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Car Forum / UK Car Forums / General Car Topics (UK group) / February 2009VASCAR use in doubt
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7869217.stm Police withdraw speed detectors Traffic police in Scotland have been ordered to stop using handheld speed detecting equipment amid fears it could be affected by police radio waves. Road policing units were told to employ alternatives to the Visual Average Speed Computer and Recorder (Vascar) system until further notice. It is thought police radios could be causing faults in the speed detectors. The system sees an officer pressing a button as a vehicle passes between two measured points. It has been in use for 25 years. Strathclyde Police confirmed its officers had been asked to use alternative speed detectors while the concerns over the impact of the police radio system Airwave on the device were investigated. > Police withdraw speed detectors Too bad the link says the opposite of everything you quote in the post :) >> Police withdraw speed detectors > > Too bad the link says the opposite of everything you quote in the > post :) LOL! Indeed it does! Ret. >>> Police withdraw speed detectors >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Ret. It DID say as quoted originally, don't pick on the poor OP for a beeb update ;-) >>>> Police withdraw speed detectors >>> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >It DID say as quoted originally, don't pick on the poor OP for a beeb >update ;-) Ah..Now I understand ..Yeah .Don't kick the messenger .Kick the BBC >>> Police withdraw speed detectors >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >Ret. I can't even see the post you reply to as it hasn't appeared in my Newsreader . >http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7869217.stm > >Police withdraw speed detectors Piss poor attempt at a morph Krusty.  SignaturePaul Giverin British Jet Engine Website:- www.britjet.co.uk My photos:- www.pbase.com/vendee > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7869217.stm > > Police withdraw speed detectors Great ! > Traffic police in Scotland have been ordered to stop using handheld > speed detecting equipment amid fears it could be affected by police > radio waves. Fears by people who know absolutely nothing about radio and are using it as yet another excuse. Equipment is made to various standards, so when combined it means there is no risk or any interference. > Road policing units were told to employ alternatives to the Visual > Average Speed Computer and Recorder (Vascar) system until further > notice. The reason it was withdrawn is that police officers were deliberately using it incorrectly! Most didn't even know how to use it or were not trained to the required standard for driving or to even use the equipment. > It is thought police radios could be causing faults in the speed > detectors. They don't and never have and never will. All equipment is type approved to various standards. If you can use a police radio right next to hospital equipment which is made to a crap standard, it's hardly going to do anything to a shielded unit. There is nothing within the operational use of a distance measuring device that can be interfered with by radio. I have seen many appeals being thrown out after proof was provided that police radios caused no interference to speed measuring equipment. So standby for some fun. It only seems to be people speeding that complain anyway so that tells you something immediately. Are all the cases on a no win no fee finance agreement arrangement from a bit of a thick solicitor with failing company? > The system sees an officer pressing a button as a vehicle passes > between two measured points. That's correct, it's a nice looking stopwatch. > It has been in use for 25 years. So has radio and even a few years ago the radios were of a lower standard in terms of spurious emissions. The early radios were terrible for causing interference to even car radios. People have thought "let's try out a new excuse" and blame a digital radio system. The only thing that is different is that the frequency is slightly lower than the old radios and the type of modulation is different. The radios do use less power due to the cellular structure of the new o2 network, so it's a very poor attempt at an excuse for trying to get away with speeding. Are people saying that the operation of a tetra radio or officers own mobile phone causes him/her to press the buttons incorrectly or not use the equipment correctly leading to a deliberately incorrect reading? > Strathclyde Police confirmed its officers had been asked to use > alternative speed detectors while the concerns over the impact of the > police radio system Airwave on the device were investigated. It's already been investigated by other forces when people tried it on as an excuse to get away with speeding. The same solicitors firms and solicitors trying to make a name for themselves kept coming up. EVERY SINGLE APPEAL was thrown out of court after technical evidence and demonstrations were given by Merseyside, Liverpool Tunnel Police and also Cheshire Police. Alternate methods are being used for speed detection as police officers are often not very good at driving and/or operating equipment in accordance with correct procedures! Anyone trying to appeal - don't fall for a solicitor offering