:
> The ECT you mentioned is a variable resistor, not the ECT switch
> (Toyota could better differentiate them like the latter a "fan switch"
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> FOUR SEASONS Part # 36424 More Info For AC
>         $54.79  $0.00   $54.79

This is one of those situations where walking into a store is helpful.

With shipping, Part # TX40T costs $30+.  AutoZone had it for $29.

I got the ECT sensor from AutoZone, then it turned out it's the wrong
part.  (It had two prongs for electrical connection.  I need a single
prong.)

I really needed the "ECT Switch" (that's what AutoZone calls it).
$11.99.  Will pick it up today (has to be transferred from another
store).

Michael
videokid400@hotmail.com - 16 Apr 2007 04:09 GMT
On Mar 28, 5:38 am, mrdarr...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Mar 22, 4:50 pm, johngd...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
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>
> - Show quoted text -

HOW is an ECT going to cause a stall when warm?????
Just DOESNOT make sense.
dave
mrdarrett@gmail.com - 16 Apr 2007 18:53 GMT
On Apr 15, 8:09 pm, videokid...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Mar 28, 5:38 am, mrdarr...@gmail.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 53 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

I got the idea from this site, when I was researching my stalling
problem:

http://toyotaownersclub.com/forums/index.php?s=2fc32630ecb777e2fca9117f1047d31c&
showtopic=8158&pid=618097&st=75&#entry618097


First post.

Pasted here, for your convenience:

-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-

Problem found and resolved on my fiancés 92 Camry: coolant temp
sensor.

After exhibiting all the same symptoms as you all, I went down to the
Toyota dealer who misdiagnosed the distributor and igniter as being at
fault. After they charged and arm and a leg, it stalled at the next
stop light on the way home. Furious at Toyota, but tired and wanting
to get home, I waited for the car to cool enough for it to start again
and carefully drove home, doing the gas/brake deely with both feet.

I then took the car to a friend of a friend, a trusted non-Toyota
mechanic that came highly recommended. He had the problem figured out
and solved in 2 days. As I came to pick up the car, he explained to me
what he did and how he figured it out. He had a snap-on computer, just
smaller than the size of a laptop hooked up to several sensors in the
engine compartment; he actually drove the car with wires hanging out
of the hood going through the window to his computer, which acted like
a real-time analyzer and data logger. As soon as the symptom arose, it
was the temperature sensor that caused the fault.

As most of you may know, temperature sensors are just over-sized
thermistors, which are devices that output a change in resistance in
proportion to the heat that is detected. The ECU measures this
resistance to determine the temperature of the engine, and based on
such, gives the appropriate amount of fuel to cylinders to combust.
The problem is that over time (at least so I've been told with Toyota
temp sensors), they can fail after getting to a certain temperature.
They would function cold and as they get hotter and hotter, they short/
open and produce a false reading to the ECU. The ECU then sees this as
a malfunction, and thinking that the motor is cold in an effort to
avoid detonation, dumps WAY more fuel than needed and basically floods
the engine. This is why after the car stalls and you try and start the
car unsuccessfully, you can smell a heavy gas odor in/near the engine
compartment. It's putting too much fuel for the temperature of the
motor/air and stalling the motor. This is also why it stalls only when
coming to a stop: because you don't have your foot on the gas to let
more air in to balance out the extra fuel that is being sent into the
engine.

Apparently, this is something of an issue with Toyota coolant temp
sensors after a long period of time (at least told to me). I'm so
****** off with the Toyota dealer you cannot imagine. They cringe
whenever I go down there because they couldn't fix my problem and
charged me for something that wasn't even causing the issue. As far as
I'm concerned, dealers can only fix problems to which they know the
cause of, and do not know for the life of them how to troubleshoot
issues! For this they can all go ........
videokid400@hotmail.com - 19 Apr 2007 04:24 GMT
On Apr 17, 3:53 am, mrdarr...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 15, 8:09 pm, videokid...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 116 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

mmm ok I spose,cant say ive herd of this as being a common problem in
fact its a new one on me ,ill replicate it and see what results i
get.never stop learning do we?as far as the Ecu reading this as the
sole signal to provide mixture adjustment,........I dont think so it
is in fact a second tear signal according to my wiring diagram and ecu
scematic.possibly was a fault, but im wondering if it was the only
fault.
dave
videokid400@hotmail.com - 21 Apr 2007 13:03 GMT
On Apr 19, 1:24 pm, videokid...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 17, 3:53 am, mrdarr...@gmail.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 129 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

Replicated this fault on the dyno today.In open and closed circuit
conditions and for approx 45 mins .NO WARM STALL.,Slight hc elevation
and increase in nox.
dave
mrdarrett@gmail.com - 23 Apr 2007 21:15 GMT
On Apr 21, 5:03 am, videokid...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 19, 1:24 pm, videokid...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 138 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

How did you run the experiment?  After the car entered closed loop
mode (after running warm for awhile), did you pull off the plug to
simulate a failure?  How about pull off the plug and then short, to
simulate a failure by short?

If only running without the ECT sensor plugged in, from the time it
was cold, the computer might never enter closed loop mode, right?

Inquiring minds want to know

Michael
videokid400@hotmail.com - 23 Apr 2007 23:17 GMT
On Apr 24, 6:15 am, mrdarr...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Apr 21, 5:03 am, videokid...@hotmail.com wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 154 lines]
>
> - Show quoted text -

replicated using scan tool.
dave
 
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