then you either have a leak [which should be obvious somewhere - you
need to inspect properly] or you have a blown gasket.  pressure tests
don't necessarily work for diagnosing gaskets unless the vehicle is at
full operating temperature.  and even then...  observing bubbles in the
coolant is the only sure-fire way of knowing.

bottom line, it's pointless spending money on the belt until you have a
correct diagnosis.

also, for repair economics, given the money that some repair shops
charge for head gasket work, it may be more economic to replace the
whole engine.  you can buy a jdm import for a few hundred bucks and
replacement time is way lower than the time necessary to strip, clean,
prep and reassemble a motor for a gasket.  and there's the problem of
repair shops using abrasives in preparation witch will in due course,
cause the car to burn oil.  and there's the problem of many places
insisting on skimming your head, even if it doesn't need it.

    I know. On the one hand it may be nothing. On the other it could be
engine-threatening. The dealer told us in essesnce, that we can't afford
a new gasket - didn't even quote a price. And we wonder why cars aren't
maintained like they used to be...

   The reservoir was empty, or virtually so, both times.

On 2/20/08 6:20 AM, in article gWUuj.16648$FK2.1405@trndny08,

Seems like you're jumping the gun a little bit here.  How low was it in the
reservoir?  When you say reservoir do you just mean the overflow tank, or
the radiator?  

In normal use, the system will settle out to where the overflow tank sits at
the "min" mark when the engine has cooled & the level will rise to around
the "max" mark when the engine is hot & has been running for a while.

I certainly would not spend money replacing a head gasket that has not even
been diagnosed.  There is not enough info here to even say for sure that
there is a problem.

    The procedure in the Honda manual online in the UK is to just use a
hand pump-operated pressurizer with guage, and see if the pressure drops
in the cooling system or cap. I don't know which they used at the shop...

   Good point.

    What I'm going to do, assuming I can even afford the cost of a new
gasket done by the dealer, is to tell them to look for leaks, especially
at the water pump. If they find none, I'll have them replace the head
gasket. Shouldn't they install the new timing belt and water pump for no
extra labor charge (they will be providing the parts, not me) when they
do the gasket? I'm also having the front oil seals replaced as a
preventive measure. Thanks for your response. If you could answer this
post before this evening, when I drop it off, I'd appreciate it greatly.

The pressure test needs to be performed in two places.
1) the cooling system, and
2) the combusion chambers.

the first is done in conjuction with the introduction of UV dye to the
coolant, this being detected on the outside with a black light. The
second consists of shop air being blown into each combustion chamber,
then the rad filler neck being then inspected for bubbles.

There is a third test that uses special paper test strips dipped into
the rad filler neck. These change color in the presence of combustion
gases in the coolant.

Your problem is NOT the rad cap. If it were, the reservoir would be
FULL.

There is also the possibility of a worn water pump. In that case the
coolant would drip down the block under the timing belt cover and may
not be obvious. Findinig that leak means carefully inspecting the crank
pulley area.

Do not put this off. You WILL damage your engine, possibly badly. You're
supposed to check your coolant level every time you open the hood, or at
least once a week.

   I took the car to a local shop today. They do free pressure tests (I
gave them $20 anyway). No leaks, including the cap. Unless I'm missing
something, it has to be the #@!@# head gasket, right? Assuming it's
going straight to the exhaust and not burning much, how safe is it to
leave it alone? Any suggestions?

   Good idea. I didn't realize that pressure leaks were such a common
problem. I may have the system pressure-tested if replacing the cap
doesn't work. Thanks.

Hi,
First I'd replace the rad. cap and see.

When I had the oil changed in November, I was told they had to add
"quite a bit" of coolant to the reservoir. Since the car came from NM,
with a spotty service record, I had hoped that it was simply not topped
off ever. Now, three months later, with only moderate driving, I see the
reservoir is virtually empty again. I don't see excessive white smoke in
the exhaust, or smell antifreeze in it - although I haven't sniffed it
specifically for that, yet. The oil looks fine. I don't smell coolant
inside the car, either. It would be hard to spot a slow drip in this wet
Winter weather. How common are internal head gasket leaks in this
engine, as opposed to slow leaks in the reservoirs?