a no win no fee finance agreement package. You will not get off with your charges and if you go to a rown court you can have your sentence increased. There is not ONE single case giving any evidence to date. I would agree the "use" of VASCAR can be disputed, the same way as laser and RADAR, even a police officer can lie. Should they really be operating such devices? Look at a web site called "pepipoo". >> It is thought police radios could be causing faults in the speed >> detectors. >They don't and never have and never will. All equipment is type >approved to various standards. What standard is VASCAR equipment compliant with, and does that standard include EMI succeptibility testing at the strength and frequency of the signals in question? > If you can use a police radio right >next to hospital equipment which is made to a crap standard, it's hardly >going to do anything to a shielded unit. Hospital equipment involved in life support is made to an extremely high standard, especially wrt EMI immunity. > There is nothing within the >operational use of a distance measuring device that can be interfered [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >on a no win no fee finance agreement arrangement from a bit of a thick >solicitor with failing company? >> The system sees an officer pressing a button as a vehicle passes >> between two measured points. >That's correct, it's a nice looking stopwatch. It is a nice-looking *electronic* stopwatch. The buttons that are pressed control a digital input signal. It is very common to find that high intensity radio signals, such as occur close to a radio transmitter, can falsely trigger a digital input. SignatureCynic >>> The system sees an officer pressing a button as a vehicle passes >>> between two measured points. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > that high intensity radio signals, such as occur close to a radio > transmitter, can falsely trigger a digital input. A high impedance input may be affected by a very strong field, but the button on a stopwatch doesn't really fall into that category. Try holding an active mobile phone next to your watch/alarm clock[1] and see if it's affected - I'd be rather surprised if it is. [1] I'm assuming that it isn't clockwork.. :-) >>>> The system sees an officer pressing a button as a vehicle passes >>>> between two measured points. [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >[1] I'm assuming that it isn't clockwork.. :-) Do not under-estimate what a mobile phone can do. Mine was almost certainly responsible for the permanent failure of the flash gun in my 35mm camera. The phone was clipped on the belt around my waist, and the camera was dangling at waist level from a strap around my neck. Afterwards - no flash action (ever again). On another occasion, I had laid my phone on a vehicle dashboard, immediately above the radio. I was stationary, and because I was talking to the passenger, I had turned the radio off. When I turned it on again, it was dead. The LED display simply said 'Code'. Fortunately, re-entering the code brought it back to life again, but I still had to re-enter all the stored stations. It's pretty certain that the phone had completely wiped its memory. SignatureIan >>>>> The system sees an officer pressing a button as a vehicle passes >>>>> between two measured points. [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > re-enter all the stored stations. It's pretty certain that the phone had > completely wiped its memory. Indeed, the field strengths in the immediate vicinity of a mobile phone (particularly an older model) in a weak signal area can be very high - enough to induce small currents in local conductors, and in the case of high-impedance devices enough to generate logic-level voltages - it's quite possible to reset bits in flash storage devices (which is quite likely the explanation for both of your problems), however the button-operated inputs of a clock/stopwatch/VASCAR will (i.e. should be) designed NOT to be high impedance, for exactly this kind of reason. >>> That's correct, it's a nice looking stopwatch. >> It is a nice-looking *electronic* stopwatch. The buttons that are >> pressed control a digital input signal. It is very common to find >> that high intensity radio signals, such as occur close to a radio >> transmitter, can falsely trigger a digital input. >A high impedance input may be affected by a very strong field, but the >button on a stopwatch doesn't really fall into that category. It may well fall into that category wrt a high frequency signal. An inch of copper wire has sufficient inductance to present a significant impedance to a signal in the GHz range. > Try >holding an active mobile phone next to your watch/alarm clock[1] and see >if it's affected - I'd be rather surprised if it is. >[1] I'm assuming that it isn't clockwork.. :-) You know very well that many items *are* affected by a nearby mobile phone. My watch is quite well protected compared with other electronic devices. It has a metal case to shield it, and has no wires longer than a mm or so to act as aerials. The digital electronic auto-pilot on my boat has to be switched off when using the SSB transmitter, because the HF signal completely screws up the compass input data, making the heading appear to swing about all over the place. SignatureCynic |
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