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Car Forum / Volvo Cars / February 2006help ! I think I broke my turbo on my turbo !
I have a 740 Wagon Turbo and I'm not sure if it's electrical that I bumped or my own fault for running the car with low oil. I replaced the 3/8 size type hose that comes up by the Transmission Fluid dip stick yesterday. It's that hose that has the inline vacuum check valve and into the top intake. Well, I was on the freeway today and the car had no turbo power. I was going about 70. When I came to a light the car was chugging along, shimming like it was cold or something. I thought it might have been the lack of oil. I also had low oil because of an oil leak and think I might have broken the turbo; however, the car runs fine but with no power now. It accelerates and runs without black smoke or anything. One thing I noticed is when I come to a stop while in drive, the needle on the turbo is at "10 o'clock. When I accelerate the shaking stops. And when the care is turned off , the needle goes straight to 12 o'clock? That's not correct, right? If I recall, it's supposed to go down like the fuel guage and temp guage. FWIW, the check oil light never came on, and it has run on low oil before, not that it's good to do, but I'm hoping it's not serious. I know I'm an idiot for not checking the oil, but I was only on the freeway for about 15 minutes. Do you think I may have ruined the turbo or even worse? How can I check? Any diagnosis would be greatly appreciated. Just a day ago I was zipping along and the turbo was fine. I hope it's something I can fix. I can only compare it to my 244 Turbo, but the hose you are describing (on mine) provides a source of vacuum for the vacuum operated heat/defrost system. It could be you have a vacuum leak: check all the hoses. To check the turbo, pull off the front air intake hose, and try to spin the turbine vanes by hand; if they spin freely, and if there is little or no play in the turbine shaft, then the turbo is probably OK. Is the catalytic converter OK? I'll check the turbo tomorrow. If you can forgive me, where are the turbine vanes? I think the catalytic converter is okay, I mean on Sunday I changed that hose and also the wiring harness is brittle and broken in places. Saturday it had zip and zoom! I pulled the throttle body and cleaned it well, it was sluggish and after cleaning it and setting the TPS, it's been good! It was never set and was sucking gas with poor mileage. And so on Sunday I pulled the hose because it had never been changed and broke and I replaced it. Only after this I noticed I had loss power and no turbo and the car shakes at the stop sign/stop light. > I'll check the turbo tomorrow. If you can forgive me, where are the > turbine vanes? Follow the big thick hose from the airbox to the front of the turbocharger, disconnect it there and stick your finger in, you should feel a shaft in the middle with a nut on it, that shaft is what you want to spin. > > I'll check the turbo tomorrow. If you can forgive me, where are the > > turbine vanes? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > feel a shaft in the middle with a nut on it, that shaft is what you want > to spin. Okay, I'll do that today, thanks. One thing I did notice is when I accelerate and go into turbo (yellow) I hear a whisper, raspy flutter sound from the back of the car. Not outside, but I mean you can hear it. Not a sputter, but a flutter. Unless the cat is bad or clogged, but it didn't do it two days ago. >>> I'll check the turbo tomorrow. If you can forgive me, where are the >>> turbine vanes? [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Unless the cat is bad or clogged, but it didn't do it two days ago. If the guage goes into the yellow, then the turbo itself is working. Really, James ? I mean it does goes into the yellow but that' s just the guage on the dashboard, I mean I hear what I think sounds like the turbo spinning, that kind of "breath" sound. Isn't that the turbo, you know when you accelerate and go into turbo then left off the gas, you hear that breath sound. "aahhh" sound. If that makes sense. I didn't get a chance to pull the hose and check the turbine if it spins, but I did spray WD-40 on the injectors and on the hoses and no change. Maybe the fuel pressure regulator? I pulled off the front hose and didn't really smell gas. I could feel it sucking air in. I didn't get a chance to pull the back hose off to check for gas. I just hope that the turbo isn't gone or anything worse like bent engine parts. > Really, James ? I mean it does goes into the yellow but that' s just > the guage on the dashboard, I mean I hear what I think sounds like the > turbo spinning, that kind of "breath" sound. Isn't that the turbo, you > know when you accelerate and go into turbo then left off the gas, you > hear that breath sound. "aahhh" sound. If that makes sense. The guage on the dash