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Car Forum / Volkswagen / Air Cooled Volkswagen Cars / December 2003

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Cooling Flaps and thermostat (new thread)

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JS - 28 Dec 2003 18:17 GMT
Thanks for all the input here.  It is very useful and educational.  I've decided to install the cooling flaps and thermostat although I live in SoCal.  Has anyone used this conversion kit?
http://store.cip1.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=VWC-040-198
-119-KIT&Category_Code-06-03-04

I can't find anyone that sells the cooling flaps, so I'm having to try out junkyards unless someone knows where I can get them.

Thanks,
John
Reply to this Message
Max Welton - 28 Dec 2003 21:19 GMT
> Thanks for all the input here.  It is very useful and educational.  I've
> decided to install the cooling flaps and thermostat although I live in
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> Thanks,
> John

GBE has them. http://www.geneberg.com/vwpartspg24.htm

Max
Reply to this Message
Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott - 28 Dec 2003 21:51 GMT
>> Thanks for all the input here.  It is very useful and educational.  
>> I've decided to install the cooling flaps and thermostat although I
[quoted text clipped - 8 lines]
>
> GBE has them. http://www.geneberg.com/vwpartspg24.htm

He does indeed have parts. I don't know how to find the parts I need,
through. He references VW line codes. Is there a lookup chart someplace
that lists the line codes for the cooling tin parts for a 71 Type 2?

Specifically, I need the part labeled #4 in the Bentley's Official
Service Manual for Station Wagon /Bus, 68-79, Chapter 6, Engine and
Clutch, Figure 6-4. This part is called "Air Duct Lower Part (Left)" on
the figure.

And I need two of the #8 Air Hose Rubber Grommets.

BTW, this link: www.1800vw.bizhosting.com/0.cooling_tin.t2.2.htm shows
the part as #043 119 351B -- a part number that does not turn on on the
GBE site.

Signature

Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
71 VW Type 2 -- the Wonderbus (AKA the Saunabus in summer)

Reply to this Message
Max Welton - 28 Dec 2003 22:11 GMT
>>> Thanks for all the input here.  It is very useful and educational.  
>>> I've decided to install the cooling flaps and thermostat although I
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> through. He references VW line codes. Is there a lookup chart someplace
> that lists the line codes for the cooling tin parts for a 71 Type 2?

Yeah, that page is tough to use without the actual diagrams. ;-)

> Specifically, I need the part labeled #4 in the Bentley's Official
> Service Manual for Station Wagon /Bus, 68-79, Chapter 6, Engine and
> Clutch, Figure 6-4. This part is called "Air Duct Lower Part (Left)" on
> the figure.

Hmm. My Bentley 1200 Type 11, 14, and 15(1961-1965) probably won't be any
help...

> And I need two of the #8 Air Hose Rubber Grommets.

These fit around the 2" air hose where it passes through the tin,
right?That would be VW 113-119-585B "Heater tube rubber seal" in the Berg
Catalog.

> BTW, this link: www.1800vw.bizhosting.com/0.cooling_tin.t2.2.htm shows
> the part as #043 119 351B -- a part number that does not turn on on the
> GBE site.

Looking at the diagram in the GBE catalog, that is the "3/4 sideheater box
air shield", part number VWB040-119-3515 in the Berg catalog.
Reply to this Message
Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott - 29 Dec 2003 03:02 GMT
>>>> Thanks for all the input here.  It is very useful and educational.  
>>>> I've decided to install the cooling flaps and thermostat although I
[quoted text clipped - 35 lines]
> Looking at the diagram in the GBE catalog, that is the "3/4 sideheater
> box air shield", part number VWB040-119-3515 in the Berg catalog.

