My daughter just had her 53,000 mile 2003 1.8T Jetta repaired (for a
number of issues). They said there were codes for misfires in all four
cylinders and that the oxygen sensor needed to be replaced (I assume it
was the front one). The car has had an issue with trying to stall for
maybe 30-60 seconds after startup.
If the oxygen sensor was bad, I'm guessing that it was killed by
something upstream like whatever is causing the misfires.
Anybody got an idea for "most likely" causes of misfires and startup
stalling issues in the 1.8T? I'm thinking coils or MAF sensor.
By the way, this is not a dealer service department, but it deals
primarily with German cars so the techs are probably fairly
knowledgeable. However, I suspect they are not as familiar with "most
likely" causes as dealer techs are. Unfortunately the local VW dealer
service department is predatory and untrustworthy.
Thanks,
Bill
Jim Behning - 10 Jun 2008 00:50 GMT
>My daughter just had her 53,000 mile 2003 1.8T Jetta repaired (for a
>number of issues). They said there were codes for misfires in all four
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>
>Bill
Bad MAF is not going to cause misfires says this shade tree mechanic.
Temic seems to be a prefered coil. Beru least liked.
Bad coils is a rather well known issue with VWs I would have thought
most cars had been fixed by now.
http://www.theautochannel.com/news/2003/02/04/154251.html
http://www.mylemon.com/VW_18T.php
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1568254
http://www.gti-vr6.net/library/engine/beware_Beru_coil_packs.html
Craig - 10 Jun 2008 01:01 GMT
Bad mas air flow sensors can absolutely cause misfires by causing the system
to run too lean. It is also likely to cause misfires on all 4 cylinders as
it affects all of them. MAF sensors are pretty common but not for this
issue. I have also seen faulty Coolant Temp sensors cause this issue.
Especially on cold startup first thing in the morning. What color is the
coolant temp sensor in her car??? If its the black sensor I would recommend
replacing it as they are well known to cause many problems & have been
changed to a newer green sensor.
I would also recommend checking all the vacuum/PCV hoses under the front of
the intake manifold as they are prone to oil contamination which causes them
to go soft & split. These cause air leaks which also can cause misfires on
all cylinders until they get bad enough to cause an adaptation code.
Considering you had misfire codes for all 4 cylinders you need to look at
something that affects all the cylinders rather than things like coils that
usually affect on single cylinders.
Hope this helps.
Craig
>>My daughter just had her 53,000 mile 2003 1.8T Jetta repaired (for a
>>number of issues). They said there were codes for misfires in all four
[quoted text clipped - 27 lines]
> http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1568254
> http://www.gti-vr6.net/library/engine/beware_Beru_coil_packs.html
dave AKA vwdoc1 - 10 Jun 2008 02:12 GMT
I agree with Craig.
Since you have the 1.8t (1.8-liter turbocharged) engine each spark plug
should have its own coil. Some of the newer engines will have coils that
might pop up off of the plugs creating a misfire. People have devised ways
to secure these coils from popping up.
The Coolant Temperature Sensor can create a rich mixture so that needs to be
checked out. It might not even throw a DTC either.
Someone needs to plug into the computer to see what is happening there.
Guessing can be very costly!!!
Other things could be visually checked such as the color and level of the
engine oil. The color of the spark plug electrodes. Any cracked or loose
vacuum hoses/connections...........etc.
IF the CTS is bad and has not been changed then it could cause the 02 sensor
to go out again! 8^)
Also using the correct spark plugs will help the performance of this
turbocharged engine. BOSCH Plats are NOT the ones, but this is JMHO. I
think the preferred ones for performance will have 3 side electrodes.

Signature
later,
dave
(One out of many daves)
> Bad mas air flow sensors can absolutely cause misfires by causing the
> system to run too lean. It is also likely to cause misfires on all 4
[quoted text clipped - 50 lines]
>> http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=1568254
>> http://www.gti-vr6.net/library/engine/beware_Beru_coil_packs.html
William Maslin - 13 Jun 2008 00:18 GMT
> I agree with Craig.
> Since you have the 1.8t (1.8-liter turbocharged) engine each spark plug
[quoted text clipped - 14 lines]
> turbocharged engine. BOSCH Plats are NOT the ones, but this is JMHO. I
> think the preferred ones for performance will have 3 side electrodes.
The plugs were replaced at 40K at a VW dealer so they should be the
correct plugs. I emailed her to ask which coolant sensor they replaced.
It might have been the reservoir sensor.
BIll
Craig - 13 Jun 2008 01:16 GMT
If it was due to the colant light flashing when cold then they replaced the
coolant resevoir. This is VERY common. You should check the coolant sensor
yourseld. Its on the drivers side of the head in the top of the coolant
flang. That year car could still have the black sensor.
>> I agree with Craig.
>> Since you have the 1.8t (1.8-liter turbocharged) engine each spark plug
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
>
> BIll
William Maslin - 17 Jun 2008 23:13 GMT
> If it was due to the colant light flashing when cold then they replaced the
> coolant resevoir. This is VERY common. You should check the coolant sensor
> yourseld. Its on the drivers side of the head in the top of the coolant
> flang. That year car could still have the black sensor.\
Unfortunately, she lives 580 miles away. However, our son lives out
there close to her and I'll have him check it.
Thanks!
> >> I agree with Craig.
> >> Since you have the 1.8t (1.8-liter turbocharged) engine each spark plug
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> >
> > BIll
William Maslin - 13 Jun 2008 00:10 GMT
> Bad mas air flow sensors can absolutely cause misfires by causing the system
> to run too lean. It is also likely to cause misfires on all 4 cylinders as
[quoted text clipped - 15 lines]
>
> Hope this helps.
Well, in fact the PCV hose is split (the plastic one) and the car has
the temp light off and on for the past couple months. However the temp
gauge was always OK and the coolanat level in the reservoir was OK.
Nevertheless, the tech replaced a coolant sensor. I don't know whether
he replaced the actual engine coolant sensor or the sensor in the
coolant reservoir. Considering that the car is a 2003 I'm assuming it
has the green sensor as our 2002 Passat had the green sensor. But I
don't know for sure.
William Maslin - 13 Jun 2008 00:05 GMT
> >My daughter just had her 53,000 mile 2003 1.8T Jetta repaired (for a
> >number of issues). They said there were codes for misfires in all four
[quoted text clipped - 22 lines]
> Bad coils is a rather well known issue with VWs I would have thought
> most cars had been fixed by now.
You are correct. However, even the improved coils seem to be
troublesome. For example, our 2002 Passat had all four coils replaced
back in 2002 or 2003 when the big coil disaster occurred. However, it
later developed (around 55K miles) subtle misfire problems which
Woodchuck correctly diagnosed as two bad coils and which took four trips
to the dealer before they figured it out.
Lost In Space/Woodchuck - 10 Jun 2008 02:55 GMT
VW had a flash for the ECU for misfire faults. The only way to know if the
engine gets it requires a visit to the dealer to check the software version.
VW should pay for the flash if there are misfire faults stored. So the next
time the MIL light comes on and the engine is misssing vist your deaaaaaaler
before the MIL turns off.
Craig - 10 Jun 2008 03:32 GMT
If I remember correctly that software flash was a TSB & not a recall so if
the car is out of warranty it won't be covered.
> VW had a flash for the ECU for misfire faults. The only way to know if the
> engine gets it requires a visit to the dealer to check the software
> version. VW should pay for the flash if there are misfire faults stored.
> So the next time the MIL light comes on and the engine is misssing vist
> your deaaaaaaler before the MIL turns off.
Lost In Space/Woodchuck - 10 Jun 2008 23:33 GMT
TSB yes, but misfire faults are related to the emission warranty. And since
the ECU is covered for 8yr/80,000 miles so is the flash.
> If I remember correctly that software flash was a TSB & not a recall so if
> the car is out of warranty it won't be covered.
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>> So the next time the MIL light comes on and the engine is misssing vist
>> your deaaaaaaler before the MIL turns off.
William Maslin - 13 Jun 2008 00:22 GMT
> VW had a flash for the ECU for misfire faults. The only way to know if the
> engine gets it requires a visit to the dealer to check the software version.
> VW should pay for the flash if there are misfire faults stored. So the next
> time the MIL light comes on and the engine is misssing vist your deaaaaaaler
> before the MIL turns off.
The car always had the official VW service done at the proper intervals
at a VW dealer so I'm pretty sure the ecu was flashed long ago.
Especially since it had cold start problems back when it was new.
Unless you are referring to a more recent flash.
I agree that MIL light problems warrant a visit to a competent VW
mechanic.
Thanks,
Bill
Tom's VR6 - 10 Jun 2008 05:04 GMT
In rec.autos.makers.vw.watercooled, William Maslin wrote:
>Anybody got an idea for "most likely" causes of misfires and startup
>stalling issues in the 1.8T? I'm thinking coils or MAF sensor.
All of the other posts offer good info. In addition, I would look at
the engine in the *dark* as it is running and look for arcing on
wires or coil. It is an easy cheap diagnosis method, tho it may be
hard to find good darkness this time of year.
If the misfiring is not occurring as you check, you could try
creating a light mist of water to encourage potential arcing.
So I am not saying arcing is the probable cause. I am saying it is
fairly simple to look for.
Lost In Space/Woodchuck - 10 Jun 2008 23:34 GMT
coil over plug coils, thus can't see secondary voltage.
> In rec.autos.makers.vw.watercooled, William Maslin wrote:
>
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> So I am not saying arcing is the probable cause. I am saying it is
> fairly simple to look for.
Madesio - 10 Jun 2008 08:50 GMT
>My daughter just had her 53,000 mile 2003 1.8T Jetta repaired (for a
>number of issues). They said there were codes for misfires in all four
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
>If the oxygen sensor was bad, I'm guessing that it was killed by
>something upstream like whatever is causing the misfires.
The oxygen sensor may not be in need of replacement at all. It's very
likely that it's just been fouled sub sequentially by what has been
occurring in the cylinders.
>Anybody got an idea for "most likely" causes of misfires and startup
>stalling issues in the 1.8T? I'm thinking coils or MAF sensor.
Since I don't suspect all 4 coils suddenly went bad at once, I'd be
investigating the MAF sensor.
>By the way, this is not a dealer service department, but it deals
>primarily with German cars so the techs are probably fairly
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>
>Bill