is a mechanical pressure/vacuum guage connected to the intake manifold. The black area is vacuum and the yellow area is pressure. Where these meet is normal atmospheric pressure. If the turbo seizes then the guage will behave as a normal vacuum guage and move around in the black area reacting to engine load, however for it to go into the yellow there has to be positive pressure in the intake manifold and the only way that's happening is if the turbocharger is working and producing boost. Sounds to me like you've got a rip in one of the rubber air hoses between the turbo and the intake manifold. Remove them and inspect carefully as often times you'll get a flap which closes up and becomes invisible until boost is produced. I'll check the hoses again, but I replaced it. See what happened was this: I was replacing spark plugs and wanted to clean the area around the oil trap because I don't know when/if it has ever been replaced. I cleaned the throttle body last week and set the TPS. Well, when I pulled the fat hose (3/8 about) that goes on the top intake manifold and down to the one-way black/white disc vacuum valve into the plastic "T" which one hose goes somewhere up front by the radiator intercooler (I don't know where the other end goes to? I mean it's connected somewhere). Anyway, that top fat hose broke ! It was original and so I bought 3 feet of new hose and replaced it. Then I'm on the freeway next day and the car was real hot, I mean like I said oil was low. But the temp was in the middle--there was no smoking or overheating, but it was hot ! So I put in oil and thought I might have ruined the engine! But it runs fine for the most part. No excessive gas smell, usage or anything. It accelerates eventually to 70mph but has no power. Maybe the "wastegate" ? (in quotes because I don't know really what it is orhow it supposed to work if it's not working. As far as the timing belt, blurp, It was changed a while back, I don't think it would be that. P.S. I did rewire a spade connector near that area which had baked crubling wire and restripped it and put the connection back. There isn't anything electrical on the turbo, right? Also the car does shake still a little at the stop light but not much, but enough you could tell. > I have a 740 Wagon Turbo and I'm not sure if it's electrical that I > bumped or my own fault for running the car with low oil. I replaced [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > Just a day ago I was zipping along and the turbo was fine. I hope it's > something I can fix. The turbo guage should sit right between the black and yellow sections when off, at 0 psi so it sounds like that's working ok. Pull the intake hose off the turbo and see if you can spin the turbine by hand. Lack of oil pressure certainly can cause the turbo bearings to seize though. > I have a 740 Wagon Turbo and I'm not sure if it's electrical that I > bumped or my own fault for running the car with low oil. I replaced > the 3/8 size type hose that comes up by the Transmission Fluid dip > stick yesterday. It's that hose that has the inline vacuum check valve > and into the top intake. Did you put the check valve back in the right direction? :-) That's what my immediate thought was, and yes, it's on correctly. Unless it is faulty? but I blew into it and it works, and confirmed it is one-way valve. >That's what my immediate thought was, and yes, it's on correctly. >Unless it is faulty? but I blew into it and it works, and confirmed it >is one-way valve. Is there any chance that you may have done something to throw the timing off? My 83 240 Turbo was totally gutless after a timing belt replacement and it was found to be the result of improperly adjusted timing. The turbo still spooled up but the power wasn't there. That also goes with the "fluttering" sound you're hearing... I think that's detonation. Just a thought. Blurp > Is there any chance that you may have done something to throw the > timing off? My 83 240 Turbo was totally gutless after a timing belt > replacement and it was found to be the result of improperly adjusted > timing. The turbo still spooled up but the power wasn't there. That > also goes with the "fluttering" sound you're hearing... I think that's > detonation. I experienced that once too, belt was off by *one* tooth and the car would barely go 5mph in 1st with the pedal to the floor. Once the boost did build up after around 10 seconds it would smoke the tires though. well, the car was just smogged so , they did say the timing was off, and that was corrected. I'll check. Most likely hose\s perished .Mine did so after replacement I put that slit tubing over it to protect it from heat when the motor is turned off .Its called heat soak and does much damage so idling down helps to prevent heat soak after a long run and the Turbo will last longer too .I lift my hood \ bonnet and let the heat out after a long run and idle down . >I