Kewl. Moving on to more exciting parts, can someone tell me what this
part sold by aircooled.net is?

http://tinyurl.com/2lxub

and how about this:

http://tinyurl.com/37ks6

Are they shown on any of the T2 cooling tin illustrations at

http://www.1800vw.bizhosting.com/0.cooling_tin.t2.1.htm ? (there are
three pages)

Signature

Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
71 VW Type 2 -- the Wonderbus (AKA the Saunabus in summer)

Reply to this Message
Scott H - 29 Dec 2003 03:49 GMT
> Kewl. Moving on to more exciting parts, can someone tell me what this
> part sold by aircooled.net is?
> http://tinyurl.com/2lxub

On page 2 at the link below, the left side part is item 40. I don't see the
right one there but it's the corresponding piece for the right side.

> and how about this:
> http://tinyurl.com/37ks6

Again, on page 2 at the below link, it's item 39.

> Are they shown on any of the T2 cooling tin illustrations at
> http://www.1800vw.bizhosting.com/0.cooling_tin.t2.1.htm ? (there are
> three pages)

hth

--
Scott
Reply to this Message
Max Welton - 29 Dec 2003 03:59 GMT
>> Kewl. Moving on to more exciting parts, can someone tell me what this
>> part sold by aircooled.net is?
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
> the
> right one there but it's the corresponding piece for the right side.

Here's item 40. Only visible from above because I have a Baja.

http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-006F.JPG

Max
Reply to this Message
Scott H - 29 Dec 2003 05:06 GMT
> > and how about this:
> > http://tinyurl.com/37ks6
>
> Again, on page 2 at the below link, it's item 39.

BTW, Mike .... to the best of my knowledge, these parts, the under cylinder
deflectors .... on a T1 engine, cannot be installed without removing the
head, pushrods, pushrod tubes, etc. They are vitally important parts and
need to be in place.
I've only built one engine (and only a top end build at that ... and
disassembled two <g>), so wait for the smart guys to confirm that.

> > Are they shown on any of the T2 cooling tin illustrations at
> > http://www.1800vw.bizhosting.com/0.cooling_tin.t2.1.htm ? (there are
> > three pages)

--
Scott
Reply to this Message
Jan Andersson - 29 Dec 2003 10:42 GMT
>>>and how about this:
>>>http://tinyurl.com/37ks6
[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
> I've only built one engine (and only a top end build at that ... and
> disassembled two <g>), so wait for the smart guys to confirm that.

I have installed these deflector plates while the emgine was in the car.
I cut them in half, slipped the pieces in their place and spot welded
them back together while holding them in place. Nasty job.

Another time I cut them in half too, then pop riveted an extension "lip"
on one half, and drilled holes ready for the pop rivets on the opposite
side, then slipped the halves in one at a time, and lined them up behind
the pushrod tubes and pop riveted them togehter.

Still no fun.

The easiest solution would be to remove rocker assembly and pushrods,
then cut the pushrod tubes in half so you can remove them... then
install the air deflector plates intact.. then put spring loaded pushrod
tubes in (good quality, not those cheap nylon tubes) and put the
pushrods back, as well as the rocker assembly. Two extra bonuses come
from this: You get to fix leaking pushrod tube seals, and you get to
adjust your valves. (yes, at least check teh clearances again)

Jan
Reply to this Message
Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott - 29 Dec 2003 16:15 GMT
>>>> and how about this:
>>>> http://tinyurl.com/37ks6
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
> The easiest solution would be to remove rocker assembly and pushrods,
> then cut the pushrod tubes in half so you can remove them...

You're kidding?

> then
> install the air deflector plates intact.. then put spring loaded pushrod
> tubes in (good quality, not those cheap nylon tubes) and put the
> pushrods back, as well as the rocker assembly.

Jeepers.

> Two extra bonuses come
> from this: You get to fix leaking pushrod tube seals, and you get to
> adjust your valves. (yes, at least check teh clearances again)

Crikey. How about I take a bunch of photos all around the engine, top
and bottom, fore and aft, while it is in the bus and you experts look at
them and tell me what parts appear to be missing? It's one thing for me
to even contemplate pulling the engine to stuff the flaps in, it's quite
another for me to pull off heads, cut tubes, and other major surgery.

