Re: Re: pulling HEAVY, now what?
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Re: Re: pulling HEAVY, now what?
| Max Dodge | 28 May 2007 03:04 |
>> The 48RE is plenty strong enough to deal with a light "chipping" > > what about "light" chipping while towing 16,000#? what do you consider > "light"? You already have 610, going beyond 720-750 ftlbs would be more than "light".
>> advanced stages of "chipping" are not compatible with towing. > > i dont understand that. please explain. Due to the huge amounts of fuel pushed by the higher stages of the chips, you risk a melt down to internal componants because of load and EGT temps that do not stay at acceptable levels. These levels work fine if the engine can move enough air to keep the "cool" air flowing, thus lowering EGT's. But slow the RPM's, and EGT's go up, and risk of catastrophic failure follows. You'll find that talking with the more reputable purveyors of these products can steer you to thier model of choice for towing, rather than drag racing. Tom Lawarence has a twin turbo setup that is fairly radical, but IIRC, could be compatible with towing. If and when he chimes in, he'd be the guy to talk to, since I'm sure he did a bunch of research.
>> dropping to 4.10 or 4.30 gears would help towing the trailer. > > what ratio do you think would be better? 4.10, 4.30, or 4.56? what about > a torque splitter, any recommendations there? > thanks, Personally, I'd go with the 4.10's or 4.30's. 4.56 would be overkill and a PITA when not pulling the trailer. The PCM should be able to be flashed to deal with the tire diameter and gear ratio combination, so the speedo will be correct. The decisive factor in choosing the gears would be the RPM you were turning going up the hills, I'd think with the ISBe, you would want to be in the 1900-2300 range. The rest is math. Keep one thing in mind though... more gear isn't necessarily going to make you faster up the hill, but it will make it easier for the engine, and perhaps you'll gain some MPH in the process. The only way to be sure you will go faster up a hill is to add power.
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| Nathan W. Collier | 27 May 2007 20:38 |
> The 48RE is plenty strong enough to deal with a light "chipping" what about "light" chipping while towing 16,000#? what do you consider "light"?
> advanced stages of "chipping" are not compatible with towing. i dont understand that. please explain.
> dropping to 4.10 or 4.30 gears would help towing the trailer. what ratio do you think would be better? 4.10, 4.30, or 4.56? what about a torque splitter, any recommendations there? thanks,
 Signature Nathan In Montana http://ConcealedCarryForum.com http://1911Talk.com http://GlockCarry.com http://HiPowerTalk.com
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| Max Dodge | 27 May 2007 20:05 |
> Moving it and moving it effectly is a different matter and you need > more that 3.73 gears to move a GCWR of around 12 ton effectively > through mountains even with a CTD. That is why they have made > different axle ratios for many many years. YOu can move a lot of > weight with eninge a old 6 cylinder in a dump truck...... Blah blah blah.....
Shut the f.ck up. I never disagreed with your previous statement, yet you have a need to attack my advice.
Here's where the bear sh.ts in the woods:
The 48RE is plenty strong enough to deal with a light "chipping" since advanced stages of "chipping" are not compatible with towing. Secondly, yes, dropping to 4.10 or 4.30 gears would help towing the trailer. However, your extraneous statements about dump trucks, 6 cylinders, and fuel choices have nothing to do with the question at hand. Lastly, my suggestion when towing is ALWAYS to have the largest vehicle reasonable in front of the load. While the Ram is fully capable and within its weight ratings to tow 16k lbs, the wind effect on the side of that monster trailer might be better handled by the Navistar "pickup", which weighs in at significantly more than the Ram.
> All > things being equal you will get about 11 to 12% more pulling power in > every gear with 4.10's Bullshit. Simple math puts it at 10%. Try it sometime.
> There are some out there though that equate a CTD, PS or > Dmax to a OTR engine but it is not and they will suffer when run at > OTR HP power levels for extended periods of time. The Cummins B series is in fact a medium duty engine, and thus superior to the light duty PSD to DMax in design of block etc. The Cummins B series has long been able to stand up well to ftlb ratings at 1000 ftlbs or so, and hp ratings of over 500hp. No one is suggesting that Nate go to these levels, although Tom L. drives every day at that level of power, and has not one single problem with the diesel.
I suggest you learn more about the Cummins before dispensing advice about its capabilities.
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>>Tom Lawrence probably has the best idea on what ya need to do here. IMO, >>that trailer needs something more like the Navistar "pickup" just for the [quoted text clipped - 31 lines] > ----------------- > TheSnoMan.com |
| SnoMan | 27 May 2007 14:41 |
>Tom Lawrence probably has the best idea on what ya need to do here. IMO, >that trailer needs something more like the Navistar "pickup" just for the >weight that truck would bring. However, the Dodge is more than able to move >it. Moving it and moving it effectly is a different matter and you need more that 3.73 gears to move a GCWR of around 12 ton effectively through mountains even with a CTD. That is why they have made different axle ratios for many many years. YOu can move a lot of weight with eninge a old 6 cylinder in a dump truck if you have the right gears. Your drive axles are the strongest reduction units in your truck and when geared properly can exert a lot of force. All things being equal you will get about 11 to 12% more pulling power in every gear with 4.10's with no added engine or tranny strain like you get from chipping it to gain same boost in towwing power. There is a reason that 400 HP OTR rigs have 900 cu inch and bigger engines so they do not have to be "chipped" and can last a very long time even at max power. There are some out there though that equate a CTD, PS or Dmax to a OTR engine but it is not and they will suffer when run at OTR HP power levels for extended periods of time. This is not a Dodge, Ford, GM thing but rather a common sense thing and it requires regearing for a proper long term solution. It is lot different to tow in rockies than it is in the flat lands and what may work in the flats does not always work in mountains but some seem to forget that. How I would configure a low altitude flat land tower vs one that is at high altitude and in mountains is a completely different matter. Detriot does not tell you this either because it might hurt sales image of top end trucks. If you elect to chip it to solve problem, save some money for when stock tranny gives up the ghost on a long hard pull. It is not a bad tranny but it will suffer for boosted torque on long hard pulls and shorten its life. Many avid "chippers" do not even consider this. Manuals are a little more tolerant of this. ----------------- TheSnoMan.com
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| Max Dodge | 27 May 2007 12:56 |
Tom Lawrence probably has the best idea on what ya need to do here. IMO, that trailer needs something more like the Navistar "pickup" just for the weight that truck would bring. However, the Dodge is more than able to move it.
 Signature Max
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"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order." -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
> please see http://inlinediesel.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=617 and give > me your feedback and advice. > thanks, |
| Nathan W. Collier | 27 May 2007 07:25 |
please see http://inlinediesel.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=617 and give me your feedback and advice. thanks,
 Signature Nathan In Montana http://ConcealedCarryForum.com http://1911Talk.com http://GlockCarry.com http://HiPowerTalk.com
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