have a 740 Wagon Turbo and I'm not sure if it's electrical that I > bumped or my own fault for running the car with low oil. I replaced [quoted text clipped - 26 lines] > Just a day ago I was zipping along and the turbo was fine. I hope it's > something I can fix. I'll check all those hoses, John. Thanks. I think I fixed it ! It has boost, but there's a problem : ( The obvious was ---or maybe I didn't fix it, but it feels like it? -- is the aluminium according type stretchable hose that goes from the airbox at the bottom near the exhaust I think was old and had holes, and so I cut the end and stretched it to fit, and now it has some boost! But there's a problem with the turbo that I will start in another thread. Follow me :D > I think I fixed it ! It has boost, but there's a problem : ( > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > But there's a problem with the turbo that I will start in another > thread. Follow me :D That metal hose isn't needed, in fact it's completely useless on the turbo cars since it preheats the intake air when the engine is cold, but then the intercooler cools it right back down. The airbox thermostat can fail and kill the expensive air mass meter so I just yank that metal hose and throw it away on my cars, it might have some value in a very cold climate but it's not needed here and has no effect on the way the car runs. hmmm? Well, it may be coincidence, but why did it help? I mean I don't hear the flutter anymore--unless---unless that hose was blocking the grinded down hole in the turbocharger housing? The airbox thermostat--what is it? I mean how's it look? > hmmm? Well, it may be coincidence, but why did it help? I mean I > don't hear the flutter anymore--unless---unless that hose was blocking > the grinded down hole in the turbocharger housing? > > The airbox thermostat--what is it? I mean how's it look? Way down in the bottom of the box is a pellet in a holder - that pellet is the thermostat. I don't have a clear memory of its shape, but it is pretty obvious when you see it. Mike Oh yeah, it's has a spring in it--looks like a peg, right? I know what you're talking about. Well, how can I test it? Is there a way to find out whether it's faulty? thanks, Mike. > Oh yeah, it's has a spring in it--looks like a peg, right? I know what > you're talking about. Well, how can I test it? Is there a way to find > out whether it's faulty? That's the thing! I knew mine was bad because the flap was being held in the position to get hot air even though it was summertime in Phoenix! Realistically, a few seconds heat from a hair dryer should send it to the cold air position and an ice cube should send it to the hot air position. It seems to me the price was pretty tame for a Volvo part. Mike Thanks Mike, also can I ask you a question? I started a new thread on another top that came from this thread. Can you take a look? Not sure how experienced you are, but maybe your input might be helpful: http://groups.google.com/group/alt.autos.volvo/browse_thread/thread/73c86b319368 251c/aed78310d6394f2c?hl=en#aed78310d6394f2c > Oh yeah, it's has a spring in it--looks like a peg, right? I know what > you're talking about. Well, how can I test it? Is there a way to find > out whether it's faulty? > > thanks, Mike. Unless you live in a very cold climate, just pull that metal hose off and throw it away, pull the thermostat pin out and wedge the flap shut. If you do live where it goes down below zero regularly then buy a new thermostat, they're cheap and they're usually bad if they're old. Okay thanks! BTW, another thing (oh brother, this car) the oil is leaking from the return line pipe from the turbo. Would it be possible to relace the oil seal o-ring and gasket without removing the turbo ? I know there's two 13mm bolts---would it be possible to do it from the bottom of the car? thanks. > Okay thanks! > [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > > thanks. As I recall yeah, you can remove the drain line with the turbo in place. You might have to remove the wastegate actuator for clearance though, I've only ever done it on a Garrett turbo. There's a silicone O-ring at the block and a fiber gasket at the turbo. thank you ! I looked at the wastegate actuator ---it looked like it was held on with wire? I mean the connection part linkage thingy? > thank you ! I looked at the wastegate actuator ---it looked like it > was held on with wire? > > I mean the connection part linkage thingy? There should be a circlip, as well as there's a wire which is the tamper seal, your warranty is long expired though so don't worry about that. Oh, okay, thank you. yeah, I don't believe extended they opted for the extended extended extended extened 20-year warranty. thank you ! I looked at the wastegate actuator ---it looked like it was held on with wire? I mean the connection part linkage thingy? |
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