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Car Forum / Toyota / Toyota Cars / November 2005sludge photo site?
I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my avalon (02), and it's crusty black (not gel-like at all). I get the oil changed between 3,000 and 4,000 miles with Durablend (the middle grade) down at the local Valvoline oilchange place. Since I don't change it, I'd never looked under the oil change cap. Can't really see much - it seems to be a deflector shield right under the cap so you can't see any workings - except that crusty black coating right where you would pour the oil. This is the 3.0 V6, 2002 Avalon XLS. It sure doesn't seem like this would be described as "sludge", but one never knows. I have about 50,000 miles on it. The oil on the dip-stick is (as always) a nice honey-colored amber, and ther's no smoke, and it's never used a drop of oil (I know I said I don't change it, but I DO check it). So, 1) I'd like to see a site of photos of what I would be looking at if it IS sludge, and 2) does anyone have the range of VIN numbers that Toyota covers for this car? (I still love the car, even if it IS sludge <grin>) Steve Henderson try www.auto-rx.com cleaned up my sludge > I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge > discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Steve Henderson Check out http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/sludge/cleaning_sludge.html Tegger posted a series of a sludge job that I did on a Camry. You can get a good idea of what this crap looks like here. > Check out http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/sludge/cleaning_sludge.html > > Tegger posted a series of a sludge job that I did on a Camry. You can get > a good idea of what this crap looks like here. And if you click the "back to top" text on that page, you'll be taken to: http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/sludge/index.html which has even more pictures of sludge.  SignatureTeGGeR® Call you local Toyota dealer, give them the VIN#, and build date, and they will tell you if your vehicle is covered for 'gelling' under the extended warranty. mike hunt "Steve Henderson" > 2) does anyone have the range of VIN numbers that Toyota covers for this > car? > > (I still love the car, even if it IS sludge <grin>) > > Steve Henderson > Call you local Toyota dealer, give them the VIN#, and build date, and they > will tell you if your vehicle is covered for 'gelling' under the extended [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >> >>Steve Henderson Ok - I appreciate all the replies. However, my engine does not look gooey like all these pics... I really can't see any internal parts, just the little aluminum "shield" that's RIGHT under the oil cap, and about 1 inch down. Could someone else look at their "V6 3000 Four Cam 24 VVT-i engine" and take the oil filler cap off and look inside? Mine's pure black. But NOT gooey at all... and like I said before the oil is clean and looks like pure honey. Thanks! >> Call you local Toyota dealer, give them the VIN#, and build date, and >> they will tell you if your vehicle is covered for 'gelling' under the [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Thanks! Took a look at my 03 Avalon, looks the same as you describe if that is any consolation and I don't think I have sludge. Steve Henderson, 11/15/2005, 12:03:26 PM, <Axoef.73794$RG4.44525@fe05.lga> wrote: > > Call you local Toyota dealer, give them the VIN#, and build date, > > and they will tell you if your vehicle is covered for 'gelling' [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > Thanks! My 2000 Sienna V-6 has the same stupid shield in the way where it looks cruddy and burnt. It also makes it difficult to pour oil through a funnel into the engine. Signature"Golf is the hardest game in the world to play, and the easiest to cheat at." -- Dave Hill > Ok - I appreciate all the replies. However, my engine does not look > gooey like all these pics... I really can't see any internal parts, [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Mine's pure black. But NOT gooey at all... and like I said before the > oil is clean and looks like pure honey. I think you may be mistaking varnish for sludge. A slight buildup of that is no problem as long as you're changing your oil every 3K. SignatureTeGGeR® The easiest way to check for sludge is to pop out the cam position sensor and peek in there with a small mirror. If you want to give it a shot, I'll give you directions. > I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge > discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Steve Henderson From having gone though this on my recently acquired 2000 Avalon, I think I can explain a little. "Sludge" is a black mud-like substance that you can scoop out with your finger (if you take the valve cover off). The Toyota special warranty is for what they call "gel", which is more of a hardened gelatin-like substance that clogs oil passages. My engine was ruled by Toyota to be "sludged" but not "gelled," so therefore not eligible for the special free engine exchange (or rebuild). But it was deemed bad enough that the engine needed rebuild or replacement, at a cost of about $5,000. Fortunately, I had an extended care warranty that paid for engine (factory rebuilt short block, new valve covers). The work was just done and it seems to have fixed my oil consumption and smoke problem, but I need to take it on a long highway trip to be sure. I will be doing that over Thanksgiving. When I get back, I will send a full report to this group. Merritt I had the oil changed this am on my 02 Highlander, just under 50k total miles. The same shield is in it also in same appearance. The oil in it is changed at dealer 3000/3months under "lifetime" change. This is similar to what I've seen in other engines that had sheet metal "out of the flow". This is in my " non-mechanic" mind a normal condition. > I had the oil changed this am on my 02 Highlander, just under 50k total > miles. The same shield is in it also in same appearance. The oil in it > is changed at dealer 3000/3months under "lifetime" change. > > This is similar to what I've seen in other engines that had sheet metal > "out of the flow". This is in my " non-mechanic" mind a normal condition. Thanks to everyone - especially those who took a peek under their oil caps and saw the same thing I see. I, too, think it's probably just because the little shield is "out of the flow". I refuse to worry any more about it because of that, and because... 