Signature

Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
71 VW Type 2 -- the Wonderbus (AKA the Saunabus in summer)

Reply to this Message
Chris Perdue - 29 Dec 2003 18:30 GMT
>From: "Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott"

>Crikey. How about I take a bunch of photos all around the engine, top
>and bottom, fore and aft, while it is in the bus and you experts look at
>them and tell me what parts appear to be missing?

not a bad idea...snap to it...LOL

It's one thing for me
>to even contemplate pulling the engine to stuff the flaps in, it's quite
>another for me to pull off heads, cut tubes, and other major surgery.

if you can pull the engine(childs play) you can do the *minor* surgery that was
suggested....it really is *easier* than it sounds...

-------------------
Chris Perdue
*All opinions are those of the author of this post*
"Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug"
http://hometown.aol.com/bugninva/MAINPAGE.html
to reply take your PANTS off
Reply to this Message
Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott - 29 Dec 2003 20:47 GMT
>>From: "Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott"
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> if you can pull the engine(childs play) you can do the *minor* surgery that was
> suggested....it really is *easier* than it sounds...

Friggin' well better be. If it's not, I'll hunt you guys down and whip
you with the old veeblefetzer belt.

Signature

Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
71 VW Type 2 -- the Wonderbus (AKA the Saunabus in summer)

Reply to this Message
Chris Perdue - 29 Dec 2003 20:59 GMT
>From: "Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott"

>..it really is *easier* than it sounds...
>
>Friggin' well better be. If it's not, I'll hunt you guys down and whip
>you with the old veeblefetzer belt.

LOL...Mike, don't worry....you *can* do it...

-------------------
Chris Perdue
*All opinions are those of the author of this post*
"Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug"
http://hometown.aol.com/bugninva/MAINPAGE.html
to reply take your PANTS off
Reply to this Message
Ilambert - 29 Dec 2003 21:09 GMT
> >From: "Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott"
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> http://hometown.aol.com/bugninva/MAINPAGE.html
> to reply take your PANTS off
Reply to this Message
Max Welton - 30 Dec 2003 00:23 GMT
> Friggin' well better be. If it's not, I'll hunt you guys down and whip
> you with the old veeblefetzer belt.

... but THAT trick never works!

Here's some close-ups of the leetle clips that hold the tie-bars on the
shutter arms, 3 per side.

http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-007F.JPG
http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-008F.JPG
http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-009F.JPG

Max
Reply to this Message
Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott - 30 Dec 2003 02:49 GMT
>> Friggin' well better be. If it's not, I'll hunt you guys down and
>> whip you with the old veeblefetzer belt.
>
> ... but THAT trick never works!

Right, Chief. We'll need to talk about this privately. Lower the Cone of
Silence.

> Here's some close-ups of the leetle clips that hold the tie-bars on
> the shutter arms, 3 per side.
>
> http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-007F.JPG 
> http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-008F.JPG 
> http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-009F.JPG

Look like the Fahnstock clips that were commonly used for breadboarding
electronic projects in my boyhood.

Okay, so what I am seeing is that there are about 8,234 bits and pieces,
some smaller than a grain of rice, required to get the cooling working.

Signature

Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
71 VW Type 2 -- the Wonderbus (AKA the Saunabus in summer)

Reply to this Message
Max Welton - 30 Dec 2003 03:48 GMT
>>> Friggin' well better be. If it's not, I'll hunt you guys down and
>>> whip you with the old veeblefetzer belt.
[quoted text clipped - 16 lines]
> Okay, so what I am seeing is that there are about 8,234 bits and pieces,
> some smaller than a grain of rice, required to get the cooling working.

Hey now. Them specks are perfectly servicable dirt. And you counted them.
;-)

That last shot was taken by leaning over the engine's right "shoulder"
from the rear and shooting down. So you are seeing the forward side of the
shroud from above.

http://63.230.74.177/misc/flaps/MVC-009Fa.JPG

In the highlighted area are the control rods of the right-side shutter
assembly. Also visible (extending off towards the left) is my home made
aluminum tie-bar.

