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Car Forum / Volvo Cars / September 2004240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted!
Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you haven't seen the car. If you had a chance to buy a well running 1993 240 wagon with perfect leather seats, cruise control, good cold AC, perfect body, one owner, all service records BUT nearly 190,000 on it, would you think it worth $2500? I'd really like some opinions on this. Thanks! Patricia Patricia! Where is this wagon? $2500? I'll buy it!! :-) would be a twin for our "93, which we wouldn't part with at any price (almost..... ) after eleven years.and 220 000 Km. Happy Motoring! Andy I. | Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you | haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] | Thanks! | Patricia Maybe. I assume you want a wagon more than a sedan. If well serviced and not abused, the 240 engine will handle 300,000 miles, or more. Likewise the automatice transmission. So, pay close attention to the service records to make sure all of the scheduled maintenance was done. Actual receipts showing the replaced wear and tear parts are needed to see the details, since the owner's scheduled maintenance manual is usually only date-stamped by the dealership at time of servicing. Frequent oil changes are the bare minimum. Find out the last time the timing belt was changed (due every 60,000 miles), as well as other belts and hoses. Probably, the air mass meter (AMM) has been replaced once, maybe twice. Find out how many miles ago, since this can be an expensive part ($300 - 600 with minor labor, depending on mechanic's markup). It's an electronic part of the fuel system. When failing, it may reduce engine performance. May even cause stalling and rough running. Also look at records for last time the AC Compressor was replaced. Depending on usage and region, these tend to last from 7 - 11 years, so this one may be due. Replacement with labor, including a new drier cannister and refrigerant is around $1,000. If you are in a harsh winter region, inspect underside closely for weather damage. The 240 is pretty well weather sealed, but not indestructible. When driving, check the steering for even-ness - no pulling either right or left. Check that there is not excessive play (when you rotate steering wheel left or right, tires should immediately respond). When braking, check that the car does not drift left or right. Try a slow easy braking, medium braking, and hard braking. Listen for clunks and rattles during braking, indicating worn suspension or loose braking system components. None of the braking system, steering system, or suspension system parts are very expensive, though can add up if several items are needed. Check the records for date of last brake pads, brake system master cylinder, shock absorbers and struts, ball joints and bushings. If none of this has been done in the last 4 years, this is an indication that the owner has probably stopped keeping good care. If you don't have detailed dates, but the car passes your own test drive, I would strongly recommend a mechanic's inspection before you purchase. This costs around $70, and will give you a detailed report of the car's overall condition, plus a list of parts due for repair/replacement, along with cost estimates. If all the wear and tear items are replaced on schedule and never wrecked, then this car is easily worth $2,500. > Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you > haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Thanks! > Patricia > Maybe. > > I assume you want a wagon more than a sedan. Probably, the air mass meter (AMM) has > been replaced once, maybe twice. Find out how many miles ago, since > this can be an expensive part ($300 - 600 with minor labor, depending on [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > replaced. Depending on usage and region, these tend to last from 7 - 11 > years, so this one may be due. ... > None of the braking system, steering system, or suspension system parts > are very expensive, though can add up if several items are needed. > Check the records for date of last brake pads, brake system master > cylinder, shock absorbers and struts, ball joints and bushings. If none > of this has been done in the last 4 years, this is an indication that > the owner has probably stopped keeping good care. I have a 1989 240 wagon. Everything that you mentioned has been done to my car except it still has the original AMM, original air con compressor, and the original brake system master unless they were replaced before I bought it in 1995 with 60,000 miles. It also has the original fuel pump and alternator. The water pump was changed out twice - once after a sudden failure and once last month because I didn't want one to fail suddenly again. The care currently has 183,000 miles on the odometer. David "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved" > > Maybe. > > [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > > David Use a Volvo water pump, the aftermarket ones are all over the place on quality, you should get around 80k miles out of an original. > "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you will be saved" I'll believe in my Volvo instead, thanks. >Use a Volvo water pump, the aftermarket ones are all over the place on quality, you should get around 80k miles out of an original. I always change my water pump with my timing belt. Buy it. Have a reputable indepentant Volvo mechanic take a look at it first. If there are no major mechanical issues present. You'll be fine. > Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you > haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Thanks! > Patricia >If you had a chance to buy a well running 1993 240 wagon with perfect leather >seats, cruise control, good cold AC, perfect body, one owner, all service >records BUT nearly 190,000 on it, would you think it worth $2500? Hell yeah! In a heartbeat! You've just described *THE* dream car. There are a couple of things that I would automatically do, right after buying it, that would put the total cost at about $4, depending on what the previous owner did with the suspension and a couple of other things, that I would do to any Volvo. I'd still call it an ok bargain. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: fishbowl@conservatory.com (james) [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >the previous owner did with the suspension and a couple of other things, >that I would do to any Volvo. I'd still call it an ok bargain. Thanks very much to everyone who responded. I just bought it, for $2250. It was Item #2488085548 on eBay if anyone wants to check it out while the photos are still up. I'm off to Massachussetts this weekend to pick it up. Wish me luck. I'll give you a full report! Thanks again, Patricia | Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you | haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] | Thanks! | Patricia Had you mentioned that it was on eBay, my advice would have been to avoid it at ANY price. LH Hi Larry, You said it! Me too! Andy I. | | Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you | | haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] | | LH >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "brackenburn" brackenburn@shaw.-deletethis bit- ca [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] >| >| LH Why? I've purchased several cars though eBay without problem. eBay also offers many protections not available with direct purchase from individuals or even dealers. Why would you have avoided it? Did you look at the car (the listing I mean, obviously you didn't look at the car!). Why the bad feelings about eBay? Patricia | >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! | >From: "brackenburn" brackenburn@shaw.-deletethis bit- ca [quoted text clipped - 35 lines] | | Patricia First, I would not buy such an old, high-mileage car without driving it and looking it over--that's just good sense (the term "buying a pig in a poke" comes to mind). An eBay seller will present the car in the best light possible--he wants to sell it to someone--and anyone will do. Second, for every good "I bought it on eBay and I'm tickled pink" story, there are an equal number of bad ones of people being not quite so tickled. LH > Second, for > every good "I bought it on eBay and I'm tickled pink" story, there are an > equal number of bad ones of people being not quite so tickled. A perfectly valid point. And here's an example. In this article, posted on June 3, 2004, <Google groups link: http://tinyurl.com/4msx2>, the protagonist of this thread purchased a 1992 240 via eBay, and appeared satisfied with the purchase (although the car had not been inspected). Barely a month later, after picking the car up, at least one problem was discovered with the car, as indicated in this post on July 20, 2004. <Google groups link: http://tinyurl.com/62egz> Purchasing cars, sight unseen, through eBay may not be the wisest thing to do. Caveat emptor.  SignatureBev A. Kupf "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." -- G.W. Bush, August 5, 2004. >First, I would not buy such an old, high-mileage car without driving it and >looking it over--that's just good sense (the term "buying a pig in a poke" [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > >LH Have you ever used eBay? I mean I understand what you're saying, but you do sound like someone who's not really familiar with eBay and the protections they offer. The dealer I bought the car from is an eBay "Square Deal" member, which affords certain protections and guarantees above and beyond what eBay already offers. If something is misrepresented, I do have several avenues of recourse through eBay. Again, did you look at the listing? Perhaps that would address some of your concerns. Thanks, Patricia | >First, I would not buy such an old, high-mileage car without driving it and | >looking it over--that's just good sense (the term "buying a pig in a poke" [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] | Thanks, | Patricia I am familiar with eBay and have used it since its inception. There have been many "Square Dealers" who have been "NARU'ed" by eBay, that is, they've had their accounts suspended for less than honorable dealings. Ultimately, eBay's protections and guarantees are of little value and serve only to encourage buyers to buy, thereby putting money in eBay's coffers. Everyone on eBay is selling something, especially eBay. I would echo Bev A. Kupf's advice, buyer beware. LH > I am familiar with eBay and have used it since its inception. There have been > many "Square Dealers" who have been "NARU'ed" by eBay, that is, they've had > their accounts suspended for less than honorable dealings. Ultimately, eBay's > protections and guarantees are of little value and serve only to encourage > buyers to buy, thereby putting money in eBay's coffers. Everyone on eBay is > selling something, especially eBay. Which is not to say that all sellers on eBay are disreputable. A local Volvo dealership sells some of their trade-ins on eBay. I would probably deal with them online, but have the comfort of knowing who they are, and inspecting the vehicle before placing a bid. But I would not purchase a car from anyone who buys them at auction and then sells them on eBay - I'm told that's how most of the smaller "auto-dealers" on eBay operate. Their margins are small, and the less that's said about their inspection programs, the better. It isn't too difficult to make an AC "blow cold" for a few weeks :-) Beverly SignatureBev A. Kupf "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we. They never stop thinking about ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we." -- G.W. Bush, August 5, 2004. > It isn't too difficult to make an AC "blow cold" for a few weeks :-) > > Beverly \ And it's not too difficult to make it blow cold for a few years either, if it works at all then the system is complete. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "James Sweet" jamessweet@hotmail.com [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >> >> Beverly It's almost September; I live in Chicago. If it blows cold for just a few weeks, I'll be all set until next year! > And it's not too difficult to make it blow cold for a few years either, if > it works at all then the system is complete. Okay, I have just gone through a Tucson summer with an on-again off-again air conditioner. Except for this problem, my 1991 740 is wonderful. But no A/C in Tucson can be a life-threatening situation. Sometimes the A/C works. Sometimes it doesn't. You get in the car, start it up, turn on the air, and it works until you stop. Then when you start up again, it's off. Sometimes. Sometimes, when it is off, you can finesse it into coming on, by either repeatedly pushing the switch, or else by turning the heat control knob. When it works, it works well. The system has no leaks. The compressor is good. It's charged up. What now? >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: james of tucson fishbowl@radagast.home.conservatory.com [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > >What now? Move to Minnesota. > > And it's not too difficult to make it blow cold for a few years either, if > > it works at all then the system is complete. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > > What now? Start with the obvious, check the fuse and the switch, then go from there. Oh, check the pressostat on the reciever/dryer too, it should test short circuit assuming the charge is good, fairly common failure, standard GM part that's easy to get too. >> Sometimes the A/C works. Sometimes it doesn't. You get in the car, >> start it up, turn on the air, and it works until you stop. Then when >> you start up again, it's off. Sometimes. Make sure you have a good ground on the a/c compressor. Without a good ground, the clutch will not engage. >>>Sometimes the A/C works. Sometimes it doesn't. You get in the car, >>>start it up, turn on the air, and it works until you stop. Then when >>>you start up again, it's off. Sometimes. > > Make sure you have a good ground on the a/c compressor. Without a good ground, > the clutch will not engage. ie- wiring harness neds to be replaced with a 1990+ version (non-bio-degradeable from 1990-1993). > >First, I would not buy such an old, high-mileage car without driving it and > >looking it over--that's just good sense (the term "buying a pig in a poke" [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > Thanks, > Patricia Also it's $2250, even if the car is a total turd it's not exactly a huge sum of money, it's less than an inexpensive brand new car would drop in value the moment you drive it off the lot and it could be a turd too. > Why? I've purchased several cars though eBay without problem. eBay can be okay. I'd worry about Massachussetts though. I'm quite spoiled, here in Arizona. There is no reason at all to even look at a car that has *any* rust. Massachussetts though, I'd definitely expect rust. Still, I think you probably got a good deal, if everything is as it is supposed to be. Good luck! >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: james of tucson fishbowl@radagast.home.conservatory.com [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >rust. Still, I think you probably got a good deal, if everything is as >it is supposed to be. Good luck! Hopefully no rust. All the 240s I've had so far have been from the east coast, and only one had any rust (which I knew about going in). I'll let you know when I get it back Monday and my mechanic does his inspection. Should be a long weekend -- driving from Chicago to Cleveland tonight, Cleveland to Boston tomorrow, then a straight shot from Boston back to Chicago Sunday so I can be at work Monday morning. Oy! If nothing else, though, after 15 hours on the road with the new car, I should know it pretty well by the time I hit Chicago! | >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! | >From: james of tucson fishbowl@radagast.home.conservatory.com [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] | at work Monday morning. Oy! If nothing else, though, after 15 hours on the | road with the new car, I should know it pretty well by the time I hit Chicago! Do let us know if you make it. LH >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "Larry_Horse" jasd@northgr.com [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > >LH I guess that would be the only way I could let you know, as if I don't make it I'll only be able to haunt you. > | Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you > | haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > > LH Why? I know plenty of people who've bought cars off ebay, it's great, no haggling, prices are usually pretty good, and as a seller it's a convenient way to not have to deal with the same issues. > Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you > haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > records BUT nearly 190,000 on it, would you think it worth $2500? I'd really > like some opinions on this. Buy now before I do. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > >Buy now before I do. Thanks -- I did! ;-) >>Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >>From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] > > ;-) My last Volvo was nearly identical with 230K on it - all highway miles. It was a superb car, but since it wasn't a wagon, it eventually was sold. Finding a mint condition 1993 240 wagon with black leather and stick is really hard, even here in California. But I keep looking :) >>> Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >>> From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net Date: [quoted text clipped - 28 lines] > > But I keep looking :) I just donated my 86 240 with over 200k running perfect and am sick because I kept my 92 940 just as good with over 200k. In California. Both are excellent cars. However the blue book on the 86 is around 1500 to 2000. 2500 for a 93 looks good. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: dan dfederic2002@yahoo.com [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >Both are excellent cars. However the blue book on the 86 is around 1500 >to 2000. 2500 for a 93 looks good. When my friends in Northern CA were looking to replace their 1983 240 wagon (manual transmission) with a newer 240 wagon, they actually hired a search firm to find the perfect one for them. They ended up with a nice one (of course), a 1992. they are sweet cars....a buddie of mine is taking a front end wrecked 240 wagon and turning it into a trailer, using the rear axel...he swears it will go a million miles as a working trailer, he is going to torch just aft of the rear door, keeping all the glass and id lights for the "new trailer"...it should look cool to volvo owners driving up behine, and passing, ea? > >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! > >From: dan dfederic2002@yahoo.com [quoted text clipped - 43 lines] > to find the perfect one for them. They ended up with a nice one (of course), a > 1992. > they are sweet cars....a buddie of mine is taking a front end wrecked > 240 wagon and turning it into a trailer, using the rear axel...he > swears it will go a million miles as a working trailer, he is going to > torch just aft of the rear door, keeping all the glass and id lights > for the "new trailer"...it should look cool to volvo owners driving up > behine, and passing, ea? Well if nothing else it'll be a unique trailer, not sure if I'd classify it as "cool" but interesting perhaps. > My last Volvo was nearly identical with 230K on it - all highway miles. > It was a superb car, but since it wasn't a wagon, it eventually was > sold. Finding a mint condition 1993 240 wagon with black leather > and stick is really hard, even here in California. > > But I keep looking :) Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think you can get a '93 240 with a stick in the US, you can make one easily enough though. Hi James, Don't know about the US, but you CAN get a '93 240 with a stick in Canada......... mine; but it's not for sale..... Andy I. | Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think you can get a '93 240 | with a stick in the US, you can make one easily enough though. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "James Sweet" jamessweet@hotmail.com [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think you can get a '93 240 >with a stick in the US, you can make one easily enough though. Of course you can! There are several on eBay right at this moment (though not with black leather -- I looked!). > >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! > >From: "James Sweet" jamessweet@hotmail.com [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > Of course you can! There are several on eBay right at this moment (though not > with black leather -- I looked!). Hmm, I must be thinking of the 700/900 series, I know they stopped offering it on the 740 at some point and never offered a stick in the 940 here. >>My last Volvo was nearly identical with 230K on it - all highway miles. >>It was a superb car, but since it wasn't a wagon, it eventually was [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think you can get a '93 240 > with a stick in the US, you can make one easily enough though. You can. That wagon/black leather/stick combo was only about 5-10% of all Volvos sold, IIRC. Patricia, How is your new 240? What has your local mechanic found? Pat > >>My last Volvo was nearly identical with 230K on it - all highway miles. > >>It was a superb car, but since it wasn't a wagon, it eventually was [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > You can. That wagon/black leather/stick combo was only about > 5-10% of all Volvos sold, IIRC. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "Pat Quadlander" pquadlander@comcast.net [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >Pat I just took it in yesterday and got word back last night. It does need several things done, for a total of about $1250, and they also think I should get new tires before winter. However they said it's a good, solid car and once I take care of these things it should be good for years. Considering the Blue Book value of the car (about $4500 for private sale, $6000 retail) and how much I paid for it ($2250), I thought this seemed okay. I mean I'm not *thrilled* to be spending more money, but it seems reasonable to me. I don't have the list on me (it's at work, I'm at home), but I'm happy to list the recommended work if you're interested. Thanks for asking! Patricia >>Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >>From: "Pat Quadlander" pquadlander@comcast.net [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > on me (it's at work, I'm at home), but I'm happy to list the recommended work > if you're interested. Thanks for asking! Sure. Let's see the estimate. Also, get some accessory gauges(fit in the square slots in the dash) and replace the plastic lenses with glass Euro-spec ones if you can. But - $2250+1250 is only $3500 for a car that's basically in perfect condition with a bunch of new parts. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 38 lines] >But - $2250+1250 is only $3500 for a car that's basically in >perfect condition with a bunch of new parts. I thought you'd never ask -- literally, which is why I left the list at work again. Here are the things I remember, but I don't remember the estimates for each: needs a full tune-up, needs an oil change, transmission needs to be serviced, some other thing I can't remember, and the most expensive thing was that apparently someone put in a new timing belt recently, but they put in the wrong one and it has to be changed. That last one was something like $350. I can tell you better when I'm back at work next week, but that's what I remember. In addition, they recommend new tires by winter. But they said after those things are done the car will be good to go for years to come. They said overall it was a good, solid car and very well cared for. Why would I want more gauges? And why would I want to replace the lenses? Thanks, Patricia > Why would I want more gauges? And why would I want to replace the lenses? There are external temperature, oil temp, tack, a small clock, and a couple of others. The smart choice if it is a manual is to swap the big clock next to the speedometer with a big tach. The clock is replaced with a small one in one of the slots. The two remaining slots(assuming the radio is up top) fit an oil pressure and voltmeter gauge. All of those small square covers are now filled with shiny gauges :) >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >an oil pressure and voltmeter gauge. All of those small square >covers are now filled with shiny gauges :) No thanks. I like the big clock next to the speedometer, very much. And the oil pressure and voltmeter gauges would mean nothing to me. I'm quite happy with the number of shiny gauges I currently possess. And what of the lenses? > No thanks. I like the big clock next to the speedometer, very much. And the > oil pressure and voltmeter gauges would mean nothing to me. I'm quite happy > with the number of shiny gauges I currently possess. And what of the lenses? Hmm maybe the guages are more of a guy thing, you can never have too much information about what's going on with the car, oil pressure is arguably the most critical thing to keep an eye on in the whole car because lack of it will completely destroy the engine in short order and prolonged low pressure will greatly reduce it's life. You can get a lot of early warnings from it's behavior as well, and the idiot light on the dash is just that, it tells you when the pressure is already gone and damage is being done. As for the lenses, the plastic US spec stuff is junk, after driving around with european headlamps for couple years it's a bit of a shock every time I drive a car with the US lamps, it's like putting on sunglasses while driving at night. That and the glass lenses won't cloud and yellow after a few years. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "James Sweet" jamessweet@hotmail.com [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >behavior as well, and the idiot light on the dash is just that, it tells you >when the pressure is already gone and damage is being done. I change the oil ever 2000 miles, earlier if I'm going on a long road trip. I think I'm pretty safe. >As for the lenses, the plastic US spec stuff is junk, after driving around >with european headlamps for couple years it's a bit of a shock every time I >drive a car with the US lamps, it's like putting on sunglasses while driving >at night. That and the glass lenses won't cloud and yellow after a few >years The car's 11 years old now and the lenses aren't cloudy or yellow. When's that supposed to kick in? >>Hmm maybe the guages are more of a guy thing, you can never have too much >>information about what's going on with the car, oil pressure is arguably the [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > I change the oil ever 2000 miles, earlier if I'm going on a long road trip. I > think I'm pretty safe. They are about 2 inches in diameter and round. Recessed and very attractive. On an older car, oil pressure and voltage are critical as if the voltage is dropping fast, your wiring harness or electrical system is shot - but you can likely drive to a shop. The oil pressure, though, is a must. Even if you don't add any other gauges, this should be in the upper left slot. If your oil pressure sensor or half a dozen other systems go bad, your car will literally fall apart in a matter of a few miles. Most of the time, the car will be at half normal pressure for a few days before it actually drops to 0, so catching it is simple if you have the gauge. >>As for the lenses, the plastic US spec stuff is junk, after driving around >>with european headlamps for couple years it's a bit of a shock every time I [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > The car's 11 years old now and the lenses aren't cloudy or yellow. When's that > supposed to kick in? 2-3 years. Yours have likely been replaced at least once. The Euro lenses have a birghter, larger pattern as well as are glass, so they are virtually impossible to chip or crack compared to the cheap plastic ones. >2-3 years. Yours have likely been replaced at least once. >The Euro lenses have a birghter, larger pattern as well as are >glass, so they are virtually impossible to chip or crack compared >to the cheap plastic ones. There's a healthy market in plastic headlamp protectors in the UK, because the glass is very easy to crack or chip and replacement is very expensive. At our relatively high motorway speeds and pretty poor roads (generally initially surfaced with loose chippings) it's hard to get a motorway car to a few years