1)I know I get the oil and filter changed more often than Toyota suggests. 2)The car doesn't use a drop of oil between changes 3)There's no smoke, no performance problems 4)The oil is beautiful honey color even as I taking it in for it's regular change. Now, if I could just get those tree roots to stop cracking up my driveway and garage floor - my skylight in the living room to stop seeping at the corner in a rain storm - my hot water heater to stop dripping from the pressure relief valve, that bare spot in my yard to fill in...etc. etc. That's why I own Toyotas - so I can devote my worry time to stuff that matters... <grin> Steve > I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge > discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Steve Henderson We had a RX 300 (01) which showed some sludging at 30k miles despite services by dealer at the recommended 5k intervals. Dealer said is was still OK. We traded the car on a Pilot. >> I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge >> discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > services by dealer at the recommended 5k intervals. Dealer said is was > still OK. We traded the car on a Pilot. I switch to Mobil 1 5W-30 Extended for my 98 RAV4. The gel is now gone after a few changes. When I opened the fill cap I saw drops of condensed water inside. Likely the head stays too cool to drive off the water unless driven long and hard. I'll keep a close eye on it. Richard. I have a low mileage 2001. My dipstick is always looking like relatively clean oil and it makes me feel that there is something in the design of the engine that prevents the oil from doing its job and suspending oil impurities. Just my opinion. Oil is SUPPOSED to get dirty. >I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge >discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my avalon [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Steve Henderson >I have a low mileage 2001. My dipstick is always looking like relatively >clean oil and it makes me feel that there is something in the design of the >engine that prevents the oil from doing its job and suspending oil >impurities. Just my opinion. Oil is SUPPOSED to get dirty. The oil is not supposed to get dirty. If it was supposed to get dirty, why would manufacturers install oil filters? The oil filter's job is to filter particulates in the oil. Oil does naturally get dirty from stuff that is too fine for the filter to trap. Don't worry about clean oil. SignatureRay O correct the return address punctuation to reply >>I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge >>discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my avalon [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >> >> Steve Henderson >>I have a low mileage 2001. My dipstick is always looking like relatively >>clean oil and it makes me feel that there is something in the design of [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > filter particulates in the oil. Oil does naturally get dirty from stuff > that is too fine for the filter to trap. Don't worry about clean oil. But the oil is not picking up any find stuff and turning dark at the dip stick? Where are the fines ending up? > >>I have a low mileage 2001. My dipstick is always looking like relatively > >>clean oil and it makes me feel that there is something in the design of [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > But the oil is not picking up any find stuff and turning dark at the dip > stick? Where are the fines ending up? on the magnetic plug. we need a chip detector like on airplanes. Signature>>>I have a low mileage 2001. My dipstick is always looking like relatively >>>clean oil and it makes me feel that there is something in the design of [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > But the oil is not picking up any find stuff and turning dark at the dip > stick? Where are the fines ending up? An engine that produces enough fines to be visible in the oil between oil changes will not last very long because to be visible in the oil, the oil filter has to be completely clogged and the oil is bypassing the filter media. Fines are shiny, not black. Oil can get darker over time from combustion by-products but with today's clean-burning engines, the oil does not get dark as quickly as it used to. SignatureRay O correct the return address punctuation to reply Steve, I guess all is in the eye of the beholder. Those who have had the sludge build up in their engines are indeed "sick and tired of the infamous Toyota sludge," but they are SICKENED by Toyota's lack of response! You see, after all this time and the public promise to take care of this matter for its customers, Toyota is NOT honoring the CSP. Just take a look at the petition at http://www.petitiononline.com/TMC2003/petition.html to see what I mean! Apparently, there are a whole lot of Toyota owners who are still VERY angry with Toyota and its outrageous customer service....translated MISTREATMENT! Charlene Blake cblake@erols.com Toyota Owners Unite for Resolution: Engine Oil Sludge See a Toyota owner's "Toyota Owners Unite for Resolution" website where lots of pictures and information is located. The moderator owned a lemon Camry which Toyota refused to properly fix. > I know everyone is probably sick and tired of the infamous toyota sludge > discussion, but hey, I just looked under the oil filler cap on my [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] > > Steve Henderson |
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