Max
Reply to this Message
Raymond T. Lowe - 30 Dec 2003 16:00 GMT
"Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott"
<j.michael.elliottAT@REMOVETHEOBVIOUSadelphiaDOT.net> wrote in message

> Look like the Fahnstock clips that were commonly used for breadboarding
> electronic projects in my boyhood.
>
> Okay, so what I am seeing is that there are about 8,234 bits and pieces,
> some smaller than a grain of rice, required to get the cooling working.

I bought those clips new from Gene Berg last year and was
amazed at how strong they are.  They carry some of the hard to
find stuff such as these clips, the spring, the little fastening hardware
for the thermostat rod.  It's worth it to do the job right.

RT
Reply to this Message
Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott - 31 Dec 2003 17:29 GMT
> "Mike Rocket J. Squirrel Elliott"
> <j.michael.elliottAT@REMOVETHEOBVIOUSadelphiaDOT.net> wrote in message
[quoted text clipped - 9 lines]
> find stuff such as these clips, the spring, the little fastening hardware
> for the thermostat rod.  It's worth it to do the job right.

This I believe. The trick, I think, will be for me to come up with an
accurate and comprehensive shopping list of the correct parts for my
model/year, while remembering that this is not the original engine (it's
a new 1776) so I can have everything on hand before pulling the engine.
I understand that there is some degree of variability on some of the parts.

Is there a consensus on whether creating such a list before disassembly
is practical enough to consider going that way? Or so unlikely to be
entirely accurate that I had just better find a temporary car to use
while the parts I guessed wrong on are replaced with the correct parts?

Signature

Mike "Rocket J Squirrel" Elliott
71 VW Type 2 -- the Wonderbus (AKA the Saunabus in summer)

Reply to this Message
Michael Kelly - 31 Dec 2003 22:46 GMT
> This I believe. The trick, I think, will be for me to come up with an
> accurate and comprehensive shopping list of the correct parts for my
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> entirely accurate that I had just better find a temporary car to use
> while the parts I guessed wrong on are replaced with the correct parts?

    I too am waiting to see the parts list, as Clayton does not have his
thermostat or cooling flaps either.
Reply to this Message
Max Welton - 31 Dec 2003 23:26 GMT
>> This I believe. The trick, I think, will be for me to come up with an
>> accurate and comprehensive shopping list of the correct parts for my
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>     I too am waiting to see the parts list, as Clayton does not have his
> thermostat or cooling flaps either.

The good news is that on drop-day, you only need the parts that the engine
has to be out for. Once the flaps themselves are in, the thermostat (for
example) can be added later.

Mike, if you could take a comprehensive set of digital pictures, I'll bet
we could make that list.

Max
Reply to this Message
Ilambert - 31 Dec 2003 23:42 GMT
Hi.See what you can score at a boneyard.A complete assembly will have all
the PIA hardware and you can then swap out .The down side is you could wind
up with a bunch of "extra" parts,too good to chuck .Ask how I know.Steve

> >> This I believe. The trick, I think, will be for me to come up with an
> >> accurate and comprehensive shopping list of the correct parts for my
[quoted text clipped - 19 lines]
>
> Max
Reply to this Message
Eduardo Kaftanski - 29 Dec 2003 15:13 GMT
>BTW, Mike .... to the best of my knowledge, these parts, the under cylinder
>deflectors .... on a T1 engine, cannot be installed without removing the
>head, pushrods, pushrod tubes, etc. They are vitally important parts and
>need to be in place.

You are not a chilean mechanic :) my engine had one of those with the
legs cut out, and wired to one of the head studs...

Signature

Eduardo Kaftanski     | To put a pipe in byte mode,
e@nn.cl               | type PIPE_TYPE_BYTE.
http://e.nn.cl        | (from the Visual C++ help file.)

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