old without some damage to the front lights. SignatureTim Hobbs '58 Series 2 88" aka "Stig" '77 101FC Ambulance aka "Burrt" '03 Volvo V70 My Landies? http://www.seriesii.co.uk Barcoding? http://www.bartec-systems.com Tony Luckwill web archive at http://www.luckwill.com > There's a healthy market in plastic headlamp protectors in the UK, > because the glass is very easy to crack or chip and replacement is > very expensive. At our relatively high motorway speeds and pretty > poor roads (generally initially surfaced with loose chippings) it's > hard to get a motorway car to a few years old without some damage to > the front lights. Yes particularly in the US, european lenses are expensive to import (though cheaper than OEM plastic ones) so protection is a very good idea. I installed RockIt film over my 740's lights, it's nearly invisible and I haven't had a chip yet. > I change the oil ever 2000 miles, earlier if I'm going on a long road trip. I > think I'm pretty safe. Oil pressure and oil changes are two completely different things, you could change your oil every 500 miles (every 4000 is plenty if you use good filters) and if you lose pressure due to a faulty pump, bad seal, leak, etc) the engine will still cook in short order. At the very least make sure the idiot light comes on when you first turn on the key. > The car's 11 years old now and the lenses aren't cloudy or yellow. When's that > supposed to kick in? Depends very much on the climate, I've seen them get grody after 5-6 years but usually they last 10-12, longer if the car has been garaged. Sunlight contains a lot of UV which degrades plastic. >>I change the oil ever 2000 miles, earlier if I'm going on a long road > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > but usually they last 10-12, longer if the car has been garaged. Sunlight > contains a lot of UV which degrades plastic. Is there a way to remove the UV absorbed (oxidation) that seems caked from with in the lens, I tryed it and it somewhat worked, problem being I had dificulity sealing the lens back to housing they or it began to leak moisture inside it which then distorts the light beams? Dan I'm not familiar with difference in European and US lenses. I'm driving a US '91 240, original lenses are just fine with me. I'm not saying European is or isn't better, so please don't start a geopolitical flame war on this point. On the dash instruments, you may want to add a tachometer. Next to watching your speedometer, the tach will inform you of hard driving habits (higher fuel costs and wear and tear costs). There are 2 styles: small and large. Your mechanic can easily add the small 2 inch type into either of the unused slots just left of your radio. Look on ebay or junkyards for an inexpensive source. The large type, more preferred by data junkies (just kidding), installs where your big clock currently sits, and typically you would then put a small 2 inch clock into the slot left of your radio. This arrangement actually makes the most sense, by placing frequently referenced speedo and tach conveniently in your line of vision, with large faces, while moving the less-referenced clock away and making it smaller (less obtrusive), but hardly inconvenient. Like the small tach, the large tach and small clock can probably be found cheaply on ebay or a junkyard. Either way, this leaves you still with one more unused slot next to your radio. So many more gauges to choose from. You will have to confront this life-threatening dilemma on your own...;) Backing up to your mechanic's review and maintenance/repair list, I recommend you flush your brake fluid, radiator fluid, and transmission fluid, unless your mechanic can determine that these were done recently, using top quality fluids. Replace the flame trap and have all of the orifices into the throttle body cleaned, and the throttle body hoses inspected/cleaned/replaced as needed. All of these items are pretty cheap, and can prevent very expensive serious repairs. All the talk about gauges is somewhat tongue-in-cheek, whereas these last few maintenance items are not. Ask your mechanic to inspect your radiator to see if it is the original (with cheap, hard plastic tank and hose neck that often deteriorates and cracks around 10 years). If original, ask his opinion about preemptive replacement with an aftermarket metal hose neck radiator. > >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! > >From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > oil pressure and voltmeter gauges would mean nothing to me. I'm quite happy > with the number of shiny gauges I currently possess. And what of the lenses? > I'm not familiar with difference in European and US lenses. I'm driving a > US '91 240, original lenses are just fine with me. I'm not saying European > is or isn't better, so please don't start a geopolitical flame war on this > point. If you tried them you'd never go back, a lot of late model cars have similar beam patterns. The high beams are better too, whenever I have friends along I always get comments if I flip on the high beams. > On the dash instruments, you may want to add a tachometer. Next to watching > your speedometer, the tach will inform you of hard driving habits (higher [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > hardly inconvenient. Like the small tach, the large tach and small clock > can probably be found cheaply on ebay or a junkyard. She said she likes the big clock, fair enough, if it's an automatic you don't really need the tach anyway. > Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you > haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Thanks! > Patricia I'd jump on it personally, nice late model 240's don't grow on trees. > Okay, here's a question for you, just for your gut feelings, as I know you > haven't seen the car. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > Thanks! > Patricia I had myself one and made nearly 380.000,-- Kilometers without any majors problems look carrefuly at the hidden places and give the guy 2.000,-- good luck Pierre >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "Pierre Steiner" steiner.pierre@bluewin.ch [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >good luck >Pierre Well, I got it! Just got back a few hours ago. It hasn't been checked out by my mechanic yet, but I have driven it 1000 miles in the past 24 hours, and we got on like a house afire, as folks say. And the best part is that it turns out not to be blue, but a nice teal green. (Because color is the most important thing in these transactions, as you know.) Anyway, thanks everyone for your input. I'll let you know what my mechanic says. Just thought I'd add my $0.02 I bought a 1981 240 DL wagon about a month ago on Vancouver Island. Drove it back to Southern Ontario in 3 1/2 days. Would have been faster but had charging system problems which meant only daylight driving (long story). Great vehicle. Since I'm finally in the same room with the list of things my "new" car needs done, let me throw it out there, FYI. If you recall (and why would you?) my mechanics say the car needs $1250 of work done to bring it up to snuff. Here's the list: --Oil change --Tune up --Transmission service --Clean throttle body --Replace wrong timing belt with correct one --Replace drive belts --Cooling flush with thermostat In addition, they think it should have new tires before winter. One problem that's not included above that I'm not going to worry about until next year is the air conditioning. The AC is fully charged, but it's only blowing coolish. My mechanic thinks there might be some overlapping going on between the AC and heating that's causing the problem. Since we're cruising into cool weather here, and since I'm already laying out a lot of money for the other repairs, I'm going to leave that as a project for the spring. Does that all sound about right? Thanks again, Patricia > Since I'm finally in the same room with the list of things my "new" car needs > done, let me throw it out there, FYI. If you recall (and why would you?) my > mechanics say the car needs $1250 of work done to bring it up to snuff. Here's > the list: > > --Oil change 25 > --Tune up 400 tops > --Transmission service 100-150 > --Clean throttle body 60-100 > --Replace wrong timing belt with correct one ~3-400 > --Replace drive belts as part of timing belt job-40-50 > --Cooling flush with thermostat 75 1200 sounds right > In addition, they think it should have new tires before winter. suggest this one-- http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=BT70s&par tnum=87SR4BT70S&vehicleSearch=true&fromCompare1=yes say 250 for tires and 50 for the mounting and balance, and 50-75 for an alignment 350-375 One problem > that's not included above that I'm not going to worry about until next year is > the air conditioning. The AC is fully charged, but it's only blowing coolish. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Thanks again, > Patricia sounds good to me > --Replace wrong timing belt with correct one I don't care what the previous owner claims, if I acquire a used Volvo, it's getting: Timing Belt, Seal, Water Pump, and a Radiator, if it has any plastic on it. Hoses and drive belts. Battery. Plug wires. IPD Sway Bars. > In addition, they think it should have new tires before winter. Judgement call. I will always put a set of Michelin X-Radials on any car I drive. Michelin tires have saved my life more than once. > The AC is fully charged, but it's only blowing coolish. There is a well-known problem in many years, the A/C control unit has various issues. If you're sure the pressure is good in the AC system, (and you're sure you are sure), then it is possible that there is a grounding problem, or even, a cold solder on the control circuit. Best solution? Replace it with a later one. Costs about $300, ouch, but there it is. Problem exists on many, many, many Volvos. Blower motor blows strong right? Reason I ask, it takes an act of congress to change it. True for every model of Volvo, ever. They put the motor in, then build the car around it, literally. > Does that all sound about right? Yeah! It sounds like you got a good deal. The stuff that's being suggested by your mechanic is pretty standard for any used car. On a Volvo, there are a couple of specific things, I'll risk repeating here: 1. Plastic radiators. Some models for the US market had plastic radiators. Bad for the second owner. Get rid of it. Get a new thermostat and hoses while you're swapping this for an all-metal one. 2. Timing belt. Bite the bullet. Change the belt. While the mechanic has it apart, replace the front seal and the water pump. This maintenance is the difference between a car that dies after 100,000 miles, and the car that lasts forever. (Well, besides rust and bad driving). 3. IPD sway bars. The stock suspension is not bad, but it's so much better if you beef it up with these. Enjoy your car. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: james of tucson fishbowl@radagast.home.conservatory.com [quoted text clipped - 46 lines] > >Enjoy your car. Thanks. They are replacing the timing belt and the drive belts and the thermostat. Yes, the blower is strong (and I'm aware of the problems they can have, having experienced it on a previous 240). The AC I won't worry about until spring. The car currently has 190,000 miles on it, and still seems to be going very strong. I ordered seat covers for the front today as well. There's nothing wrong with the seats currently, but I'd like to keep them that way. I was able to get a pair of custom made covers quite inexpensively, so I figured, why not? Let the covers take the wear and tear of my backside rather than the nice leather. Thanks everyone for your input. You've reassured me that this time I made a good deal. > Thanks. They are replacing the timing belt and the drive belts and the > thermostat. Replace the water pump as well, since they won't charge you twice for taking the front of the engine apart. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Replace the water pump as well, since they won't charge >you twice for taking the front of the engine apart. Funny you should say that! They called yesterday and said that normally when they're doing some of the other stuff they also do the water pump, seals, and tensioner. It's going to cost an extra $390, but will be cheaper to do it now than to wait until there's a problem. I swallowed hard and said, in a sheep's voice, "Okay." >>Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >>From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > than to wait until there's a problem. I swallowed hard and said, in a sheep's > voice, "Okay." $390 is a bit steep, actually. Make sure it's not a cheap no-name water pump. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: Joseph Oberlander josephoberlander@earthlink.net [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] >$390 is a bit steep, actually. Make sure it's not a cheap no-name >water pump. These guys don't do cheap, no-name. I picked up the car last night. They quoted me $1640 for all the work, but ended up charging me only a little over $1300. For the last minute water pump, etc., stuff, they ended up only charging me for parts, no labor. This is why I like taking the car to folks I have a relationship with. > These guys don't do cheap, no-name. I picked up the car last night. They > quoted me $1640 for all the work, but ended up charging me only a little over > $1300. For the last minute water pump, etc., stuff, they ended up only charging > me for parts, no labor. This is why I like taking the car to folks I have a > relationship with. Nice find there. :) > Blower motor blows strong right? Reason I ask, it takes an act of > congress to change it. True for every model of Volvo, ever. They put > the motor in, then build the car around it, literally. Not every model Volvo, in the 700 series cars a blower motor replacement is actually very easy, shouldn't take more than an hour even the first time around. The 240 though is a rather involved job. > Since I'm finally in the same room with the list of things my "new" car needs > done, let me throw it out there, FYI. If you recall (and why would you?) my [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > --Replace drive belts > --Cooling flush with thermostat Sounds like about 5x what it would cost me to do it all myself but then the mechanics have to eat and pay for the shop overhead as well. >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: "James Sweet" jamessweet@hotmail.com [quoted text clipped - 19 lines] >Sounds like about 5x what it would cost me to do it all myself but then the >mechanics have to eat and pay for the shop overhead as well. Yes, well, you could put me and all those Shakespeare typing monkeys in a fully outfitted garage with that car and give us from here until all eternity and together we'd still never be able to make a start on accomplishing these fixes, so I guess I'd have to say the mechanics are well worth their $85 an hour. >--Oil change >--Tune up [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] >--Replace drive belts >--Cooling flush with thermostat $1250?!?! That had better be one heck of a tuneup! I meant with all new sensors (air mass especially, ASK THEM), new cap, plugs, wires, roors, etc. Oil change $25 at any quickie place; tranny service sounds scary but is a drain and replace filter most likely, a $100 job tops; Throttle body, I dunno; belts, including timing belt, is a $150 job cooling flush is a $60 job; So that's a... what... $900 dollar tuneup? Like I said, that had better be one "major" tuneup, with all the frills. If it is, that's not exorbinant but does seem a little high. What you are describing strikes me as $900 worth of work, total, at my local shop, max. -jeff >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! >From: handywired@aol.com (Handywired) [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] > >Oil change $25 at any quickie place; I don't take my car to "quickie" places. It's worth the extra $18 for me to have the oil change done by a mechanic I know and trust who knows my car and specializes in imports. >tranny service sounds scary but is a drain and replace filter most likely, a >$100 job tops; $188 actually. >Throttle body, I dunno; Cleaning the throttle body is included in the full tuneup, which is $298. >belts, including timing belt, is a $150 job $374. >cooling flush is a $60 job; With thermostate, $135. >So that's a... what... $900 dollar tuneup? Like I said, that had better be >one [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >-jeff and if I needed pelvic exam, I'm fairly confident that I could get any number of men to put on a white coat and give me a look-see for far cheaper than my gynecologist. But I'm probably not going to do that. When it comes to things that are important to me, I'd prefer to pay the going rate of my trusted specilist rather than cheap out and probably run into problems later. > >Subject: Re: 240 Worth It? Opinions Wanted! > >From: handywired@aol.com (Handywired) [quoted text clipped - 50 lines] > that are important to me, I'd prefer to pay the going rate of my trusted > specilist rather than cheap out and probably run into problems later. You are aware that playing doctor isn't just for kids